Possible way to solve the TP burn problem?

[Karinya]

Re: Possible way to solve the TP burn problem?

I support the idea of Drain2 and Aspir2, and a Spirit Taker like spell for BLM. Possibly DRK too, they seem a little left out. Unlike other 2h weapon users, they can't take full advantage of the /SAM changes because of the impact on recasts; and they have a perennial problem with 0-mp mobs. (Although Parade Gorget might help with that.)

But I also agree with Jei that the monsters are the real problem, as I have posted elsewhere.


Manaburns were originally formed before TAU because they got more exp than a traditional party. The only thing that could match them was a monkburn in KRT and there was only room for maybe 2 of those. (And that's if you could find enough monks in the first place.) Other meleeburns (e.g. Ru'Avitau weapons) did about as well as a balanced party.

It's only after TAU allowed 5 DDs and a BRD to make double the exp of any balanced party setup *or* manaburn that BLMs have started to feel left out. Well, don't come to a paladin for sympathy. Or a white mage, either, for that matter.

Overall I think the exp vs. monster level curves could stand some re-examination at the high levels. But most importantly, imps, colibris and puks need to be either toughened to be on par with other monsters of their level, or have their levels lowered to match their stats. Easy monsters shouldn't give the same XP as hard monsters.

[Hell-bottom]

Re: Possible way to solve the TP burn problem?

(Excuse me..) Mana burn is already faster than TP-Burn . BLM rules

[Icemage]

Re: Possible way to solve the TP burn problem?

(Excuse me..) Mana burn is already faster than TP-Burn . BLM rules

Manaburn is not as efficient as TP-burn. Close to, but definitely not faster.


Icemage

[Hell-bottom]

Re: Possible way to solve the TP burn problem?

when i was at level 70 i got in a 69~72 PT in King's ronberrys tomb 5 BLMs and a RDM (yes not BRD) pulling takes 15~20 second , when the skeleton appears we start nuking with Firaga3 , the minute he gets in the melee range he becomes a toasted Bone .. that takes 10~15 seconds . and we rest while the RDM pulls .
and don't forget the incredible Exp we get ~200 per fight or so .

[Icemage]

Re: Possible way to solve the TP burn problem?

when i was at level 70 i got in a 69~72 PT in King's ronberrys tomb 5 BLMs and a RDM (yes not BRD) pulling takes 15~20 second , when the skeleton appears we start nuking with Firaga3 , the minute he gets in the melee range he becomes a toasted Bone .. that takes 10~15 seconds . and we rest while the RDM pulls .
and don't forget the incredible Exp we get ~200 per fight or so .

Yes, and with a 15 minute respawn. Yadda yadda. You're not pulling in better than 12K per hour in a manaburn in KRT no matter what you do with a manaburn party. Been there, done that, have the levels to prove it.

In the mean time I was scoring 14-15K per hour at the same level range in Bhaflau Thickets with TP burn parties. Level 75 fully merited parties can do even better - close to 18K/hour.


Icemage

[Hell-bottom]

Re: Possible way to solve the TP burn problem?

if what you're saying is true then thank god i dinged 75 b4 TOAU , some one i know gave up on his BLM @67 ..oh well ... ~sound fainting~ long live the blms...

[Clades]

Re: Possible way to solve the TP burn problem?

A Super-Refresh wouldn't be the answer, that ability would make BLMs waaaaaaaay too powerful.

For Merit TP Burn Parties, maybe SE could change Utsusemi:Ni from 37 to 38. Maybe that wouldn't help though...

[Hell-bottom]

Re: Possible way to solve the TP burn problem?

imagine if they raised utsusemin:NI to 38 , then after 2 weaks the raise the level cap to 80 lol , thats SE for ya

[Neomage]

Re: Possible way to solve the TP burn problem?

Well, mabye I was wrong about manaburns, but from personal experiance, the one's I've been in got about 2k less then my standard EXP party. I duno, I'm still 67 so mabye manaburns actually become worthwhile up higher, but from personal experience I've gotten 5k/hour at best in a manaburn and I see melees the same level bragging about twice as much.

[TenchiHawkwing]

Re: Possible way to solve the TP burn problem?

lol, I'm going to laugh when either of the burns does get nerfed for xp, then of course the nerfed side is going to complain until SE nerfs the previously-not-nerfed side... then we'll all be getting slower exp.

[Icemage]

Re: Possible way to solve the TP burn problem?

lol, I'm going to laugh when either of the burns does get nerfed for xp, then of course the nerfed side is going to complain until SE nerfs the previously-not-nerfed side... then we'll all be getting slower exp.

I'm fully expecting a nerf for TP-burns in the near future in some form or other. The current state of affairs is eerily similar to the situation that was in effect prior to the TP-nerf back in early 2004, and also of the arrowburn madness that swept Vana'diel about a year ago right before the RNG nerf.


Icemage

[Kaickul]

Re: Possible way to solve the TP burn problem?

I'm fully expecting a nerf for TP-burns in the near future in some form or other. The current state of affairs is eerily similar to the situation that was in effect prior to the TP-nerf back in early 2004, and also of the arrowburn madness that swept Vana'diel about a year ago right before the RNG nerf.


Icemage

Yes! Nerf melee because SE implements an area of easy to kill mobs for merit Exp along with implementing loads of TP + gaining equipment in the past year.





Come on... why? Did my previous post just get completely ignored for the statements presented?

[Yuanlung]

Re: Possible way to solve the TP burn problem?

IMO, nerfs just aren't the answer. That just drives more people to quit.

BLM really isn't the victim of the burn party phenomena. Hack, we pioneered it.


The reason why burn parties work is that there is no incentive in having a tank or low DD anymore. Why go after IT++ when you can just better xp chaining VT's? Since tanks can't hold hate while DD's mual VT's, people just get 1 more DD instead of an ineffective tank.


What we really need to bring back conventional party is to give some incentive for people to do so. Create more IT++ camp sites for 75's that are no hassle to get to, give higher exp bonus to harder mobs (it's a flat rate bonus now, which favors quick chain of weaker mobs). Give some beneficial interactions to the DD-Tank-BLM group. Something like Vivi+Steiner's magi sword would be wonderful... (BLM nuking onto the tank's weapon, and let tank do the damage for hate.)



I just think that incentives are better motivations than punishment...

[Caspian]

Re: Possible way to solve the TP burn problem?

I just think that incentives are better motivations than punishment...

They are very much so, but they also require a lot more testing to see if it unbalances the game. Its easier to nerf something and if its too much, just go back and tweak it, rather than putting in an incentive that breaks the game for some people and listen to 80% of your playerbase whine.

TP burns will probably be nerfed at some point. Regardless of if the should or not. I think they should really leave it alone for the most part and perhaps raise the respawn time of the common TP burn mobs by a minute or two. Just enough to slow down xp to not quite as insane levels. Remember, if they nerf it too much and BLM's get the advantage gain in manaburns, then its just gonna come right back and bite BLM's in the ass later on.

I do think its funny. A few years ago, SE didn't like people (RNG's) chaining IT++'s. Instead they wanted us to make big chains of T-VT's. Now we all feel and impending nerf to hurt the xp/hr gain of chaining those very same T-VT's that they originally wanted us to fight. Round and round we go?

[Raydeus]

Re: Possible way to solve the TP burn problem?

I do think its funny. A few years ago, SE didn't like people (RNG's) chaining IT++'s. Instead they wanted us to make big chains of T-VT's. Now we all feel and impending nerf to hurt the xp/hr gain of chaining those very same T-VT's that they originally wanted us to fight. Round and round we go?

It's sad but I think something like that.

I mean the game will never be balanced because balance depends on perception and playstyle. So there's always gonna be at least one job that's gonna be left out, and there's always gonna be a group of players that will ask for an adjustment on things they can't do or that cause them to feel/be left out.

It doesn't seem like it's gonna end no matter what SE does, and the more expansion areas and mobs they add the worse it's gonna get, what's balanced in an area of Vana is completely unbalanced in another and viceversa.

And if they adjust things in a way that everyone has to do the exact same thing in the exact same spot then the game is gonna become too boring to be worth playing. /shrug