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  • Vyuru's Guide to the Dragoon

    Enough changes have been made to the Drg job that I think the current guides are a bit outdated in some aspects.

    Also, the format for this has been shamelessly ripped from Armando's Pld Equipment guide because it's that awesome! And it looks much better than how I was originally making it.

    This is a work in progress. I'll be adding to it as I go. Comments/suggestions are most welcome!

    Gear in blue text is for healing breath equipment.



    Unlocking Dragoon


    Job Traits


    Job Abilities



    Polearms, General Info


    Polearms


    Grips


    Head

    Neck


    Body


    Hands


    Waist


    Legs

    Feet

    Rings

    Earrings

    Back

    Throwing
    [/b]

    Subjobs


    EDIT: Hmm, I see it needs some slight editing to make it look pretty, I'll do that at the end though.

    EDIT2: I'll be adding colors for gear that I recommend, and for gear that is worn while soloing or for HB reasons.
    Last edited by Vyuru; 01-04-2009, 05:40 PM.


    You have the right to remain silent, anything you say can and will be misqouted and then used against you.

    I don't have a big ego, it just has a large mouth.

  • #2
    Re: Vyuru's Guide to the Dragoon

    just as a note

    [Lvl 60] Pole Grip..................|Double Attack +2%|
    should only be if your subbing WAR and the AF Helm at 60 should just be macroed in for WS and or healing breath macros

    I know your not don yet ;p but its looking good so far
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Kain (FFIV): I am aware of my actions, but can do nothing about them.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Vyuru's Guide to the Dragoon

      You can DA with pole grip even if you're not /WAR, just like brutal or any other DA item. Of course, if that's your only piece of DA, it's going to be very rare, but it *can* happen. Even jumps can DA.

      As for macroing things in, well, gear swapping and macros could get a whole section of their own.


      Interesting and useful guide, but I'm a little puzzled by the gear sections (the ones that have been written so far). You list askar head but not relic? Pahluwan but not O-hat? Seems like some odd choices to me. Different people are going to have different opinions on what gear is better for what situations, and for DRG in particular the best party DD gear is not necessarily good soloing or campaign gear, but it seems to me that it's therefore better to err on the side of including anything possibly useful (including more defensive pieces like dragon and gavial, and the Iron Ram spear with -10% to all damage taken).

      I would also suggest a section on subjobs because subjobs work very differently for DRG than for other jobs, and there's a wide variety of useful subjobs for different situations (WAR, THF, SAM, NIN, WHM, RDM, BLU just off the top of my head).
      Defeated: Maat, Divine Might, Fenrir, Kirin, Cactrot Rapido, Xolotl, Diabolos Prime, Kurrea, 9/10 Dynamis Bosses (missing Tav), Promathia, Proto-Ultima, Proto-Omega, 4 Jailers, Apocalypse Nigh, 6/6 Nyzul Bosses
      RDM90, PLD90, DRG90, COR90, SCH90, BLU54
      All Nations Rank 10, ZMs & PMs Complete, AUMs Complete, Captain, Nyzul Floor 100 (5 Weapons, 4 WS), Medal of Altana, WotG Mission 15, 1/3 Addons Complete, 9/9 Abyssea Main Quests, 6/6 Caturae

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      • #4
        Re: Vyuru's Guide to the Dragoon

        Originally posted by Karinya View Post
        You can DA with pole grip even if you're not /WAR, just like brutal or any other DA item. Of course, if that's your only piece of DA, it's going to be very rare, but it *can* happen. Even jumps can DA.

        As for macroing things in, well, gear swapping and macros could get a whole section of their own.


        Interesting and useful guide, but I'm a little puzzled by the gear sections (the ones that have been written so far). You list askar head but not relic? Pahluwan but not O-hat? Seems like some odd choices to me. Different people are going to have different opinions on what gear is better for what situations, and for DRG in particular the best party DD gear is not necessarily good soloing or campaign gear, but it seems to me that it's therefore better to err on the side of including anything possibly useful (including more defensive pieces like dragon and gavial, and the Iron Ram spear with -10% to all damage taken).

        I would also suggest a section on subjobs because subjobs work very differently for DRG than for other jobs, and there's a wide variety of useful subjobs for different situations (WAR, THF, SAM, NIN, WHM, RDM, BLU just off the top of my head).

        what I ment, is that yes that grip alone, is pointless, I know that it would still work, by I would rather Mithral +1 stats over a mer 2% DA
        -------------------------------------------------------------------------
        Kain (FFIV): I am aware of my actions, but can do nothing about them.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Vyuru's Guide to the Dragoon

          I would also post that disclaimer in the beginning instead of the weapons section, Vy. But regardless, I agree with Karinya here, you might wanna think about adding in more equipment. Just because you're writing this with the new player in mind, doesn't mean you can't also inform them on other equipment they might want to know about later. Make it its own secion, "Gear That Needs Extra Work to Obtain" or something prettier-sounding. In your hat section, Askar Zucchetto easily falls in that section, and it's easy to assume that by 70-75, one will have at least come across a few endgame linkshells that they could have applied for and gotten into.

          If not their own section, just throw everything into the appropriate section, and call out the pieces that'll take more than just a trip to the AH. IMO, any guide to Dragoon (or any job's) equipment needs to list everything. Including what the piece would normally be used for. That's the one piece of info that I see a lot of guides skip out on.
          Last edited by LilithAngel; 12-28-2008, 03:12 PM. Reason: If you have a DA build, Pole. If not, Mythril +1. Simple. Don't even need /WAR.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Vyuru's Guide to the Dragoon

            [Lvl 60] Pole Grip..................|Double Attack +2%|
            should only be if your subbing WAR
            And further down:

            what I ment, is that yes that grip alone, is pointless, I know that it would still work, by I would rather Mithral +1 stats over a mer 2% DA
            And Lilith's:

            If you have a DA build, Pole. If not, Mythril +1. Simple. Don't even need /WAR.
            I disagree with that.

            At level 60 when you can first use the Pole Grip how much str/vit/acc do you have? How much will +2 str/vit/acc do for you? How much will an extra hit do for you?

            I think that Double Attack is a very important stat for Dragoons, not something I'd sacrifice Haste gear over, but still an important stat. Most of the JA that we will use in a party is affected by DA, all of our WS that we will use in a party are multi hitters, increasing the chances of a DA with each hit. When you think about it, 2% DA means on average 1 extra attack every 50 swings. 50 swings is the equivalent to 10 Penta Thrusts. I may not know how many times I swing my lance in a exp or merit party, but I know darn well that I can do 10 Penta Thrusts in very short order as a Drg/Sam.

            Then too I view the Grip slot as a somewhat special slot. I can pickup +str/vit/acc gear elsewhere, probably not all on the same piece of equipment but I can find it elsewhere. I cannot easily or readily find an alternate source of +DA gear elsewhere. Yes there is the Brutal Earring, and the Askar body as the next easiest sources of +DA gear. However both require a lengthy time commitment, being lvl 70+, and a good static. For the slot it is in I cannot think of anything that is better than the Pole Grip. The +crit damage grip might be a possibility, but in my mind that's mostly when you have it paired with a Ryunohige.


            @Karinya and Lilith:

            Yeah, I'm agreeing with you guys. Gear like some of the Aurum pieces needs to be mentioned, and at the very least if they're aware of the gear then they can be thinking about getting into the kinds of shells or groups that do those things. There are also a few gear setups that I'd be curious about that I'd want to mention, such as the Skystrider/Supremacy Earring combo.

            I'm also thinking a brief macro section might be in order perhaps.... Nothing too indepth, just some macro samples of how to make gear swaps and spell+gear swap macros for HB. Healing Breath will be discussed prior to the job section I think, and I will be swapping some things around to make it easier to read.


            Thanks for the comments and suggestions so far ^^


            You have the right to remain silent, anything you say can and will be misqouted and then used against you.

            I don't have a big ego, it just has a large mouth.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Vyuru's Guide to the Dragoon

              "When you think about it, 2% DA means on average 1 extra attack every 50 swings. 50 swings is the equivalent to 10 Penta Thrusts."


              what..... you mean to tell me you would take that over STR/VIT +2 ACC +2? thats just stupid -.-

              if your going to sub WAR then yeah Pole grip is a good idea, if not, stay with Mithral +1

              pluss what build is this thread for, because DRG has many builds to it

              ACC build
              ATT build
              Haste build
              DA build
              mage build

              and thats just for PTs there are many variants to these for soloing

              I mean.... don't get me wrong, I love that someone is trying to make a guide like this, I would not have the patience to do it -.- but if its going to be done, it needs to be done right.
              Last edited by Kailea; 12-28-2008, 09:37 PM.
              -------------------------------------------------------------------------
              Kain (FFIV): I am aware of my actions, but can do nothing about them.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Vyuru's Guide to the Dragoon

                what..... you mean to tell me you would take that over STR/VIT +2 ACC +2? thats just stupid -.-
                And how exactly is it stupid?

                At level 60, with all your other +acc/str/att gear, how much will you be hitting for? How will +2str/vit/acc affect that? It should be such a small difference that not even a parser will pick it up and it will fall into that gray area of random damage fluctuation.

                At level 60 you should have about +30 in accuracy from 2x woodsman rings, potent belt, jaridah peti, chivalrous chain, and an assault earring, and you will either be using a GKL with +7acc or you will be using a lance with a fairly potent evasion down added effect. You can increase this amount if you so choose by using a life belt or a scorpion harness. Even so, with +30 acc, not counting lance, in addition to the two handed acc formula, potential for Hasso, and +22 accuracy in job traits, what is an additional +2acc going to do for me?

                At level 60 I should have about +24str in gear total when WSing, I'd say maybe +18str in gear while TPing, and I should be eating meat dishes which add, I'd have to check but I think +5 str for the most part, and I may or may not have Hasso up if I'm Drg/Sam, so again, what's another +2str to me?

                When I weigh all of that against +2% DA, I view the +2str/vit/acc as a marginal boost, the DA wins in my mind.

                Instead of only saying "this is stupid" I'd really rather see your reasoning as to WHY you think it is stupid.

                if your going to sub WAR then yeah Pole grip is a good idea, if not, stay with Mithral +1
                I am not in favor of using a Pole Grip as a lvl 60 Drg/War to boost your 10% DA rate to a 12% DA rate, this is a really marginal increase. Once you hit lvl 75 and can boost it up to a 19% DA rate, then I'm interested, until then, not so much. That being said at least for Drg/War I don't know if I'd go with the Mythril Grip +1 or the Pole Grip, both would be marginal increases to my mind. I suspect I would go with the Pole Grip though because I think that would be a better upgrade rather than sticking with the Mythril+1.

                pluss what build is this thread for, because DRG has many builds to it

                ACC build
                ATT build
                Haste build
                DA build
                mage build

                and thats just for PTs there are many varents to these for soloing
                There isn't going to be any *one* build. Everything will be in it's own place, with info on what you want to TP in, WS in, and so on.


                You have the right to remain silent, anything you say can and will be misqouted and then used against you.

                I don't have a big ego, it just has a large mouth.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Vyuru's Guide to the Dragoon

                  0.5 fSTR and +1% to hit rate vs 2% chance to land an additional hit?

                  I'll take the extra hit tyvm. Claymore Grip is nothing to scoff at either if you've got Drakesbane and Critical Hit merits. Not sure what would be better though, Claymore or Brave?
                  sigpic


                  "BLAH BLAH BLAH TIDAL WAVE!!!"

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                  • #10
                    Re: Vyuru's Guide to the Dragoon

                    That would require a good bit of parsing I'd imagine. However, either would be welcome in a Crit build, easily. If I had a group to do Nyzul with so I could go after Drakesbane, I might be inclined to give a Crit build a try (I already have capped Crit merits, and those lovely things get all my other jobs in trouble whenever I'm in the lower levels).

                    A Crit build would also love to see a Pahluwan Kazagand. Or better yet, Zahak's Mail. And Cletine. And maybe even a Trollbane if you spend a lot of time in TAU Beastmen territories. And your pick of Claymore or Brave grips.

                    I'm sure Drakesbane would love all that.
                    Last edited by LilithAngel; 12-29-2008, 04:37 AM. Reason: As much as I'd love to have Drakesbane itself...

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                    • #11
                      Re: Vyuru's Guide to the Dragoon

                      I just skimmed the last few posts. Lemme just say this:

                      2% more Double Attack is pretty much always +2% damage. +1% hit rate and an unnoticeable bonus to STR simply isn't as good. /war or not.

                      And the only multi-hit Polearm (Love) stacks with double attack, so I don't even need to add in the "unless using a multi-hit weapon" disclaimer.

                      But they're both such marginal increases. I would just look at it like this: You're a DRG. You have perma-Aggressor and lots of acc gear and the 2-handed changes working in your favor. If any DD is hitting the acc cap, it's the DRG first. 2% Double Attack will never get capped.

                      Looking decent, Vy.
                      "And if he left off dreaming about you, where do you suppose you'd be?"

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                      • #12
                        Re: Vyuru's Guide to the Dragoon

                        I have descended from Florida for but a brief instant to tell you that the correct answer is the 2% Double Attack.

                        Like they said, 2% is 2% whether you have /WAR or not, and that 2% extra damage is better than what the other grips offer. Also, it can kick in during WS for extra epeen damage.

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                        • #13
                          Re: Vyuru's Guide to the Dragoon

                          Originally posted by Armando View Post
                          I have descended from

                          Who the hell do you think you are

                          wb btw, for however brief.
                          sigpic


                          "BLAH BLAH BLAH TIDAL WAVE!!!"

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                          • #14
                            Re: Vyuru's Guide to the Dragoon

                            Originally posted by Armando View Post
                            I have descended from Florida for but a brief instant to tell you that the correct answer is the 2% Double Attack.

                            Like they said, 2% is 2% whether you have /WAR or not, and that 2% extra damage is better than what the other grips offer. Also, it can kick in during WS for extra epeen damage.
                            Thank you, I needed that!
                            Originally posted by Feba
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                            Originally posted by Taskmage
                            God I hate my periods. You think passing a clot through a vagina is bad? Try it with a penis.
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                            ...I'm shitting dicks out of my eyeballs in excitement for the next bestgreating game of all time ever.

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                            • #15
                              Re: Vyuru's Guide to the Dragoon

                              Aside from what Lmnop and Armando said, I just want to add one more thing:

                              Originally posted by Vyuru View Post
                              At level 60 I should have about +24str in gear total when WSing, I'd say maybe +18str in gear while TPing, and I should be eating meat dishes which add, I'd have to check but I think +5 str for the most part, and I may or may not have Hasso up if I'm Drg/Sam, so again, what's another +2str to me?
                              If you're DRG60/SAM30 you WILL have Hasso up, because you don't get Seigan until 70/35. Until then the only "downside" to Hasso is being too awesome and pulling hate - but you're a DRG, so you don't even have to worry about that. (Much. You still want to check your SJ cooldown before pulling WS, Med, WS in one fight.)

                              I don't know if the rest of the DRGs on this thread remember hitting 60, or if they did it before Hasso and the /SAM revolution, but it's an insane power trip. You *will* laugh like a supervillain at the sheer awesomeness of Meditate added to Hasso and damaging jumps with Store TP and hate-shedding jumps so it isn't suicide for you the way it would be for other DDs.
                              Defeated: Maat, Divine Might, Fenrir, Kirin, Cactrot Rapido, Xolotl, Diabolos Prime, Kurrea, 9/10 Dynamis Bosses (missing Tav), Promathia, Proto-Ultima, Proto-Omega, 4 Jailers, Apocalypse Nigh, 6/6 Nyzul Bosses
                              RDM90, PLD90, DRG90, COR90, SCH90, BLU54
                              All Nations Rank 10, ZMs & PMs Complete, AUMs Complete, Captain, Nyzul Floor 100 (5 Weapons, 4 WS), Medal of Altana, WotG Mission 15, 1/3 Addons Complete, 9/9 Abyssea Main Quests, 6/6 Caturae

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