This may sound silly, but...

[Deeman]

I had a friend who left the game that I was static'd with back in the day. His first job was 75 war. He had 8/8 Axe Merits so when we started (me on rdm and him on drk), he went /nin and used Axes. His axe skill was obviously higher than everything else. In my 3-4 years of playing, he was the biggest DD I've ever seen! Souleater+Last Resort+Rampage (which he got a few lvls before a WAR would) would do 800-1k! And this was at lvl 55ish on KRT bats! Even his regular hits were insane. I'm not trying to knock anyone who doesnt have merits or anything, just letting you know that /nin (with the right merits/gear) can be a great sub for DRK.

oh if you plan on playing DRK this way, grab a good pld tank, cause you'll rip hate right off in a few hits and Cover will be your best friend lol.

[Antivomit]

Re: This may sound silly, but...

How do you get merits? I got a lvl 27 drk and I have seen some people talk about merit, but I have no idea what they are. Is it end game stuff? Quest stuff?

[Murphie]

Re: This may sound silly, but...

I wonder if there is anything about Merits out there?

[Icemage]

Re: This may sound silly, but...

How do you get merits? I got a lvl 27 drk and I have seen some people talk about merit, but I have no idea what they are. Is it end game stuff? Quest stuff?

Merits are upgrades you can buy with "excess" XP at level 75.

You can only buy merit upgrades for skills, abilities, traits or attributes that your level 75 job(s) possess, so since I have White Mage, Bard, and Red Mage at 75, I can buy things like Divine Magic skill (WHM), Singing skill (BRD), Sword skill (RDM), Cure Cast Time Reduction (WHM), Slow II (RDM), Foe Sirvente (BRD), etc.

However, I can't buy Axe skill because none of my level 75 jobs have that skill.


Icemage

[eticket109]

Re: This may sound silly, but...

edit: deleting merit info as it was posted above lol

I've read about DRK/NIN being used a few times at high levels there's of course a ton of debate on which is better but it can work great in some situations.

[tdh]

Re: This may sound silly, but...

Well, provided you have a job at Lv.75 that can Merit Axe (WAR, BST, RNG, & DRK), and you've gained the required EXP/Merit pts to dump a full 8 Merits into Axe, DRK/NIN with Axe would be viable until Lv.60. In the 50's you'd have access to Axe Skill +8 I believe. (4 of the possible 8 Merits, and each Skill Merit yields 2 skill points. If this is incorrect, somebody please correct me.)

So at Lv.55 a DRK with those Merits would actually have a higher Axe Skill than a WAR who has no Merits. Personally, at Lv.58 with out a single Axe Merit, or even a cap'd Axe Skill, I landed a Souleater Rampage for 1300+dmg Vs. an EM Scorp. So DRK Rampages can be devistating to say the least, yet so can a DRK/WAR and Souleater Guillotine. (My current record is 1579 Vs. VT Colibri.)

Once you get into the 70's, there's a 20+ point difference between a WAR's Axe skill and a DRK's Axe skill. I'm not sure if all 8 Merits are in effect at Lv.70 or Lv.75, but you may start to notice the difference in skill. I would say by Lv.65 a DRK should go back to their A rated weapons and their more usual subs.

[Aeni]

Re: This may sound silly, but...

tdh is right. Once you get into your 60s, your damage will pale to the other DRKs who are doing massive damage with their new "toy" WSs while you're stuck in a rut with the same Raging Axe you've been performing for over 50 levels. Oh, it doesn't get better with Mistral Axe either.

Need to add that I think your friend is skewing numbers with hard-to-obtain equipment, weapon and expensive meats (Red Curry for example) putting out numbers like that.

[Lmnop]

Re: This may sound silly, but...

Aeni somehow forgot about Rampage.

As Bside posted over a year ago, drk/nin is a great combo even without merits. The ideal levels are 56-60 (56 is when DRK naturally learns Rampage, 60 is when Guillotine can replace it). Rampage is already friggin' potent, the fact that you get up to 6 hits worth of Souleater damage on top of that is insane. Especially since with just one Viking Axe offhanded and a nice damaging Darksteel Axe(+1) mainhanded, you have 3 higher acc than you do with GS/Scythe (unless you have Vassago's, that puts Scythe at +2 over single Viking. In which case, you can always dual wield vikings for +8 over Vassago).

So yeah, drk/nin = really good for a few levels. Also, Dual Wield gives you 3-hit Raging Axes, which means from 30-56, dual axes gives you the highest bang out of Souleater (well, dual swords is technically just as good as well as swinging more during your minute). Buuuut I'd rather be a Drk/war through there with higher DoT anyway.

[Nerotu]

Re: This may sound silly, but...

I wonder if there is anything about Merits out there?

I know I wonder too, can anyone help me?

[Aeni]

Re: This may sound silly, but...

Aeni somehow forgot about Rampage.

Well, sorta, kinda. I have Rampage too and since I'm not 75 yet, my axe isn't high enough to get Mistral Axe.

It's nice if you don't miss. Rampage seems to not like me, because of the lower rating with the weapon and the fact that DRKs don't go for DW enhancements the way a lot of WAR/NINs do. Can a DRK wield Tungi? That's something that has always interested me as well.

Anyway, in my personal opinion, Rampage on IT is horrible. Souleater can help with accuracy, but you'd pull too much hate and have the healer dump insane amounts of MP to heal you (remember, you won't have SATA and utsu recast on anyone who's not used to doing it is lol against a fast attacking IT mob)

[tdh]

Re: This may sound silly, but...

Can a DRK wield Tungi? That's something that has always interested me as well.

Yes we can. As soon as I got one, I went and got suited up as DRK to test it out.

Tungi helped me break my previous Rampage record. I also like the look of the Beastman Axes, but I wanted it for my WAR which has been laying dormant at Lv.52 for quite some time.

Anyway, in my personal opinion, Rampage on IT is horrible. Souleater can help with accuracy, but you'd pull too much hate and have the healer dump insane amounts of MP to heal you (remember, you won't have SATA and utsu recast on anyone who's not used to doing it is lol against a fast attacking IT mob)

Rampage is quite sad against IT mobs, but I bet WAR/NIN, and the very few DRK/NINs who get to Rampage Colibri are quite happy. So for that 5 to 6 Lv. range, Rampage has got to be a lotta fun!

[Aeni]

Re: This may sound silly, but...

Yes we can. As soon as I got one, I went and got suited up as DRK to test it out.

Tungi helped me break my previous Rampage record. I also like the look of the Beastman Axes, but I wanted it for my WAR which has been laying dormant at Lv.52 for quite some time.

That's an axe I meant to get but never got around to getting. Thanks for your story as it has piqued my interest a bit.

Rampage is quite sad against IT mobs, but I bet WAR/NIN, and the very few DRK/NINs who get to Rampage Colibri are quite happy. So for that 5 to 6 Lv. range, Rampage has got to be a lotta fun!

WAR/NIN, yes, but DRK/NIN? Only a merited DRK with a lot of nice rare/ex (In WoW, we use the word "twinked") goodies can. Again, I've used Rampage on VT Orcs (Back in my low 60s) in Davoi before and I lol'd at the paltry returns. Even with Souleater.

[Lmnop]

Re: This may sound silly, but...

Vikings.

[Macht]

Re: This may sound silly, but...

Lol, really damage output in general can change not only by skill but how well equipped you are. For example I started raising WAR again (had too, not at 37 yet and RNGs level is well past what WAR is).

To my surprise I'm finding the current 34-37 players do absolutly horrible damage on my World. Every WAR, NIN, BLM, BLU, MNK, SAM, RNG, etc.. of that level in the parties I've been in have pitifull damage outputs. The best melee damage result I saw in 1 cycle was 44 damage from a SAM, the NINs if lucky got out 20 total, other WARs getting 25-50 (If double attack kicked in), out of mages the best was 105 but frequently 80s.

I was a bit surprised to see that and then see the damage output I was doing. I had 60s going on just 1 Axe swing, critical for 100, was using Smash Axe and getting 300 from it. I was dishing out so much damage that I had no use of provoke in my parties because the mob hardly every turned from me. Another WAR even tried to provoke it off me when my health got dangerous low, the mob didn't even look his direction.

This was without any Merits, so of course more info is needed there. I know my damage output was a result of keeping up with the best suitable weapon + focused effort on raising STR + Attack (+20 STR and +25 Attack). More info about the gear he used and all you might find his damage was a result of something similar to mine.

I mean if you look at it 60 on a single swing with two axes and hitting double attacks twice there's a total of 240 potential damage. I'm over twice the damage that the mages I've recently partied with have produced and almost 5x more damage then other melees I've recently partied with.

That's an axe I meant to get but never got around to getting. Thanks for your story as it has piqued my interest a bit.
WAR/NIN, yes, but DRK/NIN? Only a merited DRK with a lot of nice rare/ex (In WoW, we use the word "twinked") goodies can. Again, I've used Rampage on VT Orcs (Back in my low 60s) in Davoi before and I lol'd at the paltry returns. Even with Souleater.

You are aware the term "Twinking" came way before WoW. It's used in EQ and was even used in older games like UO.

[tdh]

Re: This may sound silly, but...

That's an axe I meant to get but never got around to getting. Thanks for your story as it has piqued my interest a bit.

WAR/NIN, yes, but DRK/NIN? Only a merited DRK with a lot of nice rare/ex (In WoW, we use the word "twinked") goodies can. Again, I've used Rampage on VT Orcs (Back in my low 60s) in Davoi before and I lol'd at the paltry returns. Even with Souleater.

I believe even more so with DRK. The lack of Berserk and Aggressor, and the /recast for Souleater and the hate that comes with it.

When I learned Rampage I was Lv.57 or Lv.58, and I learned it against Robber Crabs in the Tunnel. Most of the crabs were T for my level and skill, but my first few Rampages were under 300dmg. I didn't try any Souleater Rampages since it was just a NIN from my LS and myself. I could Drain back any subsequent damage, but would take a while to Drain back Souleater damage. Even with Acc+57, Sushi, and Souleater I would miss a hit and it was showing in my damage.

It wasn't until later that I decided to try my luck against DC or EM mobs and started to startle myself and my NIN friend. I was practically one shotting DC Telwar Scorps in Altepa with Rampage, my record in the high 1300's. At Lv.61 I grabbed my Tungi and went to destroy some Cockatrice outside of Port Jeuno. 1st one I pulled, I hit my "Death Cocktail" Macro (Berserk, Last Resort, and Souleater) and fired off a 1450+ Rampage that left me with about 540HP. lol

Might be fun to go DRK/NIN against Shadow Lord next time a LS member needs to get Rank 6, but Guillotine is just tons of fun. I don't know if I'd be able to break 1500 with Guillotine against Shadow Lord, but I have done it a handful of times in EXP. Never know.