New Rampage/Decimation evaluation on VT

[Xythalia]

I thought about posting these new findings on the old thread, but since the previous report was so long, I thought I might as well make a new one for this so it won't be confusing. If forum moderator wants to combine them together, then please do so. ^_^

Original post can be viewed here on my Livejournal: http://www.livejournal.com/users/xyt...12.html#cutid1

Once again, I copied and pasted stuff so certain formats didn't transfer too well over here, therefore it looks a bit messy.

Sorry to keep everyone waiting. I promised to test on harder mobs this past weekend, but finally getting full Monster relic made me so happy I forgot about it. ~_~

Anyway, last time it was a 'decent challenge' antlion--maybe that was too easy of a mob to test so time to up the stakes a bit and this time test this on something harder: A 'very tough' dhamel in Bibiki! Read on to see the results of this test:

I got some good feedback on how to improve my test last time after the antlion test so I adjusted several things accordingly for this one.

Test Conditions
Job: BST/NIN
Equipment: (Worn in every test)
Woodville Axe
Maneater
Beastly Earring
Adaman Sollerets
Amemet Mantle +1
Byakko Haidate
Hecatomb Hauberk

**Note** In this test, I did not equip accessories as to try to keep results as accurate as possible. See pictures below to see the equipment I used during each WS attempt.

Axe Skill: 282 (higher than before since I got 1 more merit in Axe along the way)
No Food
No debuff on target
No beneficial spells on target
TP level per test and Margin of Error: 100~110 TP at all times.

Test Mob:

TP up conditions: TP up on surrounding easy mobs to as close to 100 TP as possible. Perform WS on dhamel pet and immediately release/charm to reset claim--that's how I only used 1 and the same mob throughout this entire test so results stay as accurate as possible. During my test, this Dhamel has never once used 'Berserk' ability so it did not suffer any defense down effect either.

I performed 7 WS for each armor setup. I've also noted how much TP I gained back after each WS this time.

Experiment Hypothesis: Now that mob level has been upped to VT, +ACC equipment will rival, or in most cases, will do more damage than losing accuracy for +STR only. The +ACC setup should land more hits while the +STR setup should miss more. If more hits land, then it will yield more damage.


Rampage

Rampage: Delivers a 5 hit attack. TP increases chances of critical hits.

Test #1: Highest STR setup, Lowest ACC


1. 591 dmg, 103 TP, 17 TP return
2. 503 dmg, 109 TP, 14 TP return
3. 642 dmg, 107 TP, 17 TP return
4. 554 dmg, 103 TP, 10 TP return
5. 520 dmg, 100 TP, 16 TP return
6. 738 dmg, 104 TP, 17 TP return
7. 515 dmg, 102 TP, 17 TP return

Average damage: 580.43

Test #2: +ACC setup, Loss of STR

**Note** I didn't want to lose the Hecatomb Cap. The +11 STR is just too nice. So instead, I lost the +5 STR ring and replaced it with 2 Woodsman (+10 ACC total). I also wore my Merman's Gorget and Assault Earring for +7 more ACC. There's also +10 ACC from Life Belt and +4 more ACC from Adaman Mufflers (not to mention +ATK from mufflers and earring)

1. 531 dmg, 109 TP, 16 TP return
2. 540 dmg, 107 TP, 16 TP return
3. 470 dmg, 104 TP, 15 TP return
4. 590 dmg, 110 TP, 16 TP return
5. 515 dmg, 103 TP, 16 TP return
6. 539 dmg, 107 TP, 16 TP return
7. 532 dmg, 103 TP, 16 TP return

Average damage: 531

Extra Test #3: All ACC setup (Optical Hat + Tiphia Sting)


1. 430 dmg, 100 TP, 16 TP return
2. 441 dmg, 107 TP, 16 TP return
3. 433 dmg, 105 TP, 16 TP return

**Note** I gave up there since no matter how hard I tried, it won't go over 500 dmg, so I can pretty much rule it out as having the lowest average damage of all.

Rampage Commentary: 17 TP return in +STR setup is an indication that all my hits landed. I get +1 more TP than the +ACC setup since Rajas ring has 'Store TP'; so 16 TP return for +ACC setup indicates that all hits landed.

My hypothesis was partially right. The +ACC setup landed more hits during WS than +STR. However, the +STR setup still scored the highest average damage. What was even more impressive was that even though I lacked ACC in the +STR setup, I still managed to land all Rampage hits in 4/7 tries on a VT mob. There was also one attempt where I only got 10 TP back, but still got 554 dmg! I guess that means I missed the crucial 1st hit, but landed the other 4?


Decimation

Decimation: Delivers a 3 hit attack. TP effects damage.
**Note** Same conditions used in Rampage test. However, I left out the last 3rd test with all +ACC items like Optical Hat.

Test #1: Highest STR setup, Lowest ACC

1. 508 dmg, 107 TP, 15 TP return
2. 490 dmg, 101 TP, 15 TP return
3. 328 dmg, 109 TP, 8 TP return
4. 437 dmg, 100 TP, 15 TP return
5. 327 dmg, 109 TP, 8 TP return
6. 448 dmg, 107 TP, 15 TP return
7. 425 dmg, 101 TP, 15 TP return

Average damage: 423.28

Test #2: +ACC setup, Loss of STR

1. 425 dmg, 100 TP, 14 TP return
2. 301 dmg, 107 TP, 13 TP return
3. 449 dmg, 102 TP, 14 TP return
4. 461 dmg, 101 TP, 14 TP return
5. 375 dmg, 105 TP, 14 TP return
6. 369 dmg, 100 TP, 14 TP return
7. 471 dmg, 100 TP, 14 TP return

Average damage: 407.28

Decimation Commentary: Once again, the Rajas ring gives +1 more TP in the +STR setup than the +ACC. 15 TP return indicates that I've landed all hits for +STR setup while 14 TP is the max for +ACC.

It still gives the same results as Rampage--the higher STR setup still has a higher average damage than +ACC even on a harder VT mob. Once again, even with the lack of ACC, the +STR setup landed all hits on 5/7 attempts; which is pretty impressive. Even when I only landed partial hits, the high STR compensates for the lack of damage.


Hopefully, these tests give you an idea of how certain equipment effect Rampage and Decimation results. I'd love to hear everyone's feedback on this. ^_^

Double Post Edited:
Another thing I'd like to mention is that this test was more to benefit axe users in "exping conditions". Please don't mention stuff like testing it on HNMs...because I can definitely not do that. I'd definitely get slapped by people in my LS if they caught me "testing around" on a Niddhogg or Kirin. (>.>)

HNM/Gods are special conditions, and therefore require special unconventional methods to kill.

[zorca]

Re: New Rampage/Decimation evaluation on VT

Awesome testing, thanks a lot!

[Kurgan]

Re: New Rampage/Decimation evaluation on VT

Don't forget that since you're /NIN and dual-wielding axes that you earn double TP per normal attack round (assuming both weapons strike a hit) and that during WS you earn normal TP for the first swing, 1 TP for each additional hit in WS, and because of /NIN you will earn additional TP for your 2nd hand weapon (at normal TP gain), even if you never see your 2nd weapon swing during WS. It's very possible that your 10TP return WS simply missed that 2nd weapon swing (which would give normal TP return, not +1) and only one miss of your Rampage WS (7TP first hit +1 +1 +1 +miss, +2H miss). It's also possible that one axe returns 6TP where the other returns 7TP on a hit. You might have nailed all hits on Rampage with 6TP return +4 for each additional hit, and missed on 7TP weapon (which, if it hit, would yield 17 TP return maximum). I don't happen to know off-hand what the normal TP return per hit on those axes are. I know I've seen weapons that give 6-7TP or 12-13TP (alternates TP return on each hit). I wonder if the results would have been much different had you switched which axes were in which hand since multi-hit WS uses your primary weapon for each hit in the WS?

It's obvious that anyone who is a WAR or BST 55+ using 1H axes should definitely stack up on STR for WS. Rampage and Decimation's modifiers are both based on STR, but I guess since Decimation is only 3x hit with more accuracy based on TP versus Rampage's 5x hits and chance for critical hit based on TP that could explain why Rampage did more damage on average -- more hits and chance for critical hits.

Good job, Xythalia. I'd be curious to see the same test done at 200% TP and 300% TP to see how the TP modifier helps or doesn't help. I might like to see what the results would have been with a Juggernaut + Woodsville.

[Xythalia]

Re: New Rampage/Decimation evaluation on VT

For Decimation, I think that a balance of ACC and STR equipment will yield max results...at least that's what the results were during the antlion lion test. Unfortunately, I didn't have time to test it on the VT dhamel.

As for Rampage, I used to be under the impression that Rampage was based off of ACC. At least that thought is popular among the masses and had led me to believe it as well. I've heard a lot of "Load up on ACC, it helps with Rampage" or "You need highest accuracy setup before doing this dmg".

However, these tests have so far proved this popular thought partially incorrect. Even if I missed a few hits with rampage while using highest str setup (and lacking acc), the STR modifer alone will boost that damage and save that Rampage from being totally weak...whereas if I miss some hits in high acc setup (and neglecting str), the resulting dmg is incredibly lower than usual.

[GASGUL]

Re: New Rampage/Decimation evaluation on VT

please keep this going,

i am a hnmls and am drawing up the BST DD equipment list already,

in regards to god equipment