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  • Bst/Ninja... wow, very impressed

    Since level 1 I've been playing Bst/Whm and finding it quite awesome for soloing. Unfortunately, a lot of equipment slots have to go towards +mana to make this work well. I'm a mithra beastmaster, so my mana total is acceptable and quite useful with several +mana items.

    I got an invite to help a party slay the dragon to reach rank 3. This made sense since at the time I was exactly level 25 beastmaster. Anyways, for an experiment and since it seems to be regarded fairly well and we had a whm, I decided to try sub ninja instead for the battle.

    Well, let's sum it up like this:
    Dark Knight swings (GWD) connects for 58 damage.
    Beastmaster axe hit for 36
    Beastmaster axe hit for 32
    HareFamilar hit for 42

    Repeat that about 8 times and the dragon as dead. I didn't lose a single hp because of blink. Harefamiliar did his special attack for over 100 damage (foot kick). I was doing more than twice the damage of the drk. Among one handed weapons, axe has the best damage, so dual wield can crank out some impressive damage.

    Anyways, we slayed the dragon in about 3 mins, and then I warped back to my spot to resume levelling as bst/ninja to use my remaining shihei. I found myself being able to kill tough mobs faster as ninja than as whm, and I was able to get better exp chains without restings.

    So here's my notes about this combo:
    -Without the need for +mana gear, I was able to equip more strength, dex and evasion gear.
    -Without needing to use juices for mana, I was able to eat meat mithkabobs continuously.
    -With whm sub my axe was hitting for 20-25 damage.
    -With nin sub my axe was hitting for 30-35 damage (twice).
    -By using utsusemi once or twice per battle, I was able to tank the mob and finish killing it once my pet had died off without losing any much hp at all.
    -Once I had completeled my exp chain (usually chain #1 or #2) the downtime to fully recover my hp was much longer without cure spells. However, with whm, I had never been able to do chain #2 at all before needing to rest. Ninja just kills mobs so much faster than whm sub, important for exp chaining.
    -Loss of protect spells and -a spells hurts, losing cure spells hurts but good use of utsusemi covers most of the lost healing.
    -Ninja also has enfeebles (although not until higher level).

    Anyways, I would use this as a subjob in a party any day without hesitation, it makes for a MEAN damage dealing addition to any party with a familiar greatly adding to the damage and pushing it to ridiculous levels. You can take a few hits or pull even easier with utsusemi and stealth, ninja adds a decent boost to evasion compared to whm, or so I felt. Soloing it is quite good as well, allowing you to finish mobs off quicker with better damage as long as your time in combat remains short. In a prolonged fight, ninja will get the beats where a whm could cure themselves, and block decently with shield, and hurt a bit less with protect.

    Anyone else have good experiences with this subjob?

  • #2
    Interesting...
    60 PLD, 31 WAR, 25 RDM, 17 THF, 65 BST, 13 MNK, 20 BLM, 32 WHM, 6 NIN...

    PLD AF: 100% Completed!
    BST AF: 100% Completed!

    Advanced Jobs needed: DRK, DRG, SMN ;_;

    Comment


    • #3
      I really want to try BST/NIN once I hit 24, sounds fun.

      As for the debuffs :

      Invisible

      BST/NIN gets it at 18/9 and 68/34, spell = Tonko.
      BST/WHM gets it at 50/25
      Note : I'm not sure if there :NI version is any better other then a faster cast time.

      Blind

      BST/NIN gets it at 38/19, spell = Kurayami
      BST/WHM doesn't get this spell

      Slow

      BST/NIN gets it at 46/23, spell = Hojo
      BST/WHM gets it at 26/13

      Poison

      BST/NIN gets it at 54/27, spell = Dokumori
      BST/WHM doesn't get this spell

      Paralyze

      BST/NIN gets it at 60/30, spell = Jubaku
      BST/WHM gest it at 8/4

      Blink

      BST/NIN gets it at 24/12 and 74/37, spell = Utsusemi
      BST/WHM gets it at 38/19
      Note: Utsusemi out performs the WHM version. The WHM version only blocks on hit and I believe it's a random hit. Utsusemi: Ichi block 3 hits and :NI blocks 4

      There's also elemental debuffs at BST/NIN 30/15, but those aren't very useful when soloing.

      /NIN would also be more expensive. You only have to pay with MP for WHM debuffs, but you have to pay in cash for NIN debuffs. However, it wouldn't be nearly as expensive as a NIN main. You don't have to spam ninjitsu to keep hate or spam Utsusemi to dodge hit, you only have to use one ninjitsu per battle (though you'll probably have to use Utsusemi more then once).

      And off topic, can a 25 solo the dragon? Or will I need a party?
      JohNNY

      Comment


      • #4
        Soloing dragon as bst

        I'd say no, you probably could not solo the dragon as 25 bst. When we went, we had:

        ninja/warrior
        whm/blm
        blm/whm
        bst/nin
        EDIT: drk/war too Thanks for pointing that out.

        The main reason you can't solo the dragon is that battle is against 2 NMs not one. You have to kill the Seeker in addition to the dragon, and the usual strategy is to sleep the dragon to buy you a minute to deal with the Seeker. Once the Seeker is down, the dragon is not as threatening although he does hit really hard. With a beastmaster and pet along, I'd say you could do it with 2 people, or easily with three.

        blm/whm to sleep dragon with elemental seal and then cure.
        bst/nin with familiar to do damage
        provoker for backup tanking if things get hairy.

        Beastmaster/Ninja does cost more, but as you said, you don't go through as much ninjitsu as a ninja main, and as beastmaster, you are usually pulling enough incidental loot since you solo everything that the cost of shihei should not become prohibitive.

        Since I have both ninja and white mage high enough level to use as subs, I intend to switch between them whenever I want. I may decide with more time to stick with one over the other, but for now I've had surprising success with ninja although white mage of course is the standard for many reasons.

        Streak

        50 thief
        40 samurai
        25 ninja
        25 beastmaster
        21 ranger
        15 white mage
        10 black mage

        Comment


        • #5
          Wow, that is fantastic to hear. I know of a person in my LS who does BST/NIN as well. I hope all goes well for you in the future, and since you wont be blink-tanking, you can make a stack of shihei last quite a while I bet. I might try this sometime as well.

          The debuffs are great for low levels, where you dont frequently get resists. Ninjitsu can be resisted too right? It might not be worth it to carry powders for the enfeebles if they just get resisted constantly, the cost could really add-up. I would say as a BST/NIN, the only tools you will need are the shihei for Utsusemi and the other tool for the Invisible.

          I'd say no, you probably could not solo the dragon as 25 bst. When we went, we had:

          ninja/warrior
          whm/blm
          blm/whm
          bst/nin
          I thought you had a DRK in there somewhere also?
          Turgon, Elvaan of San d'Oria, Midgardsormr
          R.I.P. --> April 28th, 2004

          Comment


          • #6
            Interesting news...

            I wonder how well a BST/WHM and BST/NIN duo could do all the way to endgame...
            Details worth knowing:
            Lvl 75 BRD, 37 WHM. Bastok Rank 10. Windurst Rank 6
            Lvl 100 Lu Shang Fisher
            Lvl 96 Woodworking
            Lvl 64 Alchemy
            Lvl 54 Goldsmithing
            Lvl 53 Bonecrafting
            Lvl 34 Blacksmithing
            Lvl 30 Cooking

            Comment


            • #7
              WHM's blink has longer casting time. It randomly blocks 2 hits, it can also absorb random spells.

              Comment


              • #8
                Hey that sounds pretty interesting. I just unlocked BST and haven't used it at all, but I pt with a bst so will have to ask him to try this out.

                Question on this point you had:
                -Without needing to use juices for mana, I was able to eat meat mithkabobs continuously.
                I thought you can drink juices and eat mithkabobs? :confused: I'm fine drinking for mana every time I need it while the mithkabob effect is still on.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by luckki
                  Hey that sounds pretty interesting. I just unlocked BST and haven't used it at all, but I pt with a bst so will have to ask him to try this out.

                  Question on this point you had:

                  I thought you can drink juices and eat mithkabobs? :confused: I'm fine drinking for mana every time I need it while the mithkabob effect is still on.
                  Since a BST/NIN doesn't have any MP, juices are not necessary.
                  "The truth is, you're the weak. And I'm the tyranny of evil men."

                  Shadowmoon: BST53, BLM57, BRD43

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Well yes, I realize there is no MP pool and therefore no need for juices but his/her whole point was that he/she could eat mithkabobs continuously which he could still do while consuming juices if he was subbing whm right? I'm not trying to start a flame war or anything, only trying to understand this point for my own learning experience as well.

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                    • #11
                      Ah, I see. Perhaps he meant that he could carry more mithakabobs instead of juices. /shrug
                      "The truth is, you're the weak. And I'm the tyranny of evil men."

                      Shadowmoon: BST53, BLM57, BRD43

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I tried this sub last night. Level 27 BST/NIN . Only good thing about it was blink, but other wise, it sucked.

                        When I was low on HP (99 HP), I had to sit and regen all 364 HP (Tarutaru). Down time is a lot less with whm because of cure. And also I was fighting a spider, I got hate and it used it's poison skill on me. Blink didn't block the poison status and I was poisoned with -5 per tick or something like that :x .

                        I'mma stick with WHM sub. It seems a lot more reliable when soloing ( and cheaper ) .

                        ( Sorry for sucky grammar :x )
                        "I like hexa strike, I like it a lot" - Rioo

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I personally use bst/nin in PTs

                          2axes swinging+pet dmg= lot of dmg
                          BST43/BRD16/WHM30/NIN10/DRG12/SMN2/

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I tried this sub last night. Level 27 BST/NIN . Only good thing about it was blink, but other wise, it sucked.
                            Well looking at your race, Tarutaru, the most meleers in the game and seeing how you were only trying it you may have been lacking some equipment that would have made BST/NIN a lot better.

                            Well whatever, I decided to do WHM over NIN awhile ago... but it is still temping. I will level WAR to 36, then NIN once I become a full time BST to see what would be the better soloing and partying sub. (WHM/NIN/WAR)

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              what about bst/sam vs bst/war?

                              for a tarutaru bst anyway, any preferences?
                              75/bst, 60/smn, 51/rdm, 46/whm, 40/blm, 37/nin, 37/thf, 37/war, 32/sam, 25/brd, 10/pld, 7/mnk

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