Two common misconceptions about Elemental Magic.

[locus]

Just clearing up a few misconceptions for once and for all, because I'm SICK of seeing black mages that don't even know the basics.

Popular misconception #1: Burn, NOT Shock, increases damage done by elemental magic spells. When calculating damage for black magic, your int is compared to the monster's int. Most blm know this on this forum.

Popular misconception #2: Resists do NOT affect damage directly. I've read at least three threads on this forum that don't understand this.

When casting a spell, you have a chance of your spell getting resisted and doing 1/2, 1/4 or 1,8 damage (and possibly 1/16) before it is modified by damage reduction related magic resistance. This can be alleviated with Elemental seal, Elemental magic skill, Magic accuracy, Level difference, and elemental resists. That is what resists do.

Most black mages don't understand this at all. They'll say "oh, my blizzard did more maximum damage to a crab monster since it's weak against ice". This is nonsense. Get a bard or ninja, go out to batallia, nuke a tiger with blizzard, cast ice threnody or katon: ni, then cast blizzard again.

Net change in damage: ZERO.

You can test this even more easily with ancient magic. Cast thunder > flood > thunder. Net change in damage: STILL ZERO. MB water 3 on a crab when unresisted (assuming no bubble guard) will do the same damage to a raptor (weak against water) if they have the same INT and you don't get a half-resist or worse. Mind you, since %resists occur very frequently if you're using a spell enemies are strong to, it's not very efficient.

The following enemies (not a comprehensive list) have PERCENTAGE resist to magic spells: Weapons (25% damage cut), Elementals (95%++ damage cut to spells of their element or the one they're strong to with the exception of light/dark), most HNM (straight up % DR), Dynamis statues, (about 66%ish DR, more or less). No amount of -resists is going to increase your damage on these enemies, so give it up already.

So sick of Black mages that think threnody increases maximum spell damage.

[Balfree]

Re: Two common misconceptions about Elemental Magic.

Jeez, someone finally bursts the bubble ^^

I had to personally test burn and shock, so many people still think MND plays a bigger role in elemental magic defense... go test this out with any mob, cast thunder, then burn, then thunder, do it about 5 times (5 mobs of the same type), you'll see. Then do the same but with shock, you'll see, it finally cleared it for me, i was casting shock for soooo long during my BLM levels because higher level people told me >_> i suppose i never really tested it out myself earlier because i was lazy.

INT plays a bigger role in elemental defense than MND, i think MND however is mostly related to the resists you mentioned*, is that correct?

*

When casting a spell, you have a chance of your spell getting resisted and doing 1/2, 1/4 or 1,8 damage (and possibly 1/16) before it is modified by damage reduction related magic resistance. This can be alleviated with Elemental seal, Elemental magic skill, Magic accuracy, Level difference, and elemental resists. That is what resists do.

[Aeni]

Re: Two common misconceptions about Elemental Magic.

Interesting.

So if a DRK can get Abs-INT to stick, does that mean your MB does bigger damage? Just wondering...

[Balfree]

Re: Two common misconceptions about Elemental Magic.

Technically yes, not only MB, but all elemental magic spells should deal more damage the higher INT you have.

I am curious to what fuels your power to land a spell, is it also int? is it mnd? or is it solely based on elemental magic skill? I have a hunch it has some relation to mnd, only because melee have both a modifier stat AND a skill to their attacks, but hey, no one said mages cant be different.

[Protes]

Re: Two common misconceptions about Elemental Magic.

I still consider myself a newbe with FFXI but I remember when I first played the game back when it was released in NA, a friend of mine gave me advice when I started with BLM - INT increases damage and MND decreases resistance. I'm not sure if it still holds true or not, but BLM should concentrate in maximizing INT over MND. Whereas WHM should maximize MND over INT.

Anyways, I had to look up what Ice Threnody does and the description of the spell says it decreases the resistance to ice attack. Oddly enough if those players read the actually spell descriptions it might prevent them from the misconceptions. However, I'm not sure why someone would think resistance would relate to damage, it just means resisting a spell is either increased or decreased and has nothing to do with damage.

[Armando]

Re: Two common misconceptions about Elemental Magic.

INT plays a bigger role in elemental defense than MND, i think MND however is mostly related to the resists you mentioned*, is that correct?

I am curious to what fuels your power to land a spell, is it also int? is it mnd? or is it solely based on elemental magic skill? I have a hunch it has some relation to mnd, only because melee have both a modifier stat AND a skill to their attacks, but hey, no one said mages cant be different.

The main factor in resists is the Elemental Resistance stat, which simply goes up on its own and is not influenced in any way by INT or MND (much like HP or MP.) This stat is sort of like your "magic evasion". I'm certain that this stat is checked against a player's skill when a spell is cast. For Black Magic, MND plays absolutely no role that we know of. There is a possibility that INT plays a role in resist rates, but I can't say for sure. I'd love to see tests.

[neighbortaru]

Re: Two common misconceptions about Elemental Magic.

no, after 4 years of playing, i see no effect of MND on resists of Elemental spells.

MND != Elemental resist

landing an Elemental spell is purely based on level, elemental skill and magic accuracy. I don't believe INT plays a role in resists either.

[Gawaine]

Re: Two common misconceptions about Elemental Magic.

Great post thanks for the info just starting on my BLM and this is great chunk of info to have going into it

[Tiamat_Zero]

Re: Two common misconceptions about Elemental Magic.

Just clearing up a few misconceptions for once and for all, because I'm SICK of seeing black mages that don't even know the basics.

Popular misconception #1: Burn, NOT Shock, increases damage done by elemental magic spells. When calculating damage for black magic, your int is compared to the monster's int. Most blm know this on this forum.

Popular misconception #2: Resists do NOT affect damage directly. I've read at least three threads on this forum that don't understand this.

When casting a spell, you have a chance of your spell getting resisted and doing 1/2, 1/4 or 1,8 damage (and possibly 1/16) before it is modified by damage reduction related magic resistance. This can be alleviated with Elemental seal, Elemental magic skill, Magic accuracy, Level difference, and elemental resists. That is what resists do.

Most black mages don't understand this at all. They'll say "oh, my blizzard did more maximum damage to a crab monster since it's weak against ice". This is nonsense. Get a bard or ninja, go out to batallia, nuke a tiger with blizzard, cast ice threnody or katon: ni, then cast blizzard again.

Net change in damage: ZERO.

You can test this even more easily with ancient magic. Cast thunder > flood > thunder. Net change in damage: STILL ZERO. MB water 3 on a crab when unresisted (assuming no bubble guard) will do the same damage to a raptor (weak against water) if they have the same INT and you don't get a half-resist or worse. Mind you, since %resists occur very frequently if you're using a spell enemies are strong to, it's not very efficient.

The following enemies (not a comprehensive list) have PERCENTAGE resist to magic spells: Weapons (25% damage cut), Elementals (95%++ damage cut to spells of their element or the one they're strong to with the exception of light/dark), most HNM (straight up % DR), Dynamis statues, (about 66%ish DR, more or less). No amount of -resists is going to increase your damage on these enemies, so give it up already.

So sick of Black mages that think threnody increases maximum spell damage.

Good to know

[Mog]

Re: Two common misconceptions about Elemental Magic.

Well shit..... All this time I've been casting shock in order to get in higher damage on the enemy.

[Taskmage]

Re: Two common misconceptions about Elemental Magic.

Too bad Frost and Burn don't stack ...

So INT and MND work like STR for black magic and white magic respectively, and do nothing for the other color of magic. Magic accuracy isn't based on any stat we can see or modify, but must be modified directly. Resistance isn't % damage reduction as in other FF games, but is more like an evasion stat for avoiding full damage or a full stick on an enfeeble. Lowering resist doesn't increase a single sample of damage, but does increase your damage over time because you end up losing less damage to resists.

[locus]

Re: Two common misconceptions about Elemental Magic.

Answering a few questions asked here:

As Taskmage pointed out, MND only affects the resist rate and the effect of WHITE magic spells. Like Banish, Cure, Slow, Paralyze. Shock WILL increase the damage of Banish, but why the hell are you nuking with that spell on blm?

Balfree, what neighbourtaru said is mostly right, except I have to disagree with neighbourtaru on one point - INT and MND actually do have a minor effect on resist rates, as far as I've noticed. Having a higher int difference between you and your enemy will reduce your resist rates. This is why if you cast burn on an enemy, you should notice that their resist rate to your elemental magic will drop (so you not only hit harder, you also get 1/2 resists much less often!). And yes, Absorb INT will help this.

MND however, will not affect black magic resist rates one iota. I have noticed that it helps me land white magic like silence, slow and paralyze on monsters.

One handy tip to know when levelling is that most people use sushi nowadays, so Frost is now an outdated spell. It's usually better to stick to Burn -> Choke. (Because if Burn lands, Choke is a lot less likely to get resisted)

Edit: There's a simple way to increase your magic accuracy: Skill. Much like weapon skill affects your accuracy, elemental skill affects your chance of getting resisted. (But this leads to an additional misconception #3. Elemental magic skill doesn't affect your base damage at all, just makes sure you don't get as many half resists or worse)

One more thing: Magic defense bonus traits (that jobs like white mage have) work directly contrary to magic attack bonus. Shell spells give a percentage damage cut, and on enemies only, it seems to increase resist rates (note that on a player character, shell doesn't seem to do a single thing for your resist rates.)

[neighbortaru]

Re: Two common misconceptions about Elemental Magic.

locus, you should clarify. these two quotes are contradictory:

INT and MND actually do have a minor effect on resist rates, as far as I've noticed.

MND however, will not affect black magic resist rates one iota.

I believe what you meant to say was INT has a minor effect on elemental resists (which i will respectfully disagree) and MND has a minor effect on enfeebling resists.

[Sassafrass]

Re: Two common misconceptions about Elemental Magic.

I usually end up casting Choke to lower VIT for the melee more than Burn for myself. I have enough trouble not pulling hate as it is. <.<

[Karinya]

Re: Two common misconceptions about Elemental Magic.

The damage of any one nuke is affected by INT vs. INT: your INT minus your target's INT. (Thus, Absorb-INT has double the effect, for the DRK).

The power of Paralyze and Slow is affected by MND vs. MND: the % chance of cancelling actions or amount of extra delay. Their duration is affected by whether or not they were partly resisted (the same way a nuke can do half damage, an enfeeble can have half duration).

It is theorized (but as far as I know not proved) that Blind and Gravity have an effectiveness component based on INT vs. INT - the amount of accuracy/evasion lost by the target - but since acc/eva are hidden stats and their effects are highly random, it's difficult to be sure.

Stats have no proven effect on resist rates. Level, Elemental Seal, staffs, Magic Accuracy and skill are the major factors.

Water 3 will do more damage to a crab than Thunder 2 - *if* you get full damage, which you probably won't because of resists.

As far as doing the most nuking damage over time, Magic Attack Bonus and skill are probably the most important - on large nukes, the % bonus effect of MAB is considerably bigger than the additive effect of INT, but you also want to get full damage as often as possible.