Have Square Enix gone too far with the latest BRD changes?

[Murphie]

Re: Have Square Enix gone too far with the latest BRD changes?

If you're leveling just for the merit JAs, you're probably leveing for the wrong reasons anyway.

As has been mentioned (several times), BRD is a very well-balanced job. It really didn't need any help. Even if it had gotten nothing during this most recent update, it would still be just as desired for parties as it is today.

[Pillowcase]

Re: Have Square Enix gone too far with the latest BRD changes?

If you're leveling just for the merit JAs, you're probably leveing for the wrong reasons anyway.

Uhh... No way in hell would I level bard just for the crappy merits.

As has been mentioned (several times), BRD is a very well-balanced job. It really didn't need any help. Even if it had gotten nothing during this most recent update, it would still be just as desired for parties as it is today.

When did anyone in this thread say (even once) that the Bard class was unbalanced or needed any kind of upgrade?

[Hantz]

Re: Have Square Enix gone too far with the latest BRD changes?

So, what I gather is the Bard songs alone make them self suffecient for all situatuions and thier JAs are just fluff, apparently.

This is how I see it:

First off, what is a JT? It's basically a permanent buff (despite how weak/strong it may be). Now since Bards are buffers, they are basically able to apply JTs for a limited time via their buffs.

A Bard's songs are his strength and they just happen to be classified as their own class of ability. You could just pretend that songs were JAs and not be too off.

Corsairs illustrate this more litterally, since their buffs are often specific JTs. You'll notice they only have 1 JT for themselves. The main difference between their buffs and Bard buffs (in regards to JA, JT and all) is that their usefull abilities happen to be JAs. If Phantom Rolls were their own class of magic, Corsairs would likely have a selection of JAs comparably anemic to Bards.

When a job is able to apply bonuses so similar in function to JTs, they just tend to have very few. They can easily add them, unlike other jobs that are padded with all the JTs they will ever have on their own.


I'm sorry, I'm at work. People keep messing with me. I'm not even sure what my angle was anymore. Oh well.

[Pillowcase]

Re: Have Square Enix gone too far with the latest BRD changes?

This is how I see it:

First off, what is a JT? It's basically a permanent buff (despite how weak/strong it may be). Now since Bards are buffers, they are basically able to apply JTs for a limited time via their buffs.

A Bard's songs are his strength and they just happen to be classified as their own class of ability. You could just pretend that songs were JAs and not be too off.

Corsairs illustrate this more litterally, since their buffs are often specific JTs. You'll notice they only have 1 JT for themselves. The main difference between their buffs and Bard buffs (in regards to JA, JT and all) is that their usefull abilities happen to be JAs. If Phantom Rolls were their own class of magic, Corsairs would likely have a selection of JAs comparably anemic to Bards.

When a job is able to apply bonuses so similar in function to JTs, they just tend to have very few. They can easily add them, unlike other jobs that are padded with all the JTs they will ever have on their own.


I'm sorry, I'm at work. People keep messing with me. I'm not even sure what my angle was anymore. Oh well.

I understand that a Bard's song is more of a job ability than it is a spell, I mean, only bards can perform songs; hence 'Job Ability'.

But anyway, on to what I was talking about.

'Troubadour' and 'Nightingale' aren't that useless, but the fact that they are the rewards for taking the time to level 75 all over again, I deem them lame.

Example:
Theif: Assassin's Charge - "Obtained with merit points. Triples your next attack."
Paladin: Chivalry - "Obtained with Merit Points. Converts TP to MP."
Warrior: Savagery - "Obtained with Merit Points. Adds TP Bonus effect to Warcry." (PASSIVE)
Ninja: Sange - "Obtained with Merit Points. Consumes remaining shadow images to perform ranged attacks. Requires Shurikens."

These are all pretty cool merits...

Bard: Troubadour - "Obtained with Merit Points. Increases the casting time of songs by 1.5 and doubles the effect duration"
Bard: Nightingale - "Obtained with Merit Points. Halves the casting and recast times of songs"

Although these new abilities will make the bards alot more powerful, they're not as cool as the other merits.

[Hantz]

Re: Have Square Enix gone too far with the latest BRD changes?

Bard: Troubadour - "Obtained with Merit Points. Increases the casting time of songs by 1.5 and doubles the effect duration"
Bard: Nightingale - "Obtained with Merit Points. Halves the casting and recast times of songs"

Although these new abilities will make the bards alot more powerful, they're not as cool as the other merits.

It's all relative. The Bard's new merits don't really compare to the melee merits. I mean, how cool can boosts to buffing really look next to throwing a damned tomahawk or shooting shadows? Would it be cooler to have the Bard shoot fire out of a freaking flute? Their new merits fall in line with how the job works.

And like Murphie said, merits aren't the main reason to get to 75.

[Pillowcase]

Re: Have Square Enix gone too far with the latest BRD changes?

Hahaha!

Are you kidding me? Shooting fire out of my flute would be THE BEST!

Their new merits fall in line with how the job works.

What about a Job Trait that gives Bards a chance to scare or stun beasts, or one that has a chances to revive someone.

What about a Job Trait that turns aggro. Say if there's two mobs, 'Fascinate' one of them and have it attack the other.

To me, that's a nice support class ability/trait.

And like Murphie said, merits aren't the main reason to get to 75.

Uhh... No way in hell would I level bard just for the crappy merits.

[Hantz]

Re: Have Square Enix gone too far with the latest BRD changes?

What about a Job Trait that turns aggro. Say if there's two mobs, 'Fascinate' one of them and have it attack the other.

To me, that's a nice support class ability/trait.

Hmmm...interesting.

No need to waste a merit on that.

[Icemage]

Re: Have Square Enix gone too far with the latest BRD changes?

What about a Job Trait that gives Bards a chance to scare or stun beasts, or one that has a chances to revive someone.

What about a Job Trait that turns aggro. Say if there's two mobs, 'Fascinate' one of them and have it attack the other.

To me, that's a nice support class ability/trait.

Lullaby. Hymnus. Virelai. Want to know how often the latter two get used ? (correct answer: almost never)


Icemage

[Pillowcase]

Re: Have Square Enix gone too far with the latest BRD changes?

Well, that sucks.

Seemed to me like tha'd be useful.

[Omniblast]

Re: Have Square Enix gone too far with the latest BRD changes?

Lullaby. Hymnus. Virelai. Want to know how often the latter two get used ? (correct answer: almost never)


Icemage

Hymnus gets used a lot.

[ClydeArrowny]

Re: Have Square Enix gone too far with the latest BRD changes?

'Troubadour' and 'Nightingale' aren't that useless, but the fact that they are the rewards for taking the time to level 75 all over again, I deem them lame.

By the way, you dont have to level to 75 a second time to get merits. Once you hit 75 you can switch from exp mode to merit mode. In merit mode you gain Limit Points instead of EXP, but at the same rate you would gain EXP.

Every 10,000 Limit points you get, you get 1 Merit Point. In order to activate one of the new merits such as Nightengale, you need to use 3 Merit Points. To upgrade one of these to level 2, you would need 4 more Merit Points. To cap it at level 3, 5 more Merit Points. Not everything meritable follows the growth of 3->4->5. The old job specific merits are 1->2->3->4->5, base stats like CHR are 3->6->9->9->9 and magic skill such as singing skill would be 1->2->3->3->3->3->3->3. Depending on how many merits you get it can be like leveling to 75 again, purely from the sheer number of Limit Points needed, however, you always stay at level 75.

[Corthaemus]

Re: Have Square Enix gone too far with the latest BRD changes?

Example:
Theif: Assassin's Charge - "Obtained with merit points. Triples your next attack."
Paladin: Chivalry - "Obtained with Merit Points. Converts TP to MP."
Warrior: Savagery - "Obtained with Merit Points. Adds TP Bonus effect to Warcry." (PASSIVE)
Ninja: Sange - "Obtained with Merit Points. Consumes remaining shadow images to perform ranged attacks. Requires Shurikens."

These are all pretty cool merits...

I don't know if it's the blm in me talking, but Elemental San > Sange. I agree with you, though, Pillowcase. Bard should get something flashy. Cause I'll be damned if that job doesn't look super-boring.

[Icemage]

Re: Have Square Enix gone too far with the latest BRD changes?

Hymnus gets used a lot.

In Dynamis, once in a while. Maybe if you know you're going to wipe, but good Dynamis groups tend not to have to worry about that in most areas (with the exception of that most painful Hydra Corps stupidity section of Dynamis-Beaucedine, and perhaps on the tank party versus Angra Mainyu). Otherwise? I can't think of too many other situations where you know you're going to get smoked for sure and have the time and opportunity to sing Hymnus.


Icemage

[Thott]

Re: Have Square Enix gone too far with the latest BRD changes?

Hymnus gets used a lot.

Can I ask when? I am 75brd and I maybe use that damn song like once every 6 months

[Heimdal00]

Re: Have Square Enix gone too far with the latest BRD changes?

So, what I gather is the Bard songs alone make them self suffecient for all situatuions and thier JAs are just fluff, apparently.
...And 2, leveling to 75 all over again isn't worth it for the Bard, primarily because if it's not a song, it's fluff...?
Wouldn't that defeat the purpose of the merits?
Sounds like nobody's excited about the Bard merits.
Seems to me like they added new JAs/JTs for the sake of having new JAs/JTs and lame ones at that.
Yeah, for real.
What about a Job Trait that gives Bards a chance to scare or stun beasts, or one that has a chances to revive someone.
What about a Job Trait that turns aggro. Say if there's two mobs, 'Fascinate' one of them and have it attack the other.
To me, that's a nice support class ability/trait.

Lol... dude, there are songs that do each of those. ^_^;
Lullaby puts mob asleep, elegy slows mob (close enough to scare/stun)
Hymnus gives reraise. And Virelai charms a mob, so it can fight for you.

Not needing MP for any of this is itself the best Job Trait!