that harp with hymnus +2

[Sadeira]

there's a new harp out that gives hymnus +2

recently, a brd in our ls purchased one to test it out (after much deliberation) to determine what kind of a reraise effect it gives.

it gives the effect of reraise 2

thought, i'd let all you brds out there know before you spend a lot of money on it (our brd spent 1.5 million) only to be disappointed if you were expecting a reraise 3 effect.

[Faranim]

My (highly limited) experience with the Angel Lyre is that it is strictly a duration bonus. It does not affect the amount of EXP lost due to eating the reraise effect.

Hymnus is somewhere between a Raise 1 and Raise 2 in terms of EXP return. I believe Hymnus is somewhere around -1000 EXP while Raise 1 is -1800 and Raise 2 is -600.

[bbcradical_ed]

I did some tests with Hymnus as a low lv job a few days ago:

I lost the same xp with Raise I as I did with Hymnus

=/

[Seeker_Onos]

Depending upon the level that you die at, the difference between R1, R2, R3 and Hymnus (estimated at R1.5) varies from negligible (below level 50) to significant (level 70+)

Assuming you were experimenting with a job at the Valkrum levels or below (lv. 1-20) you will probably not see a drastic difference in terms of your ability to recoup the xp loss.

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Let's run some numbers: (assuming no moghancment: experience in effect or Rank 10 flag)

Let's say you have a level 10 THF (needs a total of 2600xp to level up after "ding-ing" lv. 10)

We will call this total xp "TNLFZ" or "To next level from zero xp) to differentiate this from the usual decrementing count of "tnl" or "required experience points until next level".

His xp loss after dying from that nasty orc that popped behind him will work as follows:

R0 - (homepointing, takes full xp loss) : -260xp (10% of TNLFZ)
... in terms of time needed to recover his xp loss, not counting time to travel back to the PT (which in most cases will be quicker thatn the {weakened} status after a raise if the player is homepointed locally) might take anywhere from 2-4 kills (assuming an average of 120-150xp per kill on level range apporpriate mobs)

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R1 - (normal Raise) : -195xp (recovers 25% of total xp loss, or takes a hit of 7.5% TNLFZ)
... not much of a difference in terms of recovery time, about 2-3 kills will regain the lost xp, given same circumstances as the above example.

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Hymnus (or R1.5) : -130xp (reportedly recovers 50% of total xp loss, or takes a hit of 5% TNLFZ)
...reasonably, a level 10 character is NOT likely to have a level 73+ BRD jump into a PT just to toss a Hymnus, but assuming we have this luxury... the character still has to deal with weakned state and may recover the xp in one or two kills.

R2 and R3 are equally unlikely, given the MP cost to the WHM and available of willing WHMs to provide this for characters under level 50... but for the sake of this study:

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R2 -65xp or 2.5% of TLNFZ. Arguably, you'd get the xp back in one kill, even from a gimped PT.

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R3 - 26xp loss or 1% of TLNFZ. Given the downtime for the weakened character vs. the trouble of finding a WHM (unless you are getting powerleveled - but if you die in a PL party, something is wrong....)

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Now let's consider the numbers again for a level 50 character (I'll leave out the verbose explanations, and assume our level 50 DRK just unloaded a nasty Soul Eater that prompted the Ramble Crawler to eat the DRK... and we have a kind WHM75 on hand to do the raising)

(my figure might be off, but I recall having 20,000 tnl after dinging level 50)

R0 (homepointing) : -2000xp or 10% of TLNFZ. Full xp loss.

R1 (typical raise expected in Crawler's Nest) : -1500xp or 7.5% TNLFZ. 75% xp loss.

Hymnus : -1000xp or 5% TNLFZ. 50% xp loss.

R2 (rather helpful, but don't expect it) : -500xp loss or 2.5% TNLFZ

R2 (possible, but don't expect it in CN) : -500xp or 2.5% TNLFZ. 25% xp loss.

R3 (highly unlikely) : -200xp loss or 1% TNLFZ. Not a whole lot of difference between R2 and R3, but taking an R2 definitely saves some xp over R1.

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Now, where it gets noticeable is on the very high end - using myself as an example as Dynamis and various stupid things in Sky have killed me recently, and I can use my own numbers.

At the time I gathered these numbers, I had moghancement: conquest points bonus active, and presumably not the moghancement: experience.

At level 74, I have a TNLFZ of 42,000. There is a cap on xp loss (if I have to HP, I loose only 2500 regardless of any other non-raise oriented xp enhancements.

By the numbers:

R0: -2500xp loss (will take several chain 5's and the better part of 20-30min in a good PT to re-gain, not including travel time back from HP... nor takes into account the 15-20min search for a WHM...)

R1: -1875xp loss (travel time not a worry, if /WHM in PT, about 5min for recovery, and another 10-15min to recover the lost xp, or about 2-3 chain 5's.

Hymnus: -1250xp loss (used that in Dynamis, always fun after a full wipeout ) xp loss recoverable in 2 chain 5's.

R2: -625xp loss (recoverable in one chain 5)

R3: -250xp loss (recoverable in one very good kill, or two average kills)

Of course, with the Moghancement: Experience mods - the lost xp is even less; note that the difference in xp loss on the extreme ends between Hymnus at level 74 vs. level 10 and 50 are quite different.

Loosing 130xp (Hymnus) vs. 260 (no raise) vs. 195 (R1 ) seems trivial when compared to higher levels:

1250xp (Hymnus) vs. 2500xp (no raise) vs. 1875 (R1).

After level 70, if given a choice between R1, Hymnus and R3, I'll always take R3... but if I am soloing, I'll thank the Buddha if I can whip out a Hymnus before going down for the count ^^

As for the +2 Hymnus Harp, the only one in existence on Pandemonium Server is safely in the hands of our local Haijin--who-has-got-everything-in-the-game-maxed crafter... so I doubt I'll be able to test its effects out anytime soon.

He has sold it to himself for the "suggested MSRP" of 10M gil wwwwww....

[Sadeira]

definitely not worth the 10 mill he's asking for

[tnt118]

I thought I read that under level 50, Raise II and III don't lower your EXP loss?

And not that it matters much, but the jump in EXP happens when you hit 51, I think.

[Kiyone]

Originally posted by tnt118
I thought I read that under level 50, Raise II and III don't lower your EXP loss?

And not that it matters much, but the jump in EXP happens when you hit 51, I think.

You need to watch the animations. Someone casting Raise III on a level 20, the initial casting animation will be Raise III, but accepting and the actual raise animation will be Raise I.

The animations will tell you what effect Raise III had.

[Akiro]

wow thats something i never even noticed much, ill watch that now and maybe point it out the next time i exp and they want a raise 2 at lvl 50

[Seeker_Onos]

Interesting, I never even thought it was a game-imposed limit.

I just did the math as it might have worked out if R2/R3 did work for anyone under level 50...

and even then, the differences are not that great.

Good stuff nonetheless.