Trouble holding hate! advise [Can I have it?]

[zerofighter777]

Re: Trouble holding hate! advise [Can I have it?]

nov. 93? O.o wow you musta had the ffxi alpha alpha alpha verison!

LOL, I am such a idiot *smacks forhead* , I ment Nov. 03.

[Artaxerxes]

Re: Trouble holding hate! advise [Can I have it?]

Blade-jin is all you need to hold hate

Starting at 61 I ditched the emp pin\sh route and I tanked in a byrnie (haub when bard was around), Voyager Sallet, H-kote and sniper\str rings.

[kman]

Re: Trouble holding hate! advise [Can I have it?]

Hate isn't very complicated but here is how to solve any problems you may or may not have while trying to hold hate. Please use the steps in proper order but feel free to skip certain steps

Step 1. Provoke
- Make sure your subbing warrior.
- When the monster is pulled try to establish instant hate.
- SATA is another way to do this, but if all steps are followed sata is not necc. most of the time in exp.

Step 2. Enfeebles, and JoB abilities
- Begin with your lightest enfeebles and work your way up to stronger ones, make hate climb. This will cause more solid hate, instant of instantanous hate that provoke provides.

Step 3. Use Enmity+
- If you still can't hold hate through meleeing, and ws time to macro in some enmity+. Yes I do mean macro in. If you have issues with your charecter blinking alot than only switch accessories.
- You want to use enmity+ gear each and every time you provoke, or use othe JA/Ninjitsu.
- Remember enmity only takes into account when an action is taken. By simply standing next to someone with lots of enmity+ gear will not draw hate to them contrary to popular belief.

Step 4. Buy Shurikens or Quit Nin
- Shurikens are one of the most heavy damaging weapons in this game, at a fair price ofcoarse. If you can afford several stacks of Fuma and not cry about it after you miss a few than you will be remembered as the world's bravest and best ninja. But again maybe ninja isn't for you and you should try other jobs like monk their fun too : )

[BENWALLACE]

Re: Trouble holding hate! advise [Can I have it?]

Hate isn't very complicated but here is how to solve any problems you may or may not have while trying to hold hate. Please use the steps in proper order but feel free to skip certain steps

Step 1. Provoke
- Make sure your subbing warrior.
- When the monster is pulled try to establish instant hate.
- SATA is another way to do this, but if all steps are followed sata is not necc. most of the time in exp.

Step 2. Enfeebles, and JoB abilities
- Begin with your lightest enfeebles and work your way up to stronger ones, make hate climb. This will cause more solid hate, instant of instantanous hate that provoke provides.

Step 3. Use Enmity+
- If you still can't hold hate through meleeing, and ws time to macro in some enmity+. Yes I do mean macro in. If you have issues with your charecter blinking alot than only switch accessories.
- You want to use enmity+ gear each and every time you provoke, or use othe JA/Ninjitsu.
- Remember enmity only takes into account when an action is taken. By simply standing next to someone with lots of enmity+ gear will not draw hate to them contrary to popular belief.

Step 4. Buy Shurikens or Quit Nin
- Shurikens are one of the most heavy damaging weapons in this game, at a fair price ofcoarse. If you can afford several stacks of Fuma and not cry about it after you miss a few than you will be remembered as the world's bravest and best ninja. But again maybe ninja isn't for you and you should try other jobs like monk their fun too : )

BEN AGREE WITH MOST STEPS EXCEPT FOR 3 (NO REAL OPINION AS BEN NOT MUCH EXPERIENCED) WITH IT AND 4

BEN DISAGREE WITH 4 GREATLY AS BEN NEVER HAVE TO USE SHURIKENS IN EXPING PT FOR HATE

BEN FEEL ITS MUCH MORE EFFICIENT AND LESS MONEY TO JUST SWING KATANANABANANANANAS AND USE WEAPONSKILL BLADE: SMASHJIN (BEN DO THIS ALL TIME WORKS GREAT!)

THIS IS MOST POWERFUL ESPECIALLY ONCE NINJA IS BECOMING HIGHER IN LEVELS AND POWER AND DOMINATING, BEN USE THIS EVEN ON BIG BIG STRONG MONSTERS LIKE FAFNIRZ AND NIDHOGGZ ETCZ AND ITS SO STRONG EVEN PLD IN PT IS LIKE HEY BEN GUY DONT GET TOO MUCH HATE FROM ME PLZ OK? AND BEN SAY HEY FORGET YOU PLD GUY, I'M DEFENSIVE PLAYER OF YEAR GET OUTTA MY WAY WHILE I SMASHJIN DRAGONS

BEN RECOMMEND THIS HIGHLY, PLZ TRY ^-^

[Omni]

Re: Trouble holding hate! advise [Can I have it?]

i agree with ben.

buy shurikens or quit nin? sorry you do not need shurikens ever as a nin. for fun or added dmg sure, but its surely no where as dramatic as you say shurikens or quit nin.

[Aeni]

Re: Trouble holding hate! advise [Can I have it?]

Step 4. Buy Shurikens or Quit Nin
- Shurikens are one of the most heavy damaging weapons in this game, at a fair price ofcoarse. If you can afford several stacks of Fuma and not cry about it after you miss a few than you will be remembered as the world's bravest and best ninja. But again maybe ninja isn't for you and you should try other jobs like monk their fun too : )

I'm sorry, but this is kind of misleading. I've partied with an LS mate that never used shurikens - EVER - but had throwing skill capped anyway and if needing something to hit on ranged with, he'd use his Ungar Boomerang.

Even LS galkan PLD had a bit of a time taking hate from this NIN and there was at least a few merit points and 3 levels different between them (NIN being at 72)

Even a half-assed SATA is more than enough in the hands of a capable ninja.

[little ninja]

Re: Trouble holding hate! advise [Can I have it?]

Blade-jin is all you need to hold hate

Starting at 61 I ditched the emp pin\sh route and I tanked in a byrnie (haub when bard was around), Voyager Sallet, H-kote and sniper\str rings.

thats what my gear sounds like at 75 in katana burn pts. nomore need to tank. go in bounce hate, run to next mob ws. then rinse repeat. i was only a fan of the S.H for 2 reasons. A. nobody really had 1, it was very uncommon back in the day, an B. i felt better with the +10 acc.

[kman]

Re: Trouble holding hate! advise [Can I have it?]

It was a humarous post to some extent. The last part is simply implying that if after step 1 2 and 3 you still have trouble holding hate than do step 4. It's not the step by step that you must take to hold hate but instead various tools that can be used to do so.

Shurikens are in fact as dramatic as I make em out to be. I've parsed actual fights where I would swing swing throw, and repeat. The parses were all against very pimped out monks (kotes) and DRK. If you ignore the sheer cost of these ridiculous toys it is basically the garanteed way to hold hate and reach the top or near top mark on the parser list. What makes these guys so amazing is probably the level that you attain them at.

Juji Shuriken (28)
DMG: 41!!
DLY: 192

A delay of an avg sword hitting harder than most swords available for a level 75. These bad boys break through shells of the beetles you fight after leaving the jungles and remain effecient until roughly lvl 40+

I'm not going to drag on but compare these to your highest damage katana, or other jobs and see if they stack. Hitting this hard so early makes all the difference, but ofcoarse they don't have an impact for a level 60 some nin. He/she should now probably try out Fuma.

Back on subject like Aeni said a good SATA is usually all one needs to hold solid hate for most of the fight but if that proves ineffective those were simply tips into what else can be done.

[Aeni]

Re: Trouble holding hate! advise [Can I have it?]

kman ... you forget that they changed the ranged attack behavior. So, upfront tanking with shurikens should actually do piss poor damage at piss poor accuracy up close ... right?

[kman]

Re: Trouble holding hate! advise [Can I have it?]

Well I had my ninja at level 25 and than started leveling it again after the Utesumi update which I believe was coencided with the ranged update and I remember how I simply could not hold hate from level 25-28 on my nin/war. That's when I hit lvl 28 I decided to give juji a try and the results were so fenaminal that I bought 1 mil worth of materials and took it to a 100+2 smither to make into shurikens in order to level to 40.

One experience I had was when we moved onto goblins near Outpost. The goblins were rangers and would try to snipe me from afar. I did the same thing by standing back and throwing shurikens at it consistantly. I managed to keep hate from a DRK who before would steal hate with just two swings (and I had been doing everything mantioned, but at this level pre-ni it's virtually impossible to hold hate any other way as elemental ichi spells are too slow and either get interupted or hate is already long gone by the time your done your cast). I considered about doing swing swing running back to throw, tried it (saw a ranger do this in delfunk's tower) but as a tank it's not a good idea lol and the results weren't that great anyways. Now I'm not going to make any assumptions here as they purely are just that but is throwing actually effected by the ranged update? Regardless damage is just fine upclose (I stood a few steps back tho not exactly touching the mob).

[Artaxerxes]

Re: Trouble holding hate! advise [Can I have it?]

thats what my gear sounds like at 75 in katana burn pts. nomore need to tank. go in bounce hate, run to next mob ws. then rinse repeat. i was only a fan of the S.H for 2 reasons. A. nobody really had 1, it was very uncommon back in the day, an B. i felt better with the +10 acc.

I started at 60, i got tired of all the "you look like the kool-aid guy jokes" "say OH YEAH!!!!"
Galka in a SH and Kote? No thanks.

Besides they arent that many better looking body pieces in the game. brynie=teh secks

[little ninja]

Re: Trouble holding hate! advise [Can I have it?]

I started at 60, i got tired of all the "you look like the kool-aid guy jokes" "say OH YEAH!!!!"
Galka in a SH and Kote? No thanks.

Besides they arent that many better looking body pieces in the game. brynie=teh secks

lol i had the brynie as well. i noticed an increase in DD but noticed i fell off in the "hits landed" area. i wished i had logged total DD output. i would have liked to see what numbers in the end were. so i know what was trully worth the investment.

[Omni]

Re: Trouble holding hate! advise [Can I have it?]

fuck sh. im never had one and refuse to buy it.
i've leveled 1-75 taru nin w/o sh and dont plan on getting one for nin or any other job.

boycott sh!

[Beenthere]

Re: Trouble holding hate! advise [Can I have it?]

well, i had the same problem in the valley even with a static thf. the problem in holding hate with a nin is your DDs and party mechanics. most DDs of any class have one thing on their mind... damage, and as much as possible all the time. this is wrong, and they only cause hate issues. but, with proper party mechanics, this can be avoided.

for instance, lvl 69-70, manticores in terrigan. pt of nin/war, thf/nin, sam/thf, whm, rdm, blm. at first we were having a terrible time due to the sam having the "OMGztEhDMG" syndrome. replaced sam. new sam. wiser sam. instead of ripping that one sata WS from behind the mob, he instead sacraficed his own dmg and just tricked the one ws on me (nin) and then sa the other ws. coupled with my thfs merited early evisceration, the mob was always on me and we were ripping 2 light scs on manticores which are weak to light. bingo. proper party mechanics, proper hate management, land of milk and honey in the xp world.

while this is only an example, you can always find a way to apply proper party mechanics. just dont be afraid to dump the people with the "OMGztEhDMGz" syndrome.

[Eauijhkuu]

Re: Trouble holding hate! advise [Can I have it?]

Answer:
THF solves your hate problems.

Especially post 60.

Grab one if you want to hold Hate like a PLD.

... SATA WS holds hate through MBs. It's very good when you want to do hard burst damage while keeping your mage alive.

Try it sometime.

Double Post Edited:

while this is only an example, you can always find a way to apply proper party mechanics. just dont be afraid to dump the people with the "OMGztEhDMGz" syndrome.

Me and a PLD friend I usually party with call it "Bignumber" Sydrome.