SE and their beloved Ninjas

[DakAttack]

Re: SE and their beloved Ninjas

I don't even think it's possible for a Paladin to complete 6-4 as the only tank unless they're equipped like a Ninja. They'll need an Emperor Hairpin, 4mil, a Scorpian Harness, 10mil, two Bat Earrings, 80k, Blind Potions, 15k, and a Wind Staff, 400k. On top of that there's countless Potions, Food, CCB polymers, etc. So if you ever see me in Sea it's because I copped out and bought gil.

I can suqeeze out +39 Vit and countless more Def when I need to, yet that's not nearly enough to mitigate any sort of damage? I keep trying this fight and every single time I'm being hit for 200+ damage a hit. This was obviously not meant to be tanked by anything that doesn't have shadows. Even if I were to mitigate let's say half the damage, and I'm being generous here, I would still be faced with the constant stun lock.

SE must be strong believers in the Taoist philosophy.

[WishMaster3K]

Re: SE and their beloved Ninjas

PLDs with the Purple and Grey armor sets start taking Hits like jokes. That grey armor is purely ungodly tho. I usually see it on gods, but in exp, I can actually havea BRD main heal a PLD with that gear on. Capped Defense is no joke.

[dirtyclown]

Re: SE and their beloved Ninjas

Tell a PLD they can be lazy, and you'll have a very heavy paperweight on the ground of wherever you happen to be exping.

Sig'd.

[WishMaster3K]

Re: SE and their beloved Ninjas

LoL. I'm not sure how you took that, but you put it in your sig, so. . . . .uhm, TY ^.^???

[dirtyclown]

Re: SE and their beloved Ninjas

I actually thought it was pretty hilarious and quite true at the same time. We're never allowed to be lazy.

[little ninja]

Re: SE and their beloved Ninjas

I can suqeeze out +39 Vit and countless more Def when I need to, yet that's not nearly enough to mitigate any sort of damage? I keep trying this fight and every single time I'm being hit for 200+ damage a hit. This was obviously not meant to be tanked by anything that doesn't have shadows. Even if I were to mitigate let's say half the damage, and I'm being generous here, I would still be faced with the constant stun lock.

actually this is the same for all jobs. no matter what you add on it doesnt ever seem to be enough. i added so much chr gear to my bst, an i still mischarm on d/c mobs. 150+chr an a apollos staff, an i mischarm a steelshell back to back. same could be said for my ninja, even though i had the eva, an agi, i didnt miss as many hits has the next nin tank did.

fact is you can have 40vit, over 1k def, parry,shield,an eva all capped. an you still get wacked around by exp mobs. this is my eyes is the biggest porblem ingame. its like bringing a little league pitcher to pitch against barry bonds. an this little leager strikes him out 99.9% of the time. thats hwo out of balance it is.

[TheGrandMom]

Re: SE and their beloved Ninjas

I think it's ironic that for people that are so serious about their jobs, their gear, their numbers, they seem to be saying "It's my right to be lazy!"

Just a thought of mine. Tell a PLD they can be lazy, and you'll have a very heavy paperweight on the ground of wherever you happen to be exping.

I so agree. I see it all the time in endgame. People get lazy and then they eat dirt. Tonight in Dynamis trying to get people Beaucidine clearance was horrendous. Too much afk, slacking off, joking around, and we didn't even come close! Last week we went in with less people and a more focused attitude and nearly did it. A pld with a good focused attitude that does the research and gets the right equips is a powerhouse. I do roaming pts in the Celestial Nexus and weapons all the time with a pld in our LS. It's non-stop exp and every bit as good as a nin tank. And man do we have fun!! Good players = good exp regardless.

[WishMaster3K]

Re: SE and their beloved Ninjas

I love PLDs, they remind me what it is to be a RDM. So much work! I haven't been that busy since the mid 60s, where mobs got SUPER hard, for some reason. I think it's cause we could take out half a mobs life in the light sc+mb from 2-3 players, so we went for the big boys.

Mobs back then loved to resist me ;; curse my Spider Torque!

[Zempten]

Re: SE and their beloved Ninjas

Why should I be angry because people want a tank that can completely avoid physical and magical damage, as well as enfeebling magic? That's like playing your favorite game as a god with the rare area-effect spell as your only weakness. While Paladins are out there taking every single hit to the teeth Ninjas are skipping along humming quite a nice tune. Paladins need constant supervision and upkeep, such as constant cures, constant Erases or other such spells, and a slot in the Refresh cycle, while Ninjas can replace their White Mage with a Summoner and breeze through the kills with even more ease thanks to the Avatar buffs. How could a tank that requires MORE effort be so much worse than a tank that requires practically none?

I'm not sure if your aware, but on my NIN it isn't exactly easy to "tank". NIN's main priority is keeping shadows up and keeping hate. Shadows are killed alot faster as you move up since mobs have Double Attack and stuff like Goblin Rush and Jet Stream aren't very friendly towards shadows. So we basically need to time our shadows pretty well (which involves "constant supervision"). Also with an old patch, when a a hit was covered by a shadow we lose a bit of hate, which makes holding hate a little tougher.

Where as PLDs needs constant cures and status cures so do NINs. In fact, I think status cures are more detrimental to a NIN then a PLD. You can't tell me that PLDs are going to be in deep trouble if they are silenced, but NINs . . we're basically dead when we're silenced.

Where as PLDs need a Refresh slot. NINs need a Haste slot.

PLDs can also replace their healer with a RDM or SMN, you just need a BRD. However when fighting mobs with tons of AE. I think both PLDs and NINs would prefer a WHM.

Both jobs have their places in an exp PT. You can't expect one PT setup to work just as great with another PT.

I'll take a small example from last night.

The first part of our PT it was RDM,SMN,PLD,THF, DRK and RNG. DRK and RNG made Light and I would get the SATA Spinning Slash. I would either "Hide" and erase hate or I would run behind the PLD and get covered.

Later on our PT became RDM,SMN,NIN,THF,DRK, and DRG. DRK and DRG made Light and me and DRG would take turns getting SATA Spinning Slash by alternating "Hide" and "Super Jump". If both we're up I would get the SATA Spinning Slash and pray that by the time 6 shadows were gone the mob was dead, which usually happens as I TA the NIN with a WS.

[Lmnop]

Re: SE and their beloved Ninjas

pld will need Refresh AND Haste in order to keep up with a Hasted nin.

How could a tank that requires MORE effort be so much worse than a tank that requires practically none?

That's the important part. The Ratio of effort to exp is much less noticable with a nin tank. To make some corny attempt at shoving it all into numbers: if party puts forth 5 points of effort with a pld tank, they get 2k exp/hour. If they put forth 5 points of effort with a nin tank, they get 5k/hour. If the pld party puts forth 50 points of effort, they get 6k/hour. If nin party puts forth 50, they get 6k.

Basically, the better the party, the less it matters. But like I said before, Nins let you be lazy.

[Taskmage]

Re: SE and their beloved Ninjas

Has anyone had any experience with Noctoshield on a pld tank in exp pt?

[Karinya]

Re: SE and their beloved Ninjas

No - come to think of it, I haven't even seen Noctoshield used against Byakko or dynamis monks, where it could prevent hundreds of points of damage even if the amount prevented per hit is relatively low.

Does anyone have hard numbers on Noctoshield's damage reduction? Is it based on level? summoning magic skill? something else?

Diabolos's Noctoshield is incredibly strong - 50+ reduction, I think - but that doesn't necessarily carry over to the player-usable BP, even at 75. Still, if it reduced by even half Diabolos's level, that would be 37 damage reduced at 75 - I only take about 120 from a non-crit hit from a Kindred Warrior as it is, less if I shield block. Reducing that by 37 would be incredible.

I still haven't beaten uncapped Diabolos, though (0/10 and pretty much given up on pickup attempts), so I can't test it myself.

[TheGrandMom]

Re: SE and their beloved Ninjas

Our smn's used Noctoshield often when we first got Diabolos. The problem is that there is rarely a tank in the smn pt when we hunt. There may be a rng or two in the smn pt but thats about it.

[Artaxerxes]

Re: SE and their beloved Ninjas

Last night a pt in Lufaise Meadows killing rams and birds with a paladin tank and in an hour we got 12k. Pt setup was whm, rdm, blm, pld, mnk, drk (Nace you teh man!!)

Couldn't agree more.

I'm calling B.S on this, that sort of quick kills isn't possible without drgs, thfs or rangers.

[TheGrandMom]

Re: SE and their beloved Ninjas

You can call bs on it all you want but its a fact. I only pt with ls members thus making for a tight knit group of people that know how well the other one plays. We were the only pt in the meadows and never had to rest once besides the "brb wc"'s. Sorry your pts experiences are crappy but I never worry about pting with Nace anywhere. We always rake in awesome exp.