I was told Monks become desirable at 60+, and yet its not true so far.

[Sharma]

Monks dont like pulling with Chi Blast because it has a 3 min timer on it which really messes up exp chains.

Voke is a no go unless you got a thf or someone with trick to remove hate (for me anyway). :spin:

[Dano]

you can pull with pebbles but they are very limited, like 12 pebbles a stack, and it's bout 1k on my server last i see, then again who would wanna spend the time mining pebbles.

it's a bad idea to pull in undead areas especially wif such high hp and low armor, if you get hit on the way back you might aggro other undeads wif yer yellow hp.

[Ungerpurr]

Both PTs I've had in valley of sorrows so far, I've had to be puller. In one of them, I also had to be the trick-voker. I despise both roles, because I'm ill-suited for them. For pulling, the aforementioned 3 minute timer on chi blast blows, and if that's not up, the two choices are voke (bad idea) or aggro pull (also a bad idea). Bleh.

As far as being the trick voker...ugh, I hate this. Maybe it's because the thfs I've grouped with recently have been any good, but me getting slammed for 100-200 damage a hit (with 360 defense using defender) for about 600-800 damage at the start of every fight is just not enjoyable. Also, it gimps my role as a damage dealer, since often I'm in defender for the first 10-15% of a fight. Blech.

Really, thfs are such a pain to group with, just in general, that getting howling fist doesn't seem like much of a benefit to me, as it forces me into a role that I'd rather not be in (trick-voker for the thf that invited me because I could start Distortion). The one PT I saw that made really good use of Howling Fist was a nin nin mnk rdm blm blm PT. They would SC Blade: Retsu -> Red Lotus Blade -> SA + TA + Howling Fists. The blms were bursting fire 3 on the fusion skillchain (~level 62 group). It seemed to work fairly well, in total their SC + MB was doing around half the damage to the toramas they were fighting.

Anyway, hopefully getting a set going this weekend, we still need to iron out some details. I'm not really in a huge hurry to hit 75 or anything.

[Sharma]

I dont mind being trick voker, for the most part the thfs ive PTd with dont like messing about and make it known when its pissing them off, heh.

Also I generally PT with good WHMs to HP isnt really an issue.

But as you said yes, I hate having to voke pull because it screws things up for the first bit of the fight and can mean the mnk is in for a rough ride after all, hitting for a lot AND the hate the voke produces isnt a nice combo. :sweat:

[Teuffel]

Originally posted by Ungerpurr
Both PTs I've had in valley of sorrows so far, I've had to be puller. In one of them, I also had to be the trick-voker. I despise both roles, because I'm ill-suited for them. For pulling, the aforementioned 3 minute timer on chi blast blows, and if that's not up, the two choices are voke (bad idea) or aggro pull (also a bad idea). Bleh.

Well, i think most pullers get eaten up in valley of sorrows, so i can feel your pain there. I had a monk in cape terrigan pulling crabs/pugs once and we were consistantly getting chain 4-5 with him as the puller.

Not sure what he was pulling with(chi blast and ?), but in those circumstances he made an acceptible puller. I do understand monks are not ideal pullers and why. Its because of this reason, why i am sometimes hesitant to invite them with my pt's set up.

[truong]

LOL you clueless MNK fanboys still think MNK outdamage DRK post 65? Are you serious? Are any of you 65+? I didn't think so. Head over the DRK board and check out the recent, INFORMATIVE AND CLEAR POST 65 parser logs. MNK/WAR and DRK/THF on the team fighting BONES no less. 50% bonus for the MNK, -20% deduction on the DRK's GS. Yet the outcome was the MNK winning by a mere 600 points of damage. LOL and you guys STILL insist MNK do more damage? Seriously, GET past level 65 and tell me that with a straight face. Anyway, to answer Jayblahx:

The BRD has every reason to want to ditch you. Everything a MNK and RNG does on a team, a team of RNG and DRK does BETTER. MUCH BETTER. There is no combo in the game that compliments a RNG more than DRK/THF. NONE. And the BRD was probably thinking long term. The only saving grace a MNK has post 65 is the fact that they can fight bones for incredibly fast exp. This conflicts with having the RNG and WAR on the team, both suffer -% damage deduction vs Bones. "But we can fight something else other than bones! I don't mind!" Yes, you COULD do that. But why fight other things with a MNK/WAR? Why, when you can have the superior combo in DRK/THF? Hell, even on bones, as you can see by the parser logs (a *gasp* parser log POST 65! What a revelation!) on the DRK board, the MNK BARELY edged out the DRK/THF in damage on BONES! ON BONES, people! And the difference was 600 points of damage over the course of 34 battles!

"But I can sub /THF and SA/TA Dragon Kick to take hate away from the RNG!" Yes, you can. But so can the DRK/THF. And while you go back to regularly attacking (after SA/TA Dragon Kick on tank) with your lower than usual attacks (thanks to NOT having Berserk and Double attack), the DRK whips out Soul Eater for another potential 1200 damage. In short, everything MNK/THF does, DRK/THF does light years better.

Another thing, seeing as the WAR/NIN is the main tank of the team, that's more reason to have a DRK/THF. Soul Eater+WS = bigger damage = more hate on the tank. This helps the WAR/NIN much more. And if the WAR/NIN ever does lose hate and things go ugly, the DRK can always throw in a Stun to help out. While the MNK does nothing. Wait, he could Chi Blast. Yeah.

In short: DRK/THF is just BETTER combo than MNK/WAR post 65. No melee job wants a MNK on the team, simply because a) the MNK is better off fighting bones and getting faster exp with OTHER MNKs. b) 50% of the melee job have -% deduction vs bones, so they'd much rather fight something else, preferably with a DRK/THF, a combo that does more damage than MNK/WAR on anything that's not bones PERIOD.

So my advice: suck it up, go find a PLD and another MNK so you can get uber exp from bones. You staying in the team would simply not benefit them. You even said it yourself, they're all great players, so it's obvious that they know what they're doing and know what they want and they KNOW a DRK would benefit the team more. The RNG is clearly not happy with the SC, as he and a DRK could do the most uber leet combo there is: Arching Arrows > Spin Slash. GGPO mob.

[Addicted2trance]

see....that's why I dislike darks to many of them are retards like the dude above me...get off your power trip bro.

For the record I don't give a shit if a dark knight is stronger melee wise all that matter's to me is the xp and having fun doing it.

[truong]

Because I state facts and back them up, I'm a retard? If a RNG came in here and said "WE DO MORE DAMAGE THAN MNK!!!" would he also be retarded for stating the FACT? Don't be an idiot. If anything, it's the MNKs that are on the biggest power trips in FFXI. Everywhere you go, in-game or on msg boards, it's "we do the most melee damage! DRKs are sooo overrated! we have the best DoT!" and then we have the countless legions of mindless tools who agree with this simply because they're MNks themselves. hell, this thread is littered with clueless MNKs. a few pages back, there's a dude who said something along the line of "they're way worse off if they ditched you for a DRK" this comment is prime example of a clueless MNK fanboy. A RNG's best friend is a DRK/THF. A WAR/NIN who's tanking's best friend is a DRK/THF. A team of RNG WAR practically begs for a DRK/THF. this team also has the single strongest 2 man SC in the game. Arching Arrows > Spin Slash and still put hate on the tank without having the need for someone to sub an inferiorfor job (MNK/THF). with all this facts, this clueless monk still insists that the static pt would be "way worse" with a DRK rather than a MNK.

And i'm willing to bet, 90% of these MNKs don't even realise how completely and utterly irrelevent Damage Over Time is to an exp PT. they just saw a meaningless graph and creamed their pants.

Oh, and more power to you if you only enjoy getting exp and playing. but you know what? its not fun when everyone is GROSSLY misinformed, thus hurting another job. this is the reason why you see so many NA players pass up DRK for MNKs, simply because they HEARD or READ that MNKs do more damage. Thus you have a bunch of DRK's sitting around bitching about how they never get PTs, even when they spend millions of gils on items. THAT is not fun. I'm merely here to set the facts straight.

[Addicted2trance]

ok boss what ever makes ya happy ^_^

[DerekKnight]

Originally posted by truong
Thus you have a bunch of DRK's sitting around bitching about how they never get PTs, even when they spend millions of gils on items. THAT is not fun. I'm merely here to set the facts straight.

Actually, you have tons of DRKs never getting PTs because...there's TONS of DRKs. =)

[Jaggywaggy]

Oh, and more power to you if you only enjoy getting exp and playing. but you know what? its not fun when everyone is GROSSLY misinformed, thus hurting another job. this is the reason why you see so many NA players pass up DRK for MNKs, simply because they HEARD or READ that MNKs do more damage. Thus you have a bunch of DRK's sitting around bitching about how they never get PTs, even when they spend millions of gils on items. THAT is not fun. I'm merely here to set the facts straight.

You seem angry, it's only a video game. Just know your arguement, I mean shouting spree is going to reach no one. You're the biggest job fanboy in here, what caused you to come in here so angry, honestly? You just barge in here yelling about mnk vs drk. If you're waiting around in jeuno all day no need to take it out here. This isn't a drk vs mnk discussion if you didn't notice...

Why not get a static, or is there some type of actions of yours preventing that?

Jay never said they static wouldn't be better with a drk instead at his current level. He doesn't understand their actions because they(ranger+monk) make a powerful skillchain at 66. So he doesn't see why they can't wait a few levels. I don't believe you read past page 1 sir.

with all this facts, this clueless monk still insists that the static pt would be "way worse" with a DRK rather than a MNK.

Incase you didn't read the static died, and you mentioned it as if it existed still. Are you sure you read, wait I know you'll claim you did for arguements sake.

Take it to a drk vs mnk topic.

[AkumuX]

Yea, Truong got a thread shut down in other forums. Time to come over here and turn this into a flaming pile of shit, and get this thread closed down.

Sorry man, you have 8 warnings, no sig, no player info and I'll bet you're recently registered. You could tell me the sky is blue and I'd call you a liar.

Now get the hell outta here, and enjoy your 9th warning.

>.>

[Ramen]

Back onto the original topic.....

Personally, I have gotten much more party invites past 60. Leveling 60-65 took less time and has been much more enjoyable than going to 50-55(was stuck here for a long time).

It has only gotten better now that I've hit 65. Dragon kick = :spin: . Flying Mithra! Subbed thief for the first time in awhile a few days ago in Teriggan, and was hitting cocks for about 700+ constant due to guarenteed SA critical. WAR sub is still probably better, but SA is very fun to use and can dish out high and constant/reliable damage during ws.

[KamaAina]

I personally as a RNG and now switching back to a MNK like RNG + MNK.

After 55 as a RNG pretty much anything ending with sidewinder I liked, and I prefered partying with MNKs because they got tp faster. Nothing like scing every 3 fights with some DRK.

Course my favorite was WAR/SAM.

Another reason that I really like MNKs is because when it comes time for chain 5 and 6 I can sneak out a couple of hits early to pull.

I try doing this with DRKs and the long delay kicks in and then they miss and we dont even get a chain >.>

RNG's do sick DMG, and like a BRD can turn a party from average to WOW. But im just so sick of RNG right now that i need a break so im going back to my favorite all time job MNK.

[Dano]

Oh, and more power to you if you only enjoy getting exp and playing. but you know what? its not fun when everyone is GROSSLY misinformed, thus hurting another job. this is the reason why you see so many NA players pass up DRK for MNKs, simply because they HEARD or READ that MNKs do more damage. Thus you have a bunch of DRK's sitting around bitching about how they never get PTs, even when they spend millions of gils on items. THAT is not fun. I'm merely here to set the facts straight

we don't give a shit