Sub for Ranger Qaulities

[OWA_900]

Hello, I planned on becoming a Ranger and having a Ninja for a Sub Job, I was just wondering what the positive qualities were for taking this path.

-Thanks

[Cri]

Blink...dual wield racc+gear.

[Macht]

Dual wield for rng acc is really an overblown and really overdone. There really is not that huge a need for the dual wield to increase rng acc. However dual wield is still handy to equip a second weapon focused mainly on improving something, weather it be to give you an HP Regen or pump up STR or something else.

And the biggest reason anyone subs NIN is for Utsusemi. I see it as handy but by no means to be a definate life saver. It will reduce chances of death, but you'll have a good chance of dying if you arn't careful. So with that in mind I just see it as be careful and spend more money, or be careful and spend a little less money. Either way as I've seen so far at lv. 55 I haven't had any cases were that difference was a truely big life saver.

Reason it isn't is usually when I do an attack that draws the monsters hate they almost always do an AOE and then strike me. So especially with the changes to Utsusemi now (Most of the AOEs I've ended up encountering removes my Utsusemi) it's like I'm just throwing away money, if I took the last 100k I used in that manner and put in to getting some +2 versions instead of the +1s it'd of been better spent IMHO.

Anyway that's been my experience which is why I'm glad I went with RNG/WAR instead. Its your choice though of how you want to play and depending on what your fight the RNG/NIN might actually work better.

[nsxtasy]

Ninja will save your ass. I'm 67 currently, and will never sub war. As a taru, you have precious little hp as it is. And all the rng acc you can get DOES make a difference.

The other rng I party with (Imac2much) has +7 rng acc more than me and he averages 3-7% better hit % than me. So I don't see how saying +11 rng acc from a 2nd hawkers knife is insignifiicant.

On regular mobs I xp on, I can die in 4-5 regular hits. Blink is an absolute must for me. Not that many AoE's remove it totally anyways.

And as far as cost... I used 120 shihei in 30k xp last night, and I was doing the pulling. 5k. weee.

[Bigbird]

Nin sub is a must for any Rng....

[OWA_900]

Cool, thanks guys! the info is much appreciated :D

[Cri]

Its not a must, it just comes in handy. Depends what you are doing like always. I like /war for the dmg, thats what we are there for.

[greysenn]

Everything listed above more or less.

Blink is very useful to have for non paladin tanks, (Or just plain lousy ones) where it's easy to overstep the hate line. It won't save you if you really get hate stuck on you, but it will definetly save you some beating.

The dual hawkers comes into play if you're fighting higher than normal xp mobs. If you're fighting the lower variety (VT/IT range), the difference isn't nearly as noticeable.

[Thegod]

you'll hear ninja sub is a must for all rangers a million times, and the truth is the only rngs i see w/o a ninja sub are the ones who are too lazy to level ninja.

i sub ninja, because i figured utsu would be uber, and like the other guy said, its more like a handy trick, its not like at level 50 castin a level 12 spell will be uber.


dual wield, now thats where the uber part comes in, but honestly its not even uber till level 30 (yeah 30, not 28) when you get barrage, you need all the ranged accuracy you can get with barrage, so i say stick to ninja as your sub.

THIS IS VERY INPORTANT UNLESS YOUR IMMUNE TO BURNOUT

Please level ninja to at least 25-30 (37 is best) before you start leveling rng, once you start using horn arrows, you will run through gil very fast, and its very easy to run through the gil needed to level nin from levels 17-25 just by leveling rng from level 40-41, so please concider that when leveling.

I leveled nin to 10, then rng to 20, then nin to 15, then rng to 30, and by the time my rng hit 40, i was burned out, so i took 2 whole months off the game, and leveled nin first properly...

funny thing is now i hate pulling so ima blm. level 54

[Macht]

Originally posted by nsxtasy
The other rng I party with (Imac2much) has +7 rng acc more than me and he averages 3-7% better hit % than me. So I don't see how saying +11 rng acc from a 2nd hawkers knife is insignifiicant.

First the data you are comparing sounds like it's RNG/NIN vs. RNG/NIN in that case of course more rng. acc. will have an impact unless the second RNG/NIN has effectively increased their damage output to that same 3-7%. That means with an average of 100 damage you only have to get 3-7 more damage or with 200 average damage get 6-14 more damage. A good +3 STR and some +Rng. Att. and your set still.

Even better with it is when you push attack in balance with accuracy attacks like WSs or even Criticals are much more damaging. That's were RNG/WAR can cover that difference so they only need the 1 Hawker's Knife to tie and exceed damage wise. The defensive wise is were I belive the choice of being /NIN or /WAR matters if what you usually fight doesn't do a lot of AOEs that wipe the Utsusemi then /NIN might be better for you.

However, if they do wipe Utsusemi or you have a hate control job like THF or DRK/THF. Then RNG/WAR is by far much better then RNG/NIN. I honestly see the two as being quite equal in their given respects, I just wish the debate of that would end so I can quit having to show up ever RNG/NIN I meet to show I can tie them and exceed damage wise. Add in properly timing when to do the extreem damage to reduce my chances of death and RNG/NIN at best matches but never exceeds.

The whole thing is just a mental state like MNKs keep having to go through to prove they are great damage dealers, everything they do testing that shows it but I've met people that still think otherwise.

[Thegod]

maybe i missed something (honestly i just skimed the post) but i dont think many would argue that a rng/war could outdamage let alone match the dmg of a rng/nin.

the rng/nin makes up the damge diff. per shot by hitting more shots of barrage and or sidewinder.

its all a matter of preference, but utsusemi (not the end all be all life saving ability some think it is) is fairly usefull when you pull too much hate.

and if your gonna go for max possible damage i would think you would want utsu, because some mobs attack very quickly and those three shadows could be the difference between life and death.


I know just recently the rng/nin in my party decided he didnt need utsu because the pally was great (the pally was great BUT) we pulled a crawler hunter to keep up the chain, the rng used barrage right at the same time the hunter was using his aoe, lets just say his deathj was very quck.....lol

[greysenn]

maybe i missed something (honestly i just skimed the post) but i dont think many would argue that a rng/war could outdamage let alone match the dmg of a rng/nin.

Depends what you're fighting and what your group setup is, but /war's raw damage is noticeably higher. They also get crushed noticeably faster by WS when they're zerked, etc.

[Macht]

That's the catch with RNG/WAR in the conditions were Utsusemi is still effective a RNG/WAR doesn't use barrage at just any time but they time it just right to cover a large majority of the monsters remaining HP in hopes of killing it without having to much damage wasted in an overkill.

In effect to that it means you have to know well what kind of damage you can do and if it will bring the monster to a sliver of it life or be just enough to kill it. You can even go steps further to measure the length of damage you can do and work in your party to also finish it quickly.

However the more and more extravogant you get at doing things like that you do end up risking your life more. Again on the otherside of that the more extravogant the faster you are able to make chains.

My favorite when I'm forced to start a fight with a WS in a SC, knowing the damage is going to be drawn to me or in a THF party were damage is going to be controlled I end up doing sharpshot, berserk, barrage and the fire my WS then my Barrage. By this that time the SC is finished the monster is down to about 1/8 of it's life and a spell has just been executed finishing the monster off, hence holding the RNGs title of finishing a fight before it even starts are still true (Well sort of >.> ).

The fastest battle I've had that I can recall lasted about 15 seconds doing that got a nice 220 exp .