Haste (Can I have it?) (Can you hear me?)

[Keon]

Recently I was in a pt in the level range 42-43 and camping at altepa. After a few mobs I noticed I was using Ichi more then usual and realised the whm wasn't using haste. I try addressing this by sending a /t to ask for haste. The whm answered that is cost too much mp... Cost to much MP???Had to sit back and laugh to myself.
I wear fuma's full time and marco in Quick Belt for shadow casting. That alone cuts my timer to 41 sec and with haste I believe the recast is down to 37 or 36 sec. Then I made the request public and the rest of the pt agreed. I had a few vets who wondered the same thing were very open about it.
This has happened more then once during the last few exp pt. Is this something to be expected with tanking as nin or am I just having a bad string of retarded whm. Your thoughts.

[Tsrwedge]

Re: Haste (Can I have it?) (Can you hear me?)

I would say poor WHMs.

In all fairness, Haste is a fairly expensive spell at that level (40MP, about 10% of total MP), and WHMs have just gotten it, so they're kind of trying to figure out how to best utilize it. That said, keeping it up on one or two people should not be a problem at all.

[Necropolis]

Re: Haste (Can I have it?) (Can you hear me?)

When I dinged 40 whm the haste cycle was something new that needed to be perfected. I found if I tried to haste all the melees that it would be MP draining, especially if I'm keeping a regen cycle up as well.

Many whm, or mages in generally, don't necessarily understand the value of spells like haste. And he probaly didn't think that hasting you would actually save him MP in cures.

After I got my haste cycle down I could actually rest a tick or two between cast and wasn't such a drain on the MP. I'd say your problem was a just a newer person in that level range with something new. Hopefully he'd get the hang of it after two long. But he should of certainly been told that haste is a requirement for nin tanks, and only helps the party be more effective if you haste all the melees (with the occasional except of mnks that will ripe hate of any tank).

[Nuriko]

Re: Haste (Can I have it?) (Can you hear me?)

One other thing, what other jobs did you have in the PT? I can certainly see the WHM doing all they can to cut back on MP usage if there's no refresh and nobody to take the healing burden to let them rest in a fight ... not hasting a NIN tank can be counterproductive, but sometimes something has to give, especially if the puller seems to think mages shouldn't need rest.

[Lmnop]

Re: Haste (Can I have it?) (Can you hear me?)

When dealing with mages who've just acquired haste, it's nice to keep it brief, friendly, and informative.

Tell them that it speeds up recasts and thus, saves mp by increasing damage mitigation (true with PLDs as much as NINs).

General rule of thumb: Haste the tank and screw the rest of the party. They pull enough hate anyway.

[Omni]

Re: Haste (Can I have it?) (Can you hear me?)

I would say poor WHMs.
In all fairness, Haste is a fairly expensive spell at that level (40MP, about 10% of total MP), and WHMs have just gotten it, so they're kind of trying to figure out how to best utilize it. That said, keeping it up on one or two people should not be a problem at all.

It is quite a lot of MP at the time but if anyone needs haste, its the nin.

with haste alone, it will bring his timer on utsusemi: ni from 45s to 37s and ichi from 30s to about 23s? (i forget). Think of all the more you'll be curing him when he keeps getting interrupted because both timers are down.

Especially with a nin tank, if you're a half decent nin, I dont think whm should be worrying too much about running out of MP.

[Necropolis]

Re: Haste (Can I have it?) (Can you hear me?)

Haste also prevents you from being slow'ed (in most cases, and I believe all cases in that level. Maybe spiders have a stronger slow?)

Which is also another plus. I keep all the DDs hasted in Dynamis, those damn demons and aoe slow is a pain. Easier to just haste everyone.

[Lmnop]

Re: Haste (Can I have it?) (Can you hear me?)

Spider slow is tier 2 -- overwrites Haste.

[Omni]

Re: Haste (Can I have it?) (Can you hear me?)

spider's web aoe slow is a pain. you will need to reapply like lmnop pointed out.
however, crawler's sticky thread does not overwrite and if you have haste up, you will get a no effect when they try to splooge over you.

[Taskmage]

Re: Haste (Can I have it?) (Can you hear me?)

It's worse than just reapplying vs spider slow. First you have to erase their slow effect away, then recast haste. Otherwise the Slow II effect will still override your Haste the same way Dia III keeps Bio II from taking effect.

Haste is very expensive. At 44 with no refresher in the party I have a very hard time maintaining hastes in addition to healing. It's worth it to speed up blink and flash timers, but a newbie whm might not notice the difference.

[Celeal]

Re: Haste (Can I have it?) (Can you hear me?)

It could be a less informed WHM. (Since he said Haste cost too much MP)

From my experience, there are chances for a tank parties with poor supports, like begging for erase, haste, silena... lack regen or debuff... nothing except cures only. The worst case is even with cures only, the healer still fails at his job. For NIN tank it is safer to assume Haste, Stun, Slow, Paralyze, Blind.... from party supports as bonus, instead of basic requirement.

[ItazuraNhomango]

Re: Haste (Can I have it?) (Can you hear me?)

Haste was difficult to keep up due to MP and time usage when I first obtained it. Try not to be too demanding on mages at those levels (WHM40, RDM48)--WHM's then are more used to be healers than buffers, and the RDM's already have the Refresh cycle to juggle. Explain to them that the NIN and the party would benefit greatly if NIN has Haste on, but don't bite their heads off if Haste drops for 5 seconds.

* * *

NIN's should pack evasion gear to fall back on at those levels anyway. After all, it is possible one could end up in a party with no one able/want to haste the NIN. (e.g. NIN, THF, DD, COR, SMN, and BRD--looks like a good party, but you'd probably want BRD to use Minuet and Madrigal/Prelude over March.)

* * *

Nothing annoyed my RDM more than incessant demands for Haste from someone not tanking. If you're not getting Haste and you're not the tank, it means I need the MP or time for other things.

Tanks get top priority on Haste. DD's performing skillchains second. If you're just spaming WS, you're dead last on my list. Also, RDM needs an MP buffer to toss out emergency Cures and to Refresh himself, unless he plans to use Convert really soon. None of my last 100 MP will go to your Haste, without a WHM in the party I can trust. (And, no, it's not my fault you/leader didn't invite a WHM because you/leader thought RDM should be main healing on top of enfeebing. And Refreshing. And Hasting.)

[Celeal]

Re: Haste (Can I have it?) (Can you hear me?)

Unless I am mistaken, March (song) does not affect spell recast timer.

[ItazuraNhomango]

Re: Haste (Can I have it?) (Can you hear me?)

Hmm. FFXIclopedia says it does. I've never tested it, so I don't know for sure.

[Necropolis]

Re: Haste (Can I have it?) (Can you hear me?)

March is a type of Enhancing Song used by Bards. It gives an effect similar to Haste to party members within range, reducing their attack delay and magic recast timers. (Refer to the Haste status effect page for more information.)

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/March

It does indeed, though I was unaware of it originally. It really helps with raising all the dead in dynamis wanting an R3 -.-;