Solo BST sub: /WHM, /DNC, /NIN?

[DRblade]

I've started up playing after taking a 4 year break from the game and just starting up a new character (Drblade - Odin server), and I can already see a lot of changes in the game. My main is going to be BST again and my question is with the new additions and updates to jobs, is /WHM still the preferred solo sub job for BST or does /DNC outshine /WHM?

p.s. I took a look around other threads to see if this question had been answered before and found no luck so decided to start one.

[Zoltar]

Re: Solo BST sub: /WHM, /DNC, /NIN?

I'll throw my 2 cents in...I think that soloing as /whm is faster than /nin, because there is little downtime since you can heal yourself. /whm gives you the benefit of Protect/Shell as well. /nin acts as a block for mis-charms from what I've seen. I've never gone /dnc, but I'd imagine its close to /whm.

Anyone gone bst/dnc? Got me curious now...

[Soichiro]

Re: Solo BST sub: /WHM, /DNC, /NIN?

It all comes down to personal preferance really. I have all 3 sub jobs available, but it seems I almost always end up going /nin most of the time.

I think the downfall to /dnc would be the fact that you have no stoneskin/blink and also swapping your charm set out would end up removing your TP. (If you swap out weapons to light staff/monster signa)

[Romyro]

Re: Solo BST sub: /WHM, /DNC, /NIN?

The 2 most common are still /whm and /nin but I’ve seen people make it work with /rdm, /sch, /war, /pld & /dnc. Although those are usually for situational reasons…and at lvl 75.

/dnc might be nice at lower levels since you probably don’t need to swap your main when charming. I don’t know for sure though, I don’t think dnc was out during my low bst lvls. While lvling I mainly did /whm. I didn’t start /nin until 70s where I can use the Rune/gaudy combo. At 75 I use a variety of subs depending on what I’m doing.

Side note: Even though it’s omgwtfbbqkitten’s favorite staff (/wink), don’t waste your time with a Monster Signa. It might look appealing but in all honesty it’s not… (imo).

[Zoltar]

Re: Solo BST sub: /WHM, /DNC, /NIN?

Why isn't CHR+8 appealing to a bst?

[LadyKiKi]

Re: Solo BST sub: /WHM, /DNC, /NIN?

Do hard mode.

NO SUB!

Why isn't CHR+8 appealing to a bst?

I was gonna argue against this lol but decided not to.

[Kanmiqote]

Re: Solo BST sub: /WHM, /DNC, /NIN?

Why isn't CHR+8 appealing to a bst?

In my opinion CHR+ is only usefull to a point for BST. As it only affects the chance of charming a pet, and usually a pet (EM or DC) can be charmed without 8 more CHR, it's not worth losing your TP. Unlike with a Light Staff that actually affects the duration of the charm.

I own a Monster signa because I like to try and solo BCNMs in which you need all the chance you can get.

Edit: On topic

WHM > DNC especially at lower lvls for status removal and ranged pull potential. DNC adds a bit more +CHR, but again I feel that +CHR is only usefull to a point. And as stated before switching out your weapon for charm = loss of TP which is the DNC's lifeblood.

/NIN is fun, a bit more challenging as you have to manage hate better. Once you get the rhythm you can burn down mobs a lot faster than /WHM. Provided you aren't fighting -ga or status inflicting mobs. ( I recommend ACC food for this job).

[Clever Ninja]

Re: Solo BST sub: /WHM, /DNC, /NIN?

Depends on where you're camping. For normal purposes I've been subbing whm(hit 55BST on Monday) but since I've been trying to solo Hellmines in Garliage /NIN tends to be better since they get a few melee attacks whenever I have to pet swap

[Romyro]

Re: Solo BST sub: /WHM, /DNC, /NIN?

Take that bit of info how ever you want. That’s why I put ‘imo’ in there. To me, it’s not worth the gil/tp/inventory space. If you feel it is, I won’t stop you. I’ve seen omgwtf (and a few others) talk about it more thoroughly. Hopefully they will chime in and give you a more detailed answer than I can. I’ll also look for their posts. After reading them, I tried to pay more attention to my charming.

If you’re trying to grab a T, VT or IT to familiar…sure, it’s helpful. But if your xping with DCs as pets, I don’t see the need. Looking back, for me it was a waste of gil (and it was expensive back way back when). Now a days (when leveling subs) even with some very basic chr gear (bird necklace and x2 rings) I don’t have problems charming EP/DC bunnies, lizards, crabs, pugils or leeches. And iirc, those are the majority of mobs you use at lower levels. I think Efts gave me a little trouble around the mid 30s, but I usually stopped when my jobs got to 37. I used it on sch/bst and avoided it on war/bst. I didn’t write down my results, but I did not see enough of a difference to rebuy it.

At 1-37, if I’m not seeing a noticeable difference then I’ll stick with the basics.
At 51 the difference was almost night and day. So I definitely made sure I always had my light staff.

Unlike with a Light Staff that actually affects the duration of the charm

Is this true? I haven’t looked into the ‘duration’ of a light staff. I just thought it raises your success to charm by ~10%. I thought only +charm itself (from AF or JSE) affected the duration.

These days on bst I rarely have a pet charmed or alive long enough to even think about duration ><. Pets uncharming at bad times kills me more that anything so now I’m anal about recharming often.

/NIN is fun, a bit more challenging as you have to manage hate better. Once you get the rhythm you can burn down mobs a lot faster than /WHM. Provided you aren't fighting -ga or status inflicting mobs. ( I recommend ACC food for this job).

I agree. I personally avoided /nin pre 70. Especially vs anything that can –ga or that has damaging AoEs. I didn’t carry meds that much. It sucks being /nin with low HPs then getting poisoned or dia’d…or any DoT for that matter. But if your fighting something like…beetles, it works awesome.

It’s different now with caskets though. Potions and regen drinks are friggen lifesaves these days.

Depends on where you're camping. For normal purposes I've been subbing whm(hit 55BST on Monday) but since I've been trying to solo Hellmines in Garliage /NIN tends to be better since they get a few melee attacks whenever I have to pet swap

Grats on 55!!
Lol, this is a camp I definitely avoided /nin ><. Even though bombs aggro to magic, I always die if I’m /nin. Barfira/shell typically keeps me alive for those random suicide shots they do in range. And if it doesn’t, I can rely on reraise. If I manage to survive on /nin, I gota wait 10 minutes anyway because hHP is so slow and everything there is blood aggro…that and I rarely have meds.

One thing you should look into to help avoid getting hit is blinking your pet ‘fight’ marco. Having a macro that blinks charm and fight have worked wonders for me.

[Kanmiqote]

Re: Solo BST sub: /WHM, /DNC, /NIN?

Quote:
Unlike with a Light Staff that actually affects the duration of the charm

Is this true? I haven’t looked into the ‘duration’ of a light staff. I just thought it raises your success to charm by ~10%. I thought only +charm itself (from AF or JSE) affected the duration.

It effects Charm ACC which equates to Charm potentially lasting for it's full duration. Actually I'm not 100% sure if it works differently than CHR, but the effect is for a full 10-15% (can't remember the exact figure). I think that's what makes it a significant piece of Charming gear, and worthy of a weapon swap macro.

[LadyKiKi]

Re: Solo BST sub: /WHM, /DNC, /NIN?

Go charm something Even Match and/or Tough with and without Light Staff and come back to us with the results.

[Romyro]

Re: Solo BST sub: /WHM, /DNC, /NIN?

I might do some looking around. I’m pretty sure Chr and the light staff only affect charm’s accuracy. and by “charm’s accuracy” I mean whether it lands or not.

I’m almost positive charm’s accuracy has nothing to do with duration. Duration is only affected by gear that has “Charm+X” in it (as in AF/Relic/JSE).

[Clever Ninja]

Re: Solo BST sub: /WHM, /DNC, /NIN?

Grats on 55!!
Lol, this is a camp I definitely avoided /nin ><. Even though bombs aggro to magic, I always die if I’m /nin. Barfira/shell typically keeps me alive for those random suicide shots they do in range. And if it doesn’t, I can rely on reraise. If I manage to survive on /nin, I gota wait 10 minutes anyway because hHP is so slow and everything there is blood aggro…that and I rarely have meds.

One thing you should look into to help avoid getting hit is blinking your pet ‘fight’ marco. Having a macro that blinks charm and fight have worked wonders for me.

I blink when I charm (from tp->charm gear) and then blink into my tp gear when I hit my Fight macro. Still I went to this camp at 55(went 54-55 at this camp duo, definitely alot safer) and getting almost killed cause my new pet would miss the bomb 2-4 times while im wearing Aega's Doublet + Herder's Subligar kinda ticked me off so I might just try it /NIN next time to see. If I die from a Self-Destruct I'm sure you'll see abunch of angry tells from me after it happens lol.

And I wouldn't say Light Staff effects Charm duration. While Charm accuracy would generally cause you to resist Charm's lesss, that's not necessarily enough grounds to say it effects duration of Charm. Aside from when I've attempted to charm IT's to not die while opening coffer's I haven't seen a Charm break early first hand, but then again my BST is only 55.

[Kanmiqote]

Re: Solo BST sub: /WHM, /DNC, /NIN?

It's the same thing.

My first post was pretty confusint (even to me lol). It's tough for me to post at work because I keep getting interupted and losing my train of thought. Trust me this train is running without a conducter most of the time anyway. . .

Anyway Charm+ relates directly to the duration of the Charm and has nothing to do with ACC.
Charm ACC and CHR relates to the success rate and weather or not the Charm "sticks" for the full duration or just a "partial stick."

The point I was trying to make is that +8 CHR isn't going to impact your success rate or stick rate enough to really warrant the 70-100K or w/e it costs on your server. However a 15% bonus to ACC/Stick and, indirectly, duration is probably worth starting the ol' TP guage from 0 every time you need a pet.

They did some pretty extensive testing over on Zam.

[LadyKiKi]

Re: Solo BST sub: /WHM, /DNC, /NIN?

Charm ACC and CHR relates to the success rate and weather or not the Charm "sticks" for the full duration or just a "partial stick."

Lets test it then.

I'm in Den of Rancor right now, WHM/BST with:

Set 1: No CHR, no Light Staff
Set 2: A healthy but not too much CHR and Light Staff
A Stopwatch
Lots of grey angry horny lizzies

brb

EDIT: I'm testing duration by the way, I do not care for accuracy. Waiting now, just charmed a Tormentor (EM). Stopwatch On.



EDIT 2: Set 1 lasted 3:56, I assume 4mins assuming I clicked the stopwatch 4 seconds late, but lets leave at least 2 second margin.



EDIT 3: Set 2 lasted 4:47 ; Hands are Battles Gloves, I forgot to change them to Marine F Gloves (+3 CHR). Feet are Volunteer's Nails (+5 CHR)

Cool, it works.

Screw it, I'll test with Marine as well lol. brb

EDIT 4: 4:54 lol

Since I'm VERY bored, lets test without light staff

brb

EDIT 5: 4:51