I'm Annoyed By /NIN

[Telera]

Re: I'm Annoyed By /NIN

By intarwob magic!

No really, about the whole 'I'm starting to hate this game because people want you to have this, this, and this sub too and I hate <insertjob> too much to ever level it' is what kept me from ever leveling Blue Mage and Dancer.

I refuse to not have all the good subs for a job, so in the end, I simply didn't level either one, because I hate the fuck out of Ninja. Not because it's popular or whatnot, I simply couldn't stand to level it. Didn't enjoy it at all, and I couldn't even force myself to sit through 37 levels of it.

And yeah, that started to weigh in on my 'DONE!' *hits quit button* decision at one point. But I can only blame myself for that really. Because I want to have the subs I need, but sometimes I hated them too much to even level them.

OCD Catch 22'd myself. Ftw!

[Kittyneko]

Re: I'm Annoyed By /NIN

Well, in a short reply to that..
I've already said this a little while ago in a post, after a while of playing ffxi it really doesn't matter to me anymore if I have to level a certain sub for a job or not. Levelling to 37 becomes only a tiny effort considering everything else..

That doesn't apply for new players ofcourse, but it might help thinking about it for a better view of the "long run?"

[LadyKiKi]

Re: I'm Annoyed By /NIN

After reading the topic I felt like I was in 2005 again.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: I'm Annoyed By /NIN

You know, there's usually a subconscious motive for ranting against /NIN.

They just don't want to spend the gil to level it.

It pretty much boils down to that hidden agenda for the majority that complain about its use. Its a consumable job, people hate consumable jobs because they're cheap. Here's the irony - /NIN is the favorite subjob of cheap players.

I see the purpose and the point of /NIN for some jobs, its just when people tell me to go /NIN without a valid reason I get a bit ticked off.

Seeking as COR/RNG:

"Hey can you sub /NIN?"
"Am I pulling?"
"No, we have a BRD?"
"Then why sub /NIN?"

Then I count to ten and watch thier brain implode. I won't sub /NIN unless I'm placed in a situation that needs it. Meritpo Arrowburn on RNG? Sure. BC on COR? OK. Soloing on BLU or DNC? Perfect. Party where I'm not pulling? No, I won't sub /NIN, something is wrong with the melee if I pull hate. If I do happen to go Zerg Crazy, trust me, it will die.

[Kittyneko]

Re: I'm Annoyed By /NIN

After reading the topic I felt like I was in 2005 again.

Note that you might have started around 2005. For the Original Poster it's 2005.

If that makes any sense. ><

2005 was a bad year on ffxi. Especially near the end.

[Sevv]

Re: I'm Annoyed By /NIN

Long post inc for those Tl;Dr people just skip and kick the taru on the way out.

Ok I know I am going to get flamed by a lot of NIN lovers for what I am about to say but I honestly dont care, just thought I would say my two cents. 1) I am tired of everything is this game being fricken /NIN I dont want NIN I dont want to go /NIN all the jobs I want. (BLU,DRK,RDM.) all have to be fricken /NIN. (or so I heard) I am sorry but one job cant make you possibly god, there are only two good things that I think /NIN offers that is shadows, and duel wield basides that I dont really see the point in it. I think /NIN is so fricken over used and I am tired of everyone telling me to fricken go /NIN. It might be easier but I want a fricken challenge I dont want to be fricken god. So to all the people that hate me for not liking /NIN go try something else, and if you die because you dont know how to play dont be a wimp and go /NIN just because it makes it safer for you. Ok well I am done venting now. (yell at me come on I know you want to!)

A few things just to clear up for you, on the three jobs you pointed out.

Blue Mage: Yes ninja sub is very useful to this job. In meripos many people will want you /nin for the damage reduction, tho sub thief is very powerful.

Dark Knight: Unless you have a Ridill with axe and sword merits please do not sub ninja. Ever since Samurai was update there should never be a reason to not sub samurai. You just need to learn how balance out seigan and hasso.

Red Mage: Never sub ninja unless you are planning to solo something hard.

/NIN is a solo subjob, and a meripo subjob for certain melee. It makes things easier on the entire party, or while solo allows you to take on mobs you couldn't take on otherwise. It's a good thing.

And if someone dies doing something, and then goes to sub /NIN and succeeds, it isn't because they were being a wimp. It's because they realized that, hey, here is a really effective tactic. What kind of moron would pass up a really effective tactic?

^- This

I'm not I am running around WG looking for a party a few peopl examine me and go hey why are you not /NIN for? Then I ask advice to my LSs they say go /NIN on RDM. Then other friends, say go /NIN I am tired of hearing about /NIN. There are other good SJ that can be used with RDM or any other job basides /NIN. All the people on my server ever talk about is fricken how great /NIN is, thats all I ever hear out of anyones mouth. Its making me start to dislike FFXI because I dont want to have to use it, even if for soling reasons.

I also played FFXI 5 years ago, and I was a NIN and I hated the job so fricken much I only did it because of my THF at the time, I dont want to have to level the damn thing. I still don't see, and people still wont fricken tell me what is so great about /NIN

Also, if its popular, then why aren't you doing the popular things that people do these days? Why didnt you do what the popular kids at school did? Just because its popular doesn't make it the only useful SJ. It also doesn't mean it is good for eveything. I don't like following the crowed, never have and I wont start by going /NIN either.

Your linkshell needs to learn a bit more about FFXI, not a flame just being blunt.

Also you never have to use ninja, if it ever becomes a major problem on you can always do what I did to level my dragoon during the LOLDRG days, I simply made my parties and was able to level my drg to 75 in about a months time (mainly because I hurt and out of work due to my injuries, but you get the point).

It is popular due to the simple fact it is one of the most effective sub jobs in the game for the majority of the damage dealers. It is also a major sub job for paladin tanking.

I have to agree.... there is an over dependence on /NIN if they would introduce another job with dual wield it would stop atleast half of the people.

And alot of those so called "tactics" are really sad..... I hate all the "hey lets just nuke it to death with 6 BLM or SMN" thats not a tactic -.-

People sub ninja for the shadows mainly dual wield isn't even close to the main reason anyone subs ninja.

I'm calling people not even posting here on this forum morons. Because they are. I'm not going to be careful on that. Stop being ridiculous.

People in general are morons, I'll allow it!

How can you make a drama out of something again when it wasn't a drama in the first place?

This is the internetz murphie

Stuff

TELE!!! I miss you ; ;

[dirtyclown]

Re: I'm Annoyed By /NIN

2005 was a bad year on ffxi. Especially near the end.

2005 was pretty much the Dark Ages of FFXI.

Also, I support what Dave said about being too cheap to level Ninja. I know it needs to happen at some point, but I'm too lazy to go farming for all the gil I need and I'm too cheap IRL to buy it.

While we're talking about /Nin being annoying, I'd like to comment on something that eats at me. BLU/NIN post 60 in an exp PT where they aren't pulling. I've seen some BLU capable of wicked burst damage with /THF, so whenever I PT with a BLU/NIN I want to send them a tell saying "What the fuck is your problem?", but I keep my mouth shut and leave that sort of talk to the Bard who knows your job better than you. I just tank stuff and lol at the BLU's parses, knowing that they could be doing so much more, but they don't bother.

P.S. If there was some sort of update that ganked BLU/THF then my last 4 or so months of laughing like an idiot at 123 damage Death Scissors has been in vain. Here's hoping that my world won't get turned upside down. >.>

[Kailea]

Re: I'm Annoyed By /NIN

Well, in a short reply to that..
I've already said this a little while ago in a post, after a while of playing ffxi it really doesn't matter to me anymore if I have to level a certain sub for a job or not. Levelling to 37 becomes only a tiny effort considering everything else..

That doesn't apply for new players ofcourse, but it might help thinking about it for a better view of the "long run?"

thats why I have all my jobs at 37, that way I can sub what ever and when ever I need to.

like as DRG, I sub mainly BLU, but I place in my search comment that I can sub anything, you just have to ask, and normally I get asked to sub SAM, so I do ;p

[Kruxis]

Re: I'm Annoyed By /NIN

Also, Some people are forced to sub nin, not because they want to but because if they dont, they will be koed. Take myself for example, Main pald and nin, Full eminty merrits, now when i go play on my 75 monk, whats going to happen to me if i sub anything but nin? ....death....(party situation of course)
I like /nin so its not a problem for me.

[Telera]

Re: I'm Annoyed By /NIN

Levelling to 37 becomes only a tiny effort considering everything else..

Not for me. I've been over that, but my job almost always had me working during good partying hours. It would take me nearly a month to get any given job to 37, especially after farming and gear, etc. (Hell, even on LotRO, which is far more casual, it took me nearly a year to get my main to 50.... I'm just frickin' slow at leveling apparently.)

I've heard you can solo or duo ninja fairly easily to 37 and thought of giving it a try, but I just never did go in much for most melee jobs. BST, PUP, and DRG were exceptions because they were also pet jobs. It wasn't anything specific to Ninja; I was able to BCNM Ni, and I had quested Ichi, or vice versa, I forget how that goes. :p I had LS mates that could craft most of the tools for reduced prices, and I was able to fish up some of the more expensive ingredients. In fact, I had been working on fishing and woodworking just for my eventual turn to Ninja, to make it a little easier on myself.

It was simply that I didn't like it enough to pursue it, even to 37. Same with Thief. I probably would've done both eventually, had I not burned out, but those two jobs really are among my bottom two so far as enjoyment factor goes. War, Thf, Nin. </3

TELE!!! I miss you ; ;

NEVAR. I think I seriously lost most of my FFXI info this time anyway. :D

[Pteryx]

Re: I'm Annoyed By /NIN

OK, BLU/NIN I can see, but why the hell are people screaming at you to go DRK/NIN or RDM/NIN at your level? Here's a news flash for your "friends": There's this tactic in the game called "tanking". It means that one person tries to hold hate and survive so that no one else must sub /NIN just to survive. At low levels, this "tanking" thing is still pretty commonplace. If they've done a lot of meleeburns they may have forgotten about it.

Incidentally, DRK isn't a good job for a meleeburn due to actually having MP; as such, I wouldn't fault a DRK for refusing meleeburn invites and not having /NIN for them. (If you want to take them anyway, /SAM is a good substitute; not like you'll be casting spells in such a party anyway.)

What really floors me, though, is saying in an unqualified manner that one should go RDM/NIN. RDM/NIN is situational. It may be really powerful in those situations, but it's still situational. Bring it to any XP party or most other group situations and if you're not laughed at, I can only hope that this means that you could have brought, say, /BLU or something and not gotten laughed at either. -- Pteryx

[Losrase]

Re: I'm Annoyed By /NIN

I dont know why people say NIN is expensive. I leveled NIN on a budget. (Not counting Utsusemi: Ni because that is at level 37 when you stop leveling if you are using NIN for a subjob)

1) I did my research and found items that can be farmed. A great one is the level 15 Gassan Katana. Easy to obtain and the weapon can last from level 15 to 24 (this will cut costs because you only need to buy a off-hand Katana. A few other items i can think of are "Something"-Cez (Quest item that can be equiped at level 1 and is +2 Enmity) and Dash Sash +1 (event item that can be equiped at level 1 and is +2 Enmity). I wore these items full time, but I sure people will disagree and say the should be macro'd in.

2) Ask the enfeebler/healer of the PT to cast Paralyze and Slow (Saves on the Utsusemi). On a side note, I noticed (Leveling PLD, NIN, and THF to 37) people don't enfeeble at low level anymore. I actually had to ask the enfeebler/healer (WHM, RDM, or whoever used them as a subjob) to please use Paralyze, Slow, and Dia.

3) You dont really need the elemental wheel spells but they do help with enmity. I only time I had trouble with keeping hate without a few spells from elemental wheel was in the Yhoatar(sp?) Jungle. At level 30, a THF in the PT will remedy the problem in the Yhoatar(sp?) Jungle for the last few levels.

I sure people here will have more suggestions or a guide on how to level ninja on a budget.

[Bluecat]

Re: I'm Annoyed By /NIN

You know, there's usually a subconscious motive for ranting against /NIN.

They just don't want to spend the gil to level it.

It pretty much boils down to that hidden agenda for the majority that complain about its use. Its a consumable job, people hate consumable jobs because they're cheap. Here's the irony - /NIN is the favorite subjob of cheap players.

I see the purpose and the point of /NIN for some jobs, its just when people tell me to go /NIN without a valid reason I get a bit ticked off.

Seeking as COR/RNG:

"Hey can you sub /NIN?"
"Am I pulling?"
"No, we have a BRD?"
"Then why sub /NIN?"

Then I count to ten and watch thier brain implode. I won't sub /NIN unless I'm placed in a situation that needs it. Meritpo Arrowburn on RNG? Sure. BC on COR? OK. Soloing on BLU or DNC? Perfect. Party where I'm not pulling? No, I won't sub /NIN, something is wrong with the melee if I pull hate. If I do happen to go Zerg Crazy, trust me, it will die.

Ok 1) I dont care that it cost a lot, all jobs seem to cost a lot anyway. (I know nin does because of certain things it has to do) But I dont really care that it cost a lot. 2) I dont hate NIN as a main because people dont seem to really use it as a main that much. 3) Doesnt WHM or RDMs Blink spell work as good as "Shadows" do? 4) If people shutup about /NIN it wouldnt bother me, but every time I ask me LS, or random people try to help me they always talk about /NIN. 5) I only dislike it because they wont shutup, people treat it like its the only fricken subjob there is especaily to noobs like me.

I dont have a problem with leveling NIN at all that is not the issue, I would love to have NIN as a main! I just dont want to use it on every damn job in this game. I heard that /NIN was never even really heard of a few years back.

I have also noticed that a lot of stuff has turn to crap in FFXI in the last 5 years sense I have played. A lot of jobs seem to be miss used for what they really are ment for. One is RDM, it is treated like a whm, but its not. I just think that this game has turned into Lazyness.

In other words, a few years ago, you wouldnt be talking about using /NIN for anything or making RDM spam, Refresh and Cures.

What I am trying to say is, what did you guys do before /NIN and why cant that still work today? Also to me making it easier, especaily in a MMO is being lazy. I would try again and again and again to kill a NM or BCNM with OTHER subjobs untill it finally died. I would not care if I lost some exp, its not like you cant get it back. It might be a faster way to get the job done, but I honestly dont want it to be faster I want a challenge I honestly thought people would. But I honestly guess I was wrong, if you honestly have a problem with waisting MP and healing durring battle I think that is dumb. Even if someone is /NIN you would still have to heal durring battle. I have pted with people that are /NIN and they almost die all the time. So I honestly have no clue why everyone saying that is a good thing.

[Ellipses]

Re: I'm Annoyed By /NIN

3) Doesnt WHM or RDMs Blink spell work as good as "Shadows" do?

Nowhere near it. Blink gives you one shadow image that only has a chance to absorb an attack. Utsusemi: Ichi gives you three shadow images that are guaranteed to absorb an attack each, and Utsusemi: Ni gives you four. (There are attacks they won't absorb, but they're the same attacks, so Utsu is still better.)

4) If people shutup about /NIN it wouldnt bother me, but every time I ask me LS, or random people try to help me they always talk about /NIN. 5) I only dislike it because they wont shutup, people treat it like its the only fricken subjob there is especaily to noobs like me.

If it's really this widespread and you're not exaggerating for the sake of venting, your server and your linkshell are populated entirely by idiots.

In other words, a few years ago, you wouldnt be talking about using /NIN for anything or making RDM spam, Refresh and Cures.

As time goes on and changes are made to the game, people discover new strategies that work better. It's not laziness to use a strategy that's proven to be more effective than others. Completely dismissing /NIN ("wouldn't be talking about using /NIN for anything") is just as short-sighted and silly as trying to use it for everything (which is, in fact, stupid, but no one here is advocating that; just the morons in your LS, apparently). RDM is used as a main healer because it's effective in that role, and refusing to accept that role is just as short-sighted and silly as pigeonholing the job only into that role (something no one here advocates).

[nanatsu]

Re: I'm Annoyed By /NIN

Nowhere near it. Blink gives you one shadow image that only has a chance to absorb an attack.

Actually it gives you 2 shadows. Both have a random chance of blocking an attack, not guaranteed like Utsusemi.