Fleshed-out Job Concepts

[Hantz]

Re: Fleshed-out Job Concepts

I have to agree with the 4 basic rules Hantz described while talking about creating a new job class, though I do disagree that Mime and Time Mage wouldn't work, but that's another discussion which I'll address at a later date.

Word. I was merely citing those jobs as examples of avoiding difficult concepts. I'm sure there could be sensible builds for each of those jobs; they would just require more reworking than most. Like, off the top of my head, Mime could have a short list of usable skills like BLU, but fill it with things used by recent party members. Like one spot for action JA, one for support JA, etc.

Not trying to discourage anybody. I'm not a pro on the math of the game, so maybe Time Mage would work, but then again maybe not. But not definatively "yes" or "no."

[Hantz]

Re: Fleshed-out Job Concepts

Well, I'll go ahead and post my Geomancer idea. I'll try to explain my process along the way, and point out any of those 4 guidlines an area might fall under. I'll have to say right off the bat, I'm not a master of the game's math and modifiers and such, so don't get too bent out of shape about something being too powerful or not. These are just the ideas for how the job could work, and not being able to test these abilities in the real game, I can't be sure how strong/weak they should be. As long as the idea gets across, that's my goal.

I gave the history of the Geomancer. I gave some guidelines for adjustments older jobs need to undergo to work in FFXI. I hope they blend here.

I'm not sure how to begin here. I went for a tanking role with my concept, like many others, because there's room for another tank, and Geomancer has had a pretty varied style. Pretty much anyone would agree that we have enough DD, and there is a good little spread of Support. Another healer would probably be my top choice for a new job, but Geomancer wasn't going that way in my head.

Where I think my concept is different is that I didn't think GEO could have his cake and eat it too. Instead of many abilities that caused slight elemental damage and enfeebles, with some tanking abilities worked in, I tried to make it so that, to get the most out of their abilities, a GEO would need to be the one being attacked by the mob.

I also feel that, with such a wide spread of what mage jobs could already accomplish, the Geomancer would need to distance itself even further from BLM, RDM, WHM, BRD, and Avatar abilities. So I dropped most of the direct damage and enfeebling skills. I went back to the physical style of the FFTactics GEO, but felt that it still wasn't stacking up to the tanks we have now. Let me get to the point.

----------------------------

I made up these stat ratings a while back, rather unscientifically. I looked at a large list of all the jobs' ratings and said "More HP than this job," "Not as much STR as that job," and so on. It might be a little crappy now, but this is not even the most vital part of the concept so:

Base Stat Ratings:
HP --> C
MP--> none
STR --> C
DEX --> D
VIT --> B
AGI --> B
MND --> D
CHR --> E

Maybe that part could use some work, but who cares.

-------------------------

We reviewed the strange spread of weapons that GEOs have used, but I went further with weapon selection. To Ziero's credit, his view of the GEO is that of an outdoorsman, a mountain man. But I thought to thicken this job up, I would add elements of a previously thin job: Rune Knight (FF6). GEO already seemed like it was kind of like an Eskimo, and that they seemed to be decked out for survival in harsh, cold environments. So it makes sense to me to add in a Rune Knight, which reminds me of Norse warriors (the birthplace of runes and all), another dweller of harsh, cold environments. This helped me get to a good place to make a weapon spread for GEO. I'll get into the overall theme, which will play a little bit into this later. But since we don't have any AF Great Sword, nor is one class showing an A+ superiority. So:

Combat Ratings:
Great Sword --> A- (equal to a DRK, not stronger, but GEO doesn't have as high a STR rating or Attack Boosts)
Great Axe --> C
Dagger --> C
Polearm --> D
Parrying --> A-
Evasion --> B-

GEO had daggers and polearms in the past. Since I was going for a physical, tanking take though, I took their previous use of sword & axe, and bumped them up to the Great versions. I gave them a lower rating in GA, a higher damage weapon class, to keep them from encroaching into DD territory. GS isn't currently anyone's favored weapon overall, since A.) WAR can use dual axes or higher damage GA, which they are better with anyway, B.) PLD has an A+ in sword and they can pair that with their ever useful shield skills, and C.) DRK can get higher damage scythes than even the strongest GS, at earlier levels too, and DRK's goal is damage. So there was a pocket IMO for GEO to scoop up GS. The weapon skills for GS seemed to fit the style of GEO well too. And I didn't give them staff skills, which seems to be a huge focus of most GEO builds, to keep them from turning mage.

------------------------

So for the underlying theme of this version of GEO so far; GEOs originated in a cold, arctic environment where survival was difficult (thus the look). They invented Geomancy by trying to manipulate their living conditions through channeling the energies of the world (hence the abilities). This made it possible for GEOs of old to survive where they did, and it also kept the rest of Vana'diel from stumbling upon this job until recently (whenever the next expansion releasing new jobs comes out). They dress to withstand the cold, decked out in hooded tunics made of leather and furs. The white bobble on the hood of the GEO is to signify their shamanistic status in society (like a wizard hat or something). They carried bells made of earth or metal to help with their geomancy. And they swing Great Swords like a Scandinavian warrior. That all helps explain...

AF gear to present an iconic appearance:
Like all the other jobs, GEO has to look the part. I'm going to go with the basic look of the FF3 DS version, but made to fit the kind of gear we have in FFXI. The pieces could be something like:

Weapon: Stalactite (somekind of mineral/rocky looking GS)

Hands: Gnome Mitts
Legs: Gnome Slops
Feet: Gnome Galoshes (not made of rubber, but thick, white boots)
Ranged Slot: Rune Bell (could have some kind of boost to certain JAs)
Head/Body (combined): Gnome Tunic (the hooded kind that fills both armor slots)

Of course the tunic's hood would have a white puff on it, not as big as the one from the pic I linked. The combo of head and body AF pieces into one is offset by the Rune Bell being an AF for the ranged slot (notice I didn't give the GEO any ranged weapon abilities so nobody would feel bad about leaving that bell in the slot). I think the blue and white color combo is nice, reminiscent of FFT, but to the style of the older games. The colors would have to be dulled a bit to fit the style of FFXI. Maybe in my fake GEO inhabited arctic town blue is the color of mystics and the bobble shows that you are specifically a GEO. SE could think of something.

Have I painted any kind of picture for you yet? It makes sense to me at least. The light nature of the armor is key, making the GEO rely on JAs and JTs to tank instead of pure defense.

--------------------------------

Job Traits:

Level 1: Elementalist (GEO main only) - Utilize the effects of the environment (meaning weather. We'll get into it later). Named after: FFTA Geomancer ripoff. Sounded like a good name to describe the ability to draw in the influence of the environment.

Level 5: Poison Frog - Reverses the effects of "Poison." "Poison" ,specifically, is converted to a Regen-like effect at a gain equal to the damage per tick of the poison you are under. Only works if the "Poison" sticks. Not overpowered, but a nice little boon from time to time. Would allow "Regen" to stack onto its effect, which could be a good time for a healer to hit you with it. Hell, you could chug a poison pot and have them give you Regen. Named after: an FF6 geomancy by Mog.

Level 10: Parry Bonus - Improves chance of parrying physical attacks. No job had Parry Bonus, and it would be a good tool to keep mobs from puncturing your geomancy defenses, which would hurt. And suck.

Level 25: Twister - The effect of "Weight" adds the effect of "Haste." Like a hurricane or tornado that moves slowly but picks up more internal momentum. Note that you'll have both effects on; lowered movement speed & evasion, quicker attacks. "Haste" would last a little longer than the "Weight" since it would be hard to attack much if you couldn't even catch up to the mob. Named after: a tornado geomancy from FF5.

Level 35: Parry Bonus 2- Enhances the effects of "Parry Bonus"

Level 40: Counterflood - While enfeebled, all melee strikes have a chance to inflict the same status for the duration of that enfeeble. So if you get paralyzed and you slip a hit in, it may paralyze the enemy. Petrify and things like that don't let you attack anyway, so you couldn't be sticking Break on an enemy. Poison would still give you the regen from "Poison Frog" but you would still be shown as poisoned, and still be able to Counterflood it. Named after: FFT reaction ability.

Level 50: Planetary Shield - Gives a boost to elemental resistances. This would be an arbitrary amount added to all your resistances. I'm not sure how much would be good but not overpowered. Maybe +5 is enough, maybe +10. I don't know, but you get the idea. I pulled the name from my ass.

Level 60: Parry Bonus 3 - Enhances the effects of "Parry Bonus"

Parrying, resistances, and reaction abilities. I think these put GEO in a spot where they need to be the center of the mob's attentions to make much use of them. And they aren't adding anything that would be going off constantly, except maybe the parrying. If that was too many boosts to parry, they could always drop the last one. I don't think anything here is outside of the major theme. They all seem like side-effects that could come with practicing geomancy.

----------------------------

Job Abilities:
Meat and potatoes time. Instead of giving GEOs MP (which they've never had), or random abilities (doesn't make sense in an MMO to make your usefulness up in the air; Gambler had to have their abilities set, with only the strength a random thing), I figured I would give them one ability based on each element in the game. Just one. I figured that I could keep GEO out of BLM, elemental caster, area if I did this. They would also be based more on nature and less on the pure element.

This is how it works. Like Skill Chains, Fire-Wind-Lightning-Light are of the light elemental persuasion. Earth-Water-Ice-Dark are the dark elements. So that is how these JAs stack. You can't stack Earth and Fire, or Water with Wind. This also keeps you from having an element on you along with the element the first is weak/strong to. The light elements have protections mostly focused to magic damage, and the dark elements to physical, but that is just in general. I'm fuzzy on recharges and durations, but those are flexible.

Weather will boost the buff of its element by a percentage. I'm terrible at the math, so to simplify we'll say single effect weather gives a 50% boost to that element, and double-weather will give a 100% boost (doubling your buffs strength). But I'm sure that's too high. It's just an example.

Level 1: Harvester - Enhances geomancy. This would give double weather effects to all your active JAs. Obviously this would suck at first when you only have like 1 or 2 JAs, but later on it could be quite useful.
Recast= [2:00:00]
Animation: could be like a big swirl of crap like leaves and dust that shoot down into the GEO.
Named after: a FF6 geomancy.

Level 5: Demon Fire - Counter-attack magical damage with critical hits. This wouldn't be strong like Sneak Attack, but use a STR modifier as SA uses DEX. Just not nearly as strong. Once you were hit with burst damage, the initial sticking of a DoT, or a magical damage ability like Goblin Bomb, your next attack would be stronger. If the idiot kept hitting you with spells, you would keep critting, as long as the JA was active.
Fire based.
Duration= [1:00], Recharge=[1:00].
Animation: could look like a popping bubble of lava around the GEO.
Named after: a FFT geomancy.

Level 15: Carve Model - Absorb a certain amount of damage. Like Stoneskin, but based on a percentage of your maxHP. If the armors GEOs used were puny enough that GEOs bled HP left and right, I could see it being as much as 100% of maxHP. In theory, this move is creating a stone replica of yourself that takes damage until it crumbles. It would take the same damage at the same rate as the GEO. It may have to start at 75% maxHP so weather boosts could take it to 100%-125%. But really, if that sounds like too much, imagine a THF taking damage without any interference. He'd probably soak it up at a pretty good rate. Probably the key ability to main tanking on your own buffs. Anyway, Carve Model would not stack with, and would overwrite: Stoneskin, Metallic Body, Diamondhide. So if a job could give you one of these you may try stacking your other JAs and letting them put one on you, though it wouldn't be as strong alone as Carve Model.
Earth based.
Recharge=[3:00].
Animation: might look like the GEO becomes a white marble statue for a second with tumbling stone sounds and tiny bits of rubble flying off.
Named after: an FFT geomancy.

Level 20: Runic Bolt - Bolt that nullifies the next negative spell that targets you. Rune Knight ftw. This was their main thing; absorbing a spell into their sword. The difference here being that you don't absorb the MP cost of the spell. It just negates the spell like a magical Third Eye. It only works for single target spells, but with one weather boost- absorbs 2 single target spells, and with double-weather - absorbs 2 single target spells or your slice of damage from an AoE spell. I'm really pressed to make this like "Shield Bash" and preface this ability with "With a Great Sword equipped..." but that would be forcing GEO to use GS flat-out. Still....
Lightning based.
Recharge=[1:00]
Animation: GEO holds up his/her weapon and absorbs a big black bolt into it on usage.
Named after: Runic, the ability of Rune Knight (Celes) from FF6

Level 25: Briny Cannonade - Adds strong water damage to the attacks of allies within range. Basically EnWaterga. A nice way for GEO to do elemental damage without casting a burst or DoT spell. Steals from Magic Knight, acts like an AoE of the RDM Enwater. Shouldn't step on RDM toes too much since theirs is self-targeting, and GEO would only have one of these. Could be useful for getting some magical type damage to pt members attacks. I couldn't give something too powerful to be the first JA stackable with Carve Model. It's good enough alone, so Briny Cannonade shouldn't be too much. Reminds me of the ocean, as opposed to the generic "Water."
Water based.
Recharge=[0:30]
Animation: could look like a circular wave generating from the GEO outwardly.
Named after: a move by Famfrit in FFXII.

Level 32: Gust Vacuum - Physical damage against you also damages your attacker's MP. Like Aspir-Spikes, but again you don't get the MP. It just evaporates. I would have no idea how strong this needs to be to actually be useful, but not too far. I have no idea how big enemy MP pools are. However strong SE could make it, it would be useful to soak up hits from an enemy with strong magic. If you did it long enough you *might* be able to destroy their entire pool. But if it was strong enough to do that in less than 10 minutes on regular mage-mobs, it would probably be too strong.
Wind based.
Duration=[3:00], recharge=[5:00]
Animation: Maybe some green whisps of wind funnel into the top of the GEO's head when it's used.
Named after: Pandemonium's ass

Level 40: Glacial Surge - Counter an enemy's special attacks with ice-based attacks. This would be triggered from physically based specials like Goblin Rush. Mob WS basically. And you hit back with ice-damage. Not physical attacks with ice damage, but just ice damage (based on INT?). Like the physical counterpart of Demon Fire. Don't ask me how strong the attacks would be.
Ice based.
Duration=[1:00], Recharge=[2:00]
Animation: a crystal blue hunk of ice would slide into the enemy.
Named after: Surge, a FF6 geomancy

Level 50: Sun Bath - Grants damage resistance. Like Phalanx, but stronger. I don't know how much stronger or based on what. Maybe like (CHR*2)- 10 or something. Doesn't stack with Phalanx.
Light based.
Duration=[2:00], Recharge=[3:00]
Animation: like a golden honey-comb of light forms a wall in front of you for a second.
Named after: a FF6 geomancy

Level 60: Spectral Snare - Creates 2 shadow images that deal dark damage when they are attacked. Like Blink shadows; not Utsusemi. Won't stack with either. Mild-medium dark damage.
Dark based.
Recharge=[0:30]
Animation: 2 little purple and black flames fly out of the GEO and disappear, making a little ghost laugh sound
Named after: Specter and Snare, both from FF6

OK, I'll have to get back to this later. I'm beat.

[Hantz]

Re: Fleshed-out Job Concepts

Ah hell. Finishing that post netted me 30 minutes of OT at work.

I think I covered it all. I only included crap like the JA animation suggestions to help give a good visualization of the job. Most of those JAs would require you to be tanking to make use of them, and a lot of them grab hate in response to getting busted up and losing some in the first place.

The only thing that didn't seem to come across as well as I would have liked is the theme: visually, story fluff, etc. But oh well. If I had any way to use the model viewer (play on PS2, I'd have to get the game for PC and get the model viewer on it, and then learn how to use it to edit crap) I would just make a mock-up.

But I don't think there is anything left to say about it now.

[Wind Adept]

Re: Fleshed-out Job Concepts

Some cool stuff.

Awesome. The ideas, the look, the feel, the mood, the smell, the taste-- wait, no.

. . . they aren't adding anything that would be going off constantly, except maybe the parrying. If that was too many boosts to parry, they could always drop the last one. . . Carve Model - . . .Like Stoneskin, but based on a percentage of your maxHP. If the armors GEOs used were puny enough that GEOs bled HP left and right, I could see it being as much as 100% of maxHP.

If the geomancers' armor is not particularly heavy, then a high parrying rate would be needed to keep them from being an MP sponge when Carve Model goes down. The thing about carve model is I can see it being fairly useless against big-hitters that take off large chunks of HP. This would end up with the Geomancer needing some curebombing, 'cause those are probably going to be NMs or HNMs - not very inaccurate monsters. Perhaps it could be an unusual stoneskin, with a split effect? Something like 35% of the damage being absorbed by the Model until it's destroyed, with the remaining 65% going to the geomancer if it connects through parry? (I don't know about the numbers - same sort of situation you're in, Hantz) That would let the ability mitigate a certain amount of damage, though percent-based defenses might make paladins mad.


On the subject of absorbing the rune knight job and the runic bolt ability, that could be easily explained away. If Geomancer is channeling the power of the world around them (or the area's equivalent place in the astral plane or whatever), then it should be just as easy for them to channel that power back into the world.

Gust Vacuum - I have no idea how big enemy MP pools are. However strong SE could make it, it would be useful to soak up hits from an enemy with strong magic. If you did it long enough you *might* be able to destroy their entire pool. But if it was strong enough to do that in less than 10 minutes on regular mage-mobs, it would probably be too strong.

I heard that a black mage once aspir'd around 2000 MP from a thunder elemental in Qufim. I'm unsure whether this is simply because it was an elemental, but we can be pretty certain that monsters have monster MP pools. This may need tweaking.


I could see the rune bell enhancing most of the job abilities, but this might annoy other jobs whose ability enhancements are spread out among their various armor pieces. Of course, since Geomancer's entire role would be defined by its using its job abilities, anything that enhances them should be an item that isn't terribly hard to work into an equipment setup.

---Edit---

I was thinking that maybe the enhancement for Runic Bolt (with the bell or whatever it would be) could be something like making it an AoE buff! That way, geomancers would be extra useful for monsters that are full of -ga spells or maybe even saving an alliance from a meteor or two.

Also, it seems a shame that the whole special movement ability thing is not really even applicable in FFXI (seeing as travel is one of their timesinks and also adding water/lava-walking would be a whole lot of extra programming and designing and possibly even content for a single job). Perhaps they could gain bonuses in addition to those of their active abilities during weather or on unusual terrain (mud, sand, puddles, snow, etc.). Like, maybe one of those filler traits S-E gave to NIN and RNG. Something like Awareness or Stealth when there's weather or ground that makes special noise. Maybe a tiny movement bonus. At the very least, GEO should have an easier time with the mountain in Attohwa Chasm.

Haven't even considered the possibilities for Geomancer's subs (obviously warrior most of the time, for provoke and defender and so on) or its possibilities as a sub...

[Hantz]

Re: Fleshed-out Job Concepts

The thing about carve model is I can see it being fairly useless against big-hitters that take off large chunks of HP. This would end up with the Geomancer needing some curebombing, 'cause those are probably going to be NMs or HNMs - not very inaccurate monsters. Perhaps it could be an unusual stoneskin, with a split effect? Something like 35% of the damage being absorbed by the Model until it's destroyed, with the remaining 65% going to the geomancer if it connects through parry? (I don't know about the numbers - same sort of situation you're in, Hantz) That would let the ability mitigate a certain amount of damage, though percent-based defenses might make paladins mad.
---------------------------------------------------------
I heard that a black mage once aspir'd around 2000 MP from a thunder elemental in Qufim. I'm unsure whether this is simply because it was an elemental, but we can be pretty certain that monsters have monster MP pools. This may need tweaking.

You're completely right. I wrestled with how these things could work specifically, but I'm not going to pretend I got it right. I think the concepts for these abilities were pretty solid, but like you said, it needs tweaking.

Maybe Carve Model would be better with a 60%/40% absorbed/unchecked damage. Or maybe the model has the GEO's defense + X to keep it going longer. I dunno what would be best, but the seed is already planted.

Gust Vaccuum too. I don't know how strong is "too strong," but I think the easiest way to find out would be some play testing. And if SE is play testing "Gust Vaccuum," then the terrorists have already won. No, wait. I won. With my...ideas....

I gotta say, Wind Adept, that picture is great. That feathered Orc-tuft was nice.

[Ziero]

Re: Fleshed-out Job Concepts

First off, I know this is a necro Zombie bump. But with all the new job ideas that will inevitably come out over the next few weeks, I felt it would be best to keep one topic about that going, and I already said I'd be using this one. Plus I've already posted two jobs in this topic so I might as well add the rest of my ideas here.

Using this set up, the only current spell in game that would need to be changed would be Slow II. It's a basic concept for a Time Mage to have a spell such as that normally, but wouldn't be fair to Rdms. So I would suggest giving Rdm Amnesia or Plague instead as a merit ability and remove Slow II from thier list.
Now that that's out the way, without further ado, Time Mage:

Time Mage

Time Mage


Masters and manipulators of time and space itself, Time Mages utilize the darker arts of magic to assist their allies while weakening and destroying their foes. Their knowledge of the stars in the heavens and temporal energies that surround all beings allow them a powerful control over the universe itself. Bending, folding and commanding the powers of time and space at a whim, Time Mages are a force to be seen.

As Cor is similar to a 'weak' Rng with party buffs, Time Mage would be like a 'weak' Blm with party buffs and unique debuffs. Buffs and Debuffs that slow, stop, speed and enhance their pt members or enemy targets with direct damage DD spells focusing on non elemental, HP% based and dark elemental attributes, Time Mages would have a full arsenal of spells and abilities. Though they might start out a bit weak, once they start getting higher towards their JSE spells, they'll more then come into their own.

Job Abilities:
lvl 1 Galaxy Shift: Manipulates the Universe itself with powerful results.[2 hour recast/Duration varies]
This will basically be one big, super buff/debuff. When used on a target, it will inflict the monster with SlowII, Stop, BindII, Decay(the DoT), Erode and GravityII while inflicting the party with Hi-Haste, Sharpen, Reflect, Quicken, Concentrate and just for the heck of it, Fast Cast+ and Movement Speed+. The Fast Cast and Move+ will last about 30 seconds, but the other buffs/debuffs will stay for their full extent.

lvl 20 Temporal Seal:Increases potencey of the next time related spell[10 minute recast/60 duration or next spell cast]
This would basically make the next spell they cast stronger. It would work on buffs like haste and such, debuffs like slow, and 'time elemental' damage spells.

lvl 35 Temporal Burst:Allows next spell to Magic Burst any Skillchain[3 minute recats/1 minute or next spell duration]
Since most of the Time Mages spells are non-elemental in nature, this ability allows them to bend the rules of the universe so they can use any spell to burst any Skillchain, regardless of element.

lvl 40 Double Cast:Allows sequential casting of two chosen spells at reduced MP costs[5 minute recast/2 spell duration]
Once the ability is activated, you pick two spells. Once the second spell is cast you begin casting them. The cast time and MP cost on both spells is reduced by 50%.

Job Traits
lvl 10/30 Magic Accuracy Bonus I/II: Increases accuracy of spells cast to prevent resists.

lvl 20/50 Magic Attack Bonus I/II

lvl 35 Reverse MP: Restore a fraction of a spell's MP cost while casting.
Basically this is Time Mage's version of conserve MP. After completing a spell cast, a percentage of MP may be restored to the caster. The longer spells will give a better chance to regain MP as they'll usually use more MP as well. Plus it stacks with Conserve MP meaning that Blm can use Tim as a sub, or Tim could use Blm as a sub giving them both some more MP.

lvl 40/65 Quick cast I/II Allows the chance to quickly cast a spell.
Unlike Fastcast, which lowers the casting and recast times of spells, this one will allow you to cast a spell with a dramatically reduced cast time but with no affect on the recast timer. It's similar to comparing how Martial Arts is always working but Rapid Shot only procs occasionally.

Spells
1 - Decay: A time based damage spell that cause the target to grow old*
3 - Bind
5 - Slow
7 - Weight: Slows movemnt speed of target
9 - Crush: A Gravity based damage spell that crushes the target*
11 - Drain
12 - Erode: Lowers target's weapon damage*
15 - Shadow: Dark elemental attack spell*
17 - Crushga: Gravity based damage that targets all within range
18 - Distort Str: Gradually reduces Str over time*
18 - Warp
19 - Sharpen: Increases target's weapon damage. Party Target spell*
20 - Distort Agi: Gradually reduces Agi over time
22 - Distort Dex Gradually reduces Dex over time
23 - Aspir
23 - Gravity
24 - Distort Vit: Gradually reduces Vit over time
24 - Decay II: Stronger time based spell that ages the target
25 - Demi: Damages target with spacial warping based on it's remaining HP*
26 - Distort Mnd: Gradually reduces target's Mnd
27 - Crush II Stronger Gravity based damage spell
28 - Distort Int
30 - Comet: Physical damage spell that launches comets at the target*
30 - Low-Haste*
32 - Quicken: Speeds up recast timers on Job Abilities. Party Target spell*
33 - Shadow II: Stronger Dark elemental damage
35 - Exit: Removes party from area. AoE Party Target spell*
36 - Bindga: Binds all targets within range
38 - Haste*
38 - Concentrate: Increases Magic Accuracy of target. Party Target spell*
40 - Reflect: Reflects next single target spell back to caster. Self Target only*
41 - Decay III
42 - Warp II
42 - Bind II
43 - Graviga
45 - Slowga
45 - Consume: Drains HP from all targets within area of effect
48 - Crush III
49 - Hastega
50 - Demi II
50 - Stop: Prevents all actions from target for short duration of time*
51 - Slow II
53 - Shadowga: Dark elemental damage that hits all targets within range
55 - Osmos: Absorbs MP from all targets within range
57 - Meteo: Warps space and time to rain comets on all targets within range*
63 - Gravity II
64 - Decay IV
65 - Comet II
66 - Crush IV
67 - Shadow III
68 - Hi-Haste*
69 - Crushga II
70 - Hastega II
72 - Reflectra: Cast Reflect on other Party members. Party Target spell*
74 - Shadowga II
75 - Demi III

*Time Mage specific spells:
As masters of both time and space, a Time Mage would be able to use these elements to affect and alter both friends and foes. These spells would be unique to the Time Mage only and act differently then spells used by other jobs.

Damage Spells
Decay spells - The Decay set of spells is a Direct Damage spell with a unique DoT effect, similar to Bio or Dia. However, unlike Bio or Dia, the initial damage will be noticable, comparitively as strong as the Stone spell on neutral mobs, if only slightly weaker. The DoT however will also account for increased damage as it would be a non-elemental based DoT that increases per tick, similar to how resting increases over time. Higher tiered spells will result in more initial damage and a longer duration DoT.

Crush spells - The Crush line of spells will be a direct damage, non-elemental spell using the power of Gravity to inflict damage. It will be increased in strength similar to other attack spells, by increasing Int, MAB, or the correlating Skill.

Shadow - Shadow will be the long awaited Darkness elemental attack. Being able to control and manipulate the universe around themselves, Time Mages have learned to harness the all encompassing blackness of space to damage thier foes. This will be a normal style attack spell, prone to elemental resists and strengths and increasable through the appropriate stats.

Demi - Demi will be a gravity based attack that deals damage proportionate to the Targets HP. *BUT* the spell will have a hard cap and will only be able to do so much damage. It will be a slow casting, large MP usage spell, but it will have high damage and low resists. But as the mob's HP drops, so will the spells damage.

Comet and Meteo - These will be magical attacks that deal physical damage to the target. By utilizing comets, it will be like throwing a large rock at ones foe. Meteo will be an AoE version of Comet who's dmg will be weakend with more targets in range. Though increasing Int and MAB will increase this spells damage, Protect, Third Eye, Def, Vit and even Invincible will lower it's effect on the target.

Support Spells
Distort Stat - The Distort line of spells uses the passage of time to decrease the abilities of their foes. Over time, the stat down effect will grow larger and large, until it reaches it's maximum. Then it will slowly reverse itself until the stat is back at it's normal value. These will behave similar to the elemental debuffs, in that only two to three could be applied at once, according to the same elemental cycle.

Erode and Sharpen - These spells affect the DMG rating of their targets. Manipulating the passage of time, a Time Mage can either cause a weapon to dullen and do less damage or sharpen it to freshly forged state to increase it's damage. No other spell or ability can increase the DMG rating of a weapon, so this will be unique to Time Mage.

Haste - The normal Haste will be exactly similar to the current Haste in game. Low-Haste and Hi-Haste however will be quite different. Low-Haste will be a lower MP, shorter casting, longer duration Haste. But it's increased speed effect will be noticably slower then that of the other two hastes, similar to a single march. Hi-Haste on the other hand will be more MP, longer Cast time, shorter duration and a stronger effect. In essence, this will give the Time Mage complete control over how fast his melees swing and how long a mage's recasts are. Spamming Hi-Haste will give better results, but will drain MP quickly, using Low-Haste will be MP efficiant and last for a while, but the effects will be the weaker of the three. A Time Mage will need to learn when to use each one for maximum effect. Hastega will have Low-Haste's potency with half the duration and Hastga II will have Haste's potency with half the duration. Higher tiers of haste will overwrite lower tiers.

Concentrate and Quicken - These are two more unique party buffs for Time Mage. One will allow casters to better focus their spells and deal more damage with less resists, the other will assist melees by reducing JA recasts by a set percentage.

Reflect and Reflectra - Reflect will allow the player to avoid one attack spell and bounce it back to it's caster. It only works on single target spells and wears off after one use. The damage dealt from the spell will also be severly reduced from it's original casting. Reflectra will work the same way, only it will let the Time Mage place reflect on other members of it's party, one at a time, to give them the same effect. Some spells, such as all -ga spells, and some NMs will be able to cast through reflect however.

Stop - Stop will act similar to Stun and Fear in that it will prevent a target from acting. However it will *not* interrupt that target if it is in mid action. It will have a fast casting speed, but high MP cost. The result will be a target frozen in time, unable to move, act or defend itself. However once the effect wears off, the monster will continue what it was doing unless additional actions were taken while it was Stopped. The duration of the spell will be much longer then Stun, and as it's not a lightning elemental magic, it will far less likely to be resisted by certain monsters. Some creatures will be imune to this though, as they are with stun.


Skills and Gear
Temporal Skill -A
Dark Skill -A
Enhancing Skill B
Enfeebling Skill -B
Elemental Skill E
Staff -B
Club C
Dagger C

Gear wise they will equip similar to Blm with some access to doublets and such. Clubs and Wands will give them the best stat boost through the entire game save for needing the Dark Staff for obvious reasons. Both Int and Mnd, along with MAB and MACC will be useful to TIMs.

[hongman]

Re: Fleshed-out Job Concepts

Bravo. Im not one to critcise becuase I often find myself missing important elements, but that was certainly interesting.

Any reason Temporal Seal doesnt follow the current Divine/Elemental seal LvL and recast timers?

EDIT: I like the Double Cast, lets give it to RDM :p

[Ziero]

Re: Fleshed-out Job Concepts

Bravo. Im not one to critcise becuase I often find myself missing important elements, but that was certainly interesting.
Any reason Temporal Seal doesnt follow the current Divine/Elemental seal LvL and recast timers?

...cause off the top of my head, I didn't remember them. But that's a minor change and wouldn't hurt to do at all >_>

EDIT: I like the Double Cast, lets give it to RDM :p

You got your fastcast and chainspell, ain't that enough! >=O

....Actually, that reminds me...forgot the two hour <.<

[hongman]

Re: Fleshed-out Job Concepts

...cause off the top of my head, I didn't remember them. But that's a minor change and wouldn't hurt to do at all >_>



You got your fastcast and chainspell, ain't that enough! >=O

....Actually, that reminds me...forgot the two hour <.<

lol....i didnt even notice the lack of 2 hr....

Anyways, my question on the Temp Seal was more outta curiousity, for example you may have found a valid reason to make that JA not subable.

FastCase and ChainSpell are not enough, I WANT MOAR!!!

[Tokitoki]

Re: Fleshed-out Job Concepts

Moved from "Mystic Knight" thread.

It's mainly a recycled spell list and concept.

And Malacite's concept for Mystic Knight isn't a recycled RDM without the PT buffs. Whether OMG wants to think it or not, Avesta is using RDM's abilities (en- spells, self buffs, etc) to take on these big things. En- spells were given to RDM, and again, on the most basic level, these are higher tiered en- spells.

Cor and Rng only have one thing in common, and that's Ranged WS. ... Rng doesn't need to do anything but shoot stuff, where as Cor is supposed to do something completely different.

COR is supposed to shoot stuff and buff. RNG doesn't do anything but shoot stuff, thus COR is similar, on the most basic levels, to RNG. And even if you look at COR in another way, it's similar to BRD on the most basic level because it does PT AoE buffs without the consumption of MP.

Your arguments that everything has to be original is stupid. I'm sure if I tried I could relate every job in this game to another by using the same type of reasoning you do.

[Ziero]

Re: Fleshed-out Job Concepts

Moved from "Mystic Knight" thread.
And Malacite's concept for Mystic Knight isn't a recycled RDM without the PT buffs. Whether OMG wants to think it or not, Avesta is using RDM's abilities (en- spells, self buffs, etc) to take on these big things. En- spells were given to RDM, and again, on the most basic level, these are higher tiered en- spells.

The concept for Mystic Knight spells is completelty different from Enspells. Enspells add additional damage to an attack, but Malacite's concept *changes* the weapons physical damage to magical damage. And recycling *some* spells isn't that big of a deal, but when you have basically take an existing spell list from a job that can already do the same thing then add and remove some spells yet still have it do the same thing, it's kinda redundent.

COR is supposed to shoot stuff and buff. RNG doesn't do anything but shoot stuff, thus COR is similar, on the most basic levels, to RNG. And even if you look at COR in another way, it's similar to BRD on the most basic level because it does PT AoE buffs without the consumption of MP.
Your arguments that everything has to be original is stupid. I'm sure if I tried I could relate every job in this game to another by using the same type of reasoning you do.

Cor is a Buffer, and as you said, closer to Brd then Rng. Rng is a DD who specializes in ranged weapons. The *roles* do not need to be different, the execution and abilities do. Where Cor is based on luck and long timers, Brd is not. Where Rng is able do massive Dmg with their ranged attacks, other jobs have to be up close. It's not *what* they do, it's how they do it. And the Geo concept is using items to cast spells that already exist and nothing more. Perhaps if there was a more detailed and thought out description given it might seem better, but right now it's seems to me as a very simplistic concept.

Though thank you for taking the discussion here. =)

[DakAttack]

Re: Fleshed-out Job Concepts

Dancer seems like a job that could only function while being seen. It would be interesting if the job had a few hate tools, or could pass off hate to whomever it was standing behind when it danced. Instead of buffing the party, it could debuff the enemy by lowering evasion, defense, etc.

The bells are a lot different than BLU's magic. A Blue Mage just travels out alone or with a group and grinds an enemy until they learn its skill, after which it can be used whenver they want. Geomancers would be required to prepare for every party by traveling to certain areas with certain items and repeatedly turning them into certain other items. Ninjas just buy up tools at the AH, or craft them. The tools even come in stacks of stacks. It'd be crazy for them to run around the world turning items into other items.

Perhaps they can learn their spells a la Blue Mage from Elementals? I don't know, I'm starting to realize my ideal for Geomancer seems as out there as everybody elses' ideals.

[Malacite]

Re: Fleshed-out Job Concepts

Aside from being my personal favorite job, Mystic Knight was only ever in FFV, and it would be awesome to have it brought back ^_^


That said, LF mentioned (in my thread he attempted to jack -.-) a comparison to Bard and Dancer in terms of enfeebles versus buffs. Bard has gotten a couple of enfeebles in FFXI, so there's no reason Dancer can't get a couple of buffs. I do believe it should remain a music-based enfeebling class though. SE would have to come up with some unique debuffs though so that it's not just a BRD version of RDM.

Oh, and it has to have charm >_>

[LyonheartLakshmi]

Re: Fleshed-out Job Concepts

If you're going to steal, steal from the best: lets make Dancer rely on players using a DDR pad and base their effectiveness that way. Who needs FFXI on Wii when you can just play Dancer DDR style?

[Lmnop]

Re: Fleshed-out Job Concepts

**************************
FOR ANYONE WHO FEELS LOST
**************************


About halfway down the page, Legal Fish begins a derail that was detoured here.