DRG Elitist BS

[Karinya]

Re: DRG Elitist BS

Gloves: I think I wore them for the most part. The Spiked Finger Gauntlets are nice but a bit overpriced for that level.

Well, I was fortunate enough to get them from the BCNM after 3 or 4 attempts. They *are* a bit pricey, but very nice IMO.

Legs: 10% on breaths is nice, sure. With a breath of 100-200 that will give you another 10-20 hp. Personally, though I think the +5 to attack from Republic Sub. (or +7 from greaves, depending on Conquest) will lead to a larger DoT overall. I pretty much stuck with those two til Barone.

Well, I wasn't comfortable with giving up so much def and hp *and* wyvern hp for +5 atk (and that's for the HQ!), considering how often monsters turn on me even with PLD tanks (not to mention aoe), but I'll concede that it's a matter of taste. Offensive stats are more important than defensive ones point-for-point, but you can't afford to ignore defense completely unless you like getting oneshotted when a monster turns and WSes.

Feet: I used them for Jumps and High Jumps but I macro'ed them in. I think I stuck with Leaping/Bounding and Federation Gaiters (again, depending on Conquest).

I have to laugh at this coming from someone who said spiked finger gauntlets are overpriced. They cost about the same as leaping boots and are much more beneficial. (If you're lucky enough to have bounding boots, they're fine, but personally despite dozens of hours camping I have never even *seen* Lizzy, let alone claimed her or gotten the drop, so I certainly wouldn't *expect* someone to have them.)

In fact, if the OP sold the SH he could probably afford SFGs, jaridah peti and a woodsman ring, giving him the same acc and about 15 more atk. He'd lose 15 evasion but I don't rely on evading anything in a party anyway.

AF has its uses, just because I didn't melee full time with it doesn't mean others can't. The guy comes off as an ass but people are like that sometimes.
Honestly, until the Feral set at 63, a lot of our gear is patchwork at best. They added a ton of awesome gear at endgame for Dragoons with Homam, Barone and the Assault sets... but up until then its a mixed bag.

And in particular there's nothing really good in the legs or feet until very high levels, which is why I wear AF in those slots at 56. Tiger/feral is OK, and I will probably get it since it's cheap, but it's too high level for the OP anyway.

I would worry about anyone who meleed full time in AF *body* - because there *are* very nice body items available at that level, some of them quite affordable, which could noticeably increase your damage output. Head is arguable - you will certainly want the AF for WS, while it may be worthwhile to keep a valk/walk for normal swings, if you have limited gil it may be better spent elsewhere. (Of course the unspoken assumption of some people is that you *don't* have limited gil. Why they assume that is left as an exercise for the reader.) The rest of the slots there either isn't anything particularly good until higher levels, or there's only one piece and it's expensive (SFGs).


"STR is better than ATK for WS" - well, no. Only wheeling thrust. For most WS, attack is king. (For penta you may get better results from acc, at least up to a point.) As a /WAR I'd be surprised if you haven't already noticed how much more damage your WS do while berserk - that proves the effectiveness of attack for WS. (Except on too weaks, where you really can cap it.) Wheeling thrust is an exception in some situations because of its special property to ignore defense - it's essentially a quite powerful def down that only applies to that one attack. That makes it possible to cap your atk without really trying and *then* STR becomes better.


Aside from the SFGs, the main thing I would suggest the OP improve in his gear is *exactly the pieces he was trying to get by Assault* when some asshat criticized him for not already having the gear he was trying to earn. Way to not think things through, moron.

It wouldn't hurt to get acc rings for tp - and conversely, a swordbelt for WS - and start swapping between them, but there's nothing wrong with assailant ring in the right situation - I use it myself. Acc rings can be pretty pricy (that's one reason I like jaeger, but not everyone knows enough 40+ SMNs to go get it).

[eticket109]

Re: DRG Elitist BS

As far as Leaping/Bounding, I camped those. I wouldn't pay for them either, but nowadays its a lot easier to camp them, especially now that the placeholders are easy to research. Typically, its easier to obtain those then the Gauntlets, but who knows... Lizzy is a bitch.

Like you said though, the body piece is the only one I would really have an issue with someone meleeing in and he wasn't doing that anyway. In parties, I preferred to use the Valk. Mask til I hit 70 but that's just me.

I think the only spendy item I would recommend at his stage would be an Assault Earring. That will serve a DRG well until they get into some of the endgame earrings like Brutal, Ethereal or Triumph.

As for rings, keep in mind the Venerer if you need Acc... the quest is a bit long but free is free.

For the OP: know this... once you hit 70, the armor path for us gets a lot better.

[Vyuru]

Re: DRG Elitist BS

Honestly, I think that dragoon was way out of line. The rest of the Assualt LS was out of line making you sit on the back lines as well IMO because depending on your sub, and especially for a lvl 60 lvl cap (assuming that's what you guys used here) Your gear is more than adequate and your team were idiots for making you sit on the back lines for it.

I think he might have been giving you some decent advice for other gear, but honestly I don't feel that the other pieces would boost your performance by that much, Rebulic/Bastokan subligar instead of AF legs? So that's what, +3/5 attack, yeah, that's REALLY gonna make a difference while Berserk is up. So given that and your other gear, I would not be calling you gimp by any means, it's just different gear than I would use, and in addition to that it is all still good gear.

I like the AF legs and feet, and I just don't see any gear that really *might* be better for them until you get lvl 70+, everything before then is really a tossup based on player preference. Do you want +3/5attack or +10% wyvern breath damage? I'd rather take the +wyvern breath damage based on the amount of skillchaining I do.

Decide whatever is best for you, and good luck in all of your endeavors.

[LadyKiKi]

Re: DRG Elitist BS

That person makes the game so unfun.

Likewise, in my linkshell there's 1 other DRG. Level 60. She wears full AF as of now. Being a mother of 2 and staticing with her boyfriend (RDM) and another friend (PLD), she made it to 60 somehow. I know for a fact she hasn't got as much time to farm much, so her equip is a bit under par, but those 3 along the way, I really admire the fun they have in their parties it seems.

She's never said to me about people complaining about her gear (as it seems according to elitists, by 60 DRGs should be sporting a chiv chain, scorpion harness, spiked finer gauntlets, dual wood/sniper rings, etc).

I just, really admire the stuff and fun they seem to have together. Like at one time I couldn't make it down to Garlaige/Beadueux to help their PLD with a coffer key but yet those 3 did it fine all the same. Getting good gear when it's possible, and doing stuff slowly at their own pace.

It's kinda hard to explain what I'm trying to get at here, but their or that sense of fun I don't think anything could replace. The people, like the DRG that was mentioned in the opening post, are the ones who make it less fun for people. I personally haven't encountered anyone like this, but then again I haven't partied for a year and hardly go do group stuffs. In my linkshell of about 15 people the "levels" of standard stretches very very far. I don't recall any one of us saying anything about each other's gear, except one time I had an Oscar Scarf on and someone asked "what the hell is that?".

Linkshell leader and "co" leader, they're in the "elite" stages I'd say (they do dynamis/sky a lot). Then there's the people who don't do any endgame stuff (me and a few others) with gear that goes by (no AF2/God Gear/Sea Gear, etc) and the rest who aren't level 65+ yet but are slowly getting there (they all work/have family). You can say our shell is full of "old" people nearly, in a way. We just logon and get on with it and worry about ourselves, rather than others.

If you play the game up to the point where you emotionally care about what other people wear and just moan and not consider their circumstances, just think again, maybe.

[Malacite]

Re: DRG Elitist BS

Dude, that blows. I wouldn't quit FF XI over that, but I definately would have called a GM. That's blatant harassment.

[SomeMithra]

Re: DRG Elitist BS

All this talk about gear has finally got me to say something.

I am a Mithra DRG, level 74 now. But this isnt about what level I am now, its about a time when I was exping in Bibiki Bay(yeah I know NO one exp's out there anymore but we did because the WHM didn't have ToAU or something). Anyway I was about 65-67 at that point and I was exping with another DRG. Get to camp and I notice hes in full AF so I /check him. His gear is full AF, chiv chain, STR rings, life belt, amemet mantle, 2 +5 ATT earrings, and a GKL. Customarily I /salute him and we begin exping. His full AF gear doesn't change all fight. Really his gear is acceptable outside of AF in my opinion.

In the end I had much more exspensve gear all around, I mean SH, walk mask, assault earring, minuet earring, snipers, ect. Heres the thing, end result damage, I wasn't really out DDIng him much. He was a hume dragoon either same level or one above me. Now I know a single level can make a big differance, but out WS's were hitting about the same, and our normal hits were too. This occurance really had a huge effect on my perspective in the game. It honestly seems like gear does not make a huge influence on how much damage is delt once it reaches a certain point. Or maybe character race really does play a big role on DD classes.

As for attacks on people due to gear. I find it silly, even before this development. I mean I know plenty of Dragoons who don't have the best gear out there and use subpar gear in a few slots and I never once harrased them for it. Sometimes I offer some advise on things to farm and the such so that they can eventually afford better gear, but beyyound that i don't comment much more. In fact I think most people with poor gear know so since they are constantly quick to defend themselves and say they are unable to afford certain gear and will one day, so what's the point in even bothing to bring it up?

Anyway I may have rambled some of that off, I was sort of watching a poker game while typing so, yeah wasnt 100% focued, think i got my point across though...

[Vyuru]

Re: DRG Elitist BS

Well, I do think gear makes a difference to a point, but if you have really good accessories, and pretty good gear, there won't be too much of a difference between you and someone who just has really good gear all around.

There is just a point where stacking on more +stat gear won't be as effective as it once was, this point constantly shifts depending on your level and what you are fighting and the mob's level. Most people expect a player to come with the best of the best gear when they party even though all that +1 gear might not really matter.

[Greylynx]

Re: DRG Elitist BS

Ladykiki, I really like your point. I would also consider myself one of those casual players. I don't need or even want the best gear available. I just wanna be a good DRG and have fun. Seems like all the hardcore players these days don't even tolerate the people who just wanna have fun. Its a shame too, cause they will just end up driving us out of the game, then they'll complain that the servers are empty.

SomeMithra, your story is great. Really points out the fact that the "elite" players will harass you over wearing your AF because they read on alla or wherever that you shouldn't. Its not necessarily a case of XPing in AF is bad, its just that its popular to make fun of people who XP in AF. I'm not saying there isn't better gear for XPing, there is. But AF might not be as bad as everyone thinks it is.

Just an update on my story for those that care. I have been away from the game for 2 weeks. Its tough because I miss my friends and all, but the break is doing wonders for me. Still haven't decided if I am going to come back or not. I'm not sure when or if I'll know that I am ready to have fun and forget about what others think.

Anyway, thanks again for all the comments everyone!

[Emurei]

Re: DRG Elitist BS

That dude wasn't elitist... anal retentive yes :p

I consider myself elitist as a SAM, I don't have the best of gear, above average yes. Ok maybe I'm not elitist <.< If I ever party with another SAM I don't even bother checking them till they do something wrong. Biggest thing they do wrong is not knowing the WS chart! Like come on guys thats like SAM Basics 101! Ok its a Pev of mine <.<

I think the basics is far more important to be elitist about than the gear you wear. With out the basics how can one build a foundation to succeed later on? (unless they bought gil)

Though someone did pull a "Why don't you have the O-Hat?" crap on me once. I wear the SAM Relic Helm which has the same Acc, 5 less R.Acc, no Evasion, More HP and Def than O-Hat, but it looks very simular to the AF Helm. Jokingly I replied "Nah I'm not into the bad kid that had to sit in the corner durning class look" mind you he said this in party chat, so EVERYONE examined me and I did a /blush. One of the mages pointed "Hes wearing the AFII Helm" He was like "o" so being the prick that I am (he started it!) I checked him, and behold a NQ Hauby "So.... Don't you have a Hauby+1? " the party had a laugh, though I don't think he thought it was funny :p

[DakAttack]

Re: DRG Elitist BS

I leveled Dragoon back when they had mostly crappy gear. I had a SH at one point, but it disappeared from my bazaar one day. I got really lucky and managed to obtain an O-hat, and it became the highlight of my wardrobe. I got a lot of repeat invites despite my gear, which was nice. I think from level 60-72 I was partying with a repeat inviter. There was at least four or five of them.

[AchillisGT]

Re: DRG Elitist BS

Ok, I'm going to make this simple and direct to start;
This is only a game!

This is basically the first blog thread I've ever written because I usually don't bother, but after reading this, a few things started pissing me off.

I had a party were I was the leader and had a blm loudmouth. He was dissing my whm for a death the first fight... to make a long story short, I booted him, grabbed a smn, then ended up lvling 4 levels that night. He claimed it was messed up that I booted him, and he harrassed me and the whm for 10 min after, but I repeated: Dude, this is just a game. He claimed he waited 8 hours for a party, yet he didn't know i waited 4 weeks before deciding to start my own. I had an even worse incident as I was leveling whm, but this is for Drg, my favorite job.

Dude, don't let the punk win. Get back on and do it right and do it your way. I'm only a 37Drg/18War or Whm, so I don't have your expirience with that high of level, but screw him. On Odin, my whole ls, Dragooncirca, is all dragoons, either as a main , a hopeful, or friends with one. Not a single person is a jerk and not a one punks anyone else out, except when jerks, like in your situation, try to punk one of us. Every real dragoon knows that the job is based on individual strategies (such as my stupidity in grabbing alittle tanking for fun when the tank needs a sec) so no REAL dragoon can knock anyother. Don't let that dude or even ls win... you have the knowledge, get back on and tear some a$$. Next time, ignore him or drop out of the ls... its more fun to be in control and start your own.

For all you dragoons or hopefuls on Odin who want a real ls, with dragoons and dragoons with other jobs at all different level (including high 60's, and a couple 70's that pop on from time to time), I am on Odin and carry a sack for Dragooncirca. We currently have the 2-3 dragon record at 3:32ish and many have done this and the drg quest dragon several times. Give me (Marz, glowatoke or even Vatslav and ktulufire) a /tell, and you'll have all the help and friends you'll need. Name is Achillis

[Yeargdribble]

Re: DRG Elitist BS

I will agree the DRG was probably out of line. I don't check people, and even if I do for some reason, I don't feel the need to tell them how crappy their gear is even if I think it is.

However, when you bring it to a forum like this, you've opened yourself up for dissection. There are superior gear choices and you even had some of them. What I am bothered most by is this.

Why does it suck? Because everyone on allah says it does?

You seem to be attacking the general internet community it seems. It doesn't suck because Alla says it sucks... It sucks because... it sucks. The biggest reason is that there are pieces that are FAR superior on almost every slot. If you have most of them, why not wear them?

Me: Yeah I have that stuff except the mask, but I use it when te situation warrents it.

When does the situation warrant it? Only if someone calls you out in XP for wearing AF instead of the better choices? There is a place for town gear. If you only wear your AF for running around, that's cool. However, if you XP in it when you have better choices, that's problematic, especially considering you actually own the better gear.

Sure this game is just a game and we all pay to play how we want, but keep in mind that you are playing with other real people who also have real lives. There's no reason to not be the best you can reasonably be.

While is sounds like you have fairly reasonable gear, and if you XP in decent gear, I have no quarrel, I can understand his point of view to an extent. There are a lot of DRGs (and DRKs) out there that are just absolutely horrible. They have crap for gear and don't seem to care with the excuse of "my game, my way" or whatever. In all honesty, the plethora of bad players that flock to these two jobs is what gives them a bad name.

I've been parsing my damage while leveling DRG (I'm fairly low level) and between me and Flink, I end up parsing somewhere between 45-55% of the entire PTs damage every time I XP. I'm sure DRGs can't parse so well at higher levels, but it's the ones that suck that give DRG a bad rep.

Certain jobs can have crap for gear and still do great damage. DRG doesn't seem to be one of these jobs. DRGs have to work harder to keep their names out of the mud. I wince every time I see the horrible types of DRGs that create a stimga that costs me invites.


If you're doing the best you can, then go you and forget that guy. Have fun ^^

[Greylynx]

Re: DRG Elitist BS

You seem to be attacking the general internet community it seems. It doesn't suck because Alla says it sucks... It sucks because... it sucks. The biggest reason is that there are pieces that are FAR superior on almost every slot. If you have most of them, why not wear them?

I really have to argue the point that there is equipment that is FAR superior in every slot. Lets look at it one at a time:

Body: AF --> SH, Peti
Hands AF --> SFG

Your absolutely right, these slots have much better choices. You'll notice I do have a SH. The SFG are alittle too pricey for me right now... The other solid choice, Battle Gloves, I do use when my accuracy is bad but thats seldom is the case these days. I have admited in retrospect that maybe some of the other gigas bracelets are worth looking into, but STR isn't really a problem, I would want ATT and I don't know of any other ATT gloves at this stage.

Head: AF --> Walk Mask

Walkure Mask is better yes, and I want to get one. FAR superior though? Not sure.

Legs: AF ---> Bastokian Subligar
Feet: AF ---> ???

There is no FAR superior choice here until Feral Set at 63, and I am only 61 so its a moot point really. Bastokian Subligar with +3 Strength isn't really going to make a difference in a party. And the feet? I dunno maybe leaping/bounding boots? Again, its not FAR superior.

I really believe that some of the AF (not all) is acceptable until 63. When I hit 63 I was going to buy the Feral Hands, Legs, and Feet. I'll was also looking into the Walk Mask. So you can see by the time I hit 63 I wasn't going to be in any AF (except MAYBE the helm) anyway.

[Karinya]

Re: DRG Elitist BS

It doesn't suck because Alla says it sucks... It sucks because... it sucks. The biggest reason is that there are pieces that are FAR superior on almost every slot. If you have most of them, why not wear them?

No, there aren't (at least, not at the level he was at). There's a very nice, affordable body piece that you should definitely have (Jaridah Peti); some semi-affordable head pieces that are nice to have (Valk/Walk masks); a very expensive but quite nice hand piece (spiked finger gauntlets); and there's jack in the legs and feet slots before Tiger, and even that isn't very impressive (to get really good leg and feet items you have to wait for 70+). If you're lucky enough to have bounding boots you might consider swapping between them and AF, but if you *buy* leaping or winged boots to do so you're wasting money IMO.

Wearing full AF full time is silly and needlessly hurts your performance; wearing some AF full time and swapping in some for specific situations/actions is quite reasonable (in fact, I would argue you're generally hurting yourself if you *don't* at least wear AF helm for WS and AF feet for jumps).

I've been parsing my damage while leveling DRG (I'm fairly low level) and between me and Flink, I end up parsing somewhere between 45-55% of the entire PTs damage every time I XP. I'm sure DRGs can't parse so well at higher levels, but it's the ones that suck that give DRG a bad rep.

Actually, you might be surprised. A BLM friend of mine was in a colibri party with me the other day and measured me and my wyvern at (total) upwards of 40% of the total damage - he was second at around 25-30%, I think. That's piercing weak mobs, though - if you were doing 50% of the whole party's damage on *non* piercing weak mobs, then you just need better parties. :D

BTW: I've never seen one of the DRGs that suck. What server are they on? I also don't think DRG really gets any worse invite rates than any other DD, unless the party is being formed to fight bones - it just seems horrible if you're used to being some job other than DD (and it's hard to find/form parties from 40-70 in general, recently).

[Yeargdribble]

Re: DRG Elitist BS

Body: There's really no debate that either Peti or SH is superior. If you have enough acc build you could even argue that Peti > SH, though both are far better than AF for XP PTs.

Hands: SFG are great, especially if you have decent acc. Battle Gloves or Jaridah Bazubands both outperform the DRG. In XP, your DoT will be far more important than your Wyvern's DoT and you have no need for parry. Acc+3 > DEX +3 by far.

Head: Walk/Valk Mask better for your DoT vs the Wyverns just like with the hands. Slighly less far and away better than the above.

Legs: Republic Subligar (or cuisses depending on conquest) are waaay better than the AF legs. AF legs add absolutely nothing for a PT DRG. Something > nothing always. (btw the subligar is Atk, not STR) I'd say these are even less up for debate than the head.

Feet: Fed Gaiters or Rep Greaves (both conquest sadly) toast the AF feet except perhaps for a jump macro. However, these may not be worth the money or effort to carry around for some people (understandably so). These are probably the most debatable.



The sad part is, if you were almost any other jobs, nobody would care. DRG just naturally has a bad rept, so you have to be more careful I suppose. Sad but true. I'm being especially conscientious about DRG for that very reason. I'd just say that if you have the better pieces there's no reason not to wear them (aside from vanity). I highly doubt that your acc is so high that you aren't getting any benefit from the Battle Gloves. When you only give up a few stats over several slots, it can add up.

Generally though, I think the other guy is definitely in the wrong for make a spectacle of pointing you out.