Nin/rdm

[Naran]

This combo gets alot of scuff and yet is so very popular.
I personaly dont see why this is such a bagged on combo....
You see with the NIN abilitys lowering resestince to elements and the RDM En.. spells and NIN double wepons this combo works very well.
Picture it. A mon weak to fire then NiN abilty to lower it and then Enfire on both wepons DMG up the wazooooooo..............


But as this is a forum whats your opinion?

[Tifa]

you do a lot more dmg with /WAR.

[Mila]

not neccesarilly... a nin/blm can do really impressive damage w/ ni level magic... similarly, I'd imagine a nin/rdm could do so as well.

[LadyPeorth]

I've got a NIN/BLM in my SMN's static. He does damage that Blackmages only wish they could do. Over 1000 damage in 6 seconds is very impressive. However, he was using elemental staves and not dual weilding. /RDM would offer less damage and something he'd never use for damage, melee striking. Overal, /BLM and /WAR seem like the best choices, but then again I've never seen a NIN/RDM in action so wouldn't know

[Deathguise]

NIN/RDM would benefit from fast cast, otherwise it could be used like a NIN/BLM but with less damage from nuking.

[UnnamedGalka]

Picture it. A mon weak to fire then NiN abilty to lower it and then Enfire on both wepons DMG up the wazooooooo..............

Since when did En-spells ever do any significant damage?

Anyway, the biggest flaw with this combo is this...you'll be missing out on Provoke, which is quite an essential ability for a NIN, since everyone expects them to blink tank.

Go ahead and try NIN/RDM...can't really guarantee you'll get very far with it, especially in the higher levels, but whatever. Play the game however you want.

And sorry, but...

I've got a NIN/BLM in my SMN's static. He does damage that Blackmages only wish they could do.

...you'll forgive me if I say that I'm having a hard time believing this statement. NIN/BLM might be able to do decent damage with nukes, but it's quite unrealistic to say that they can outnuke a BLM main of the same level...heck even a few levels lower.

[Alauna]

NIN/BLM dont use Elemental Magic 'per say'. They use Ni Nijutsu + Elem. Staves (using the BLM Mag. At. Bonus) to deal healthy doses of dmg.

You don't see RNG/NIN or THF/NIN spamming Ninjutsu spells (save for Utsu) because its a 1/2 lvl skill. Same for NIN/BLM, and elem. magic being 1/2 lvl.

Sure, NIN/BLM might drop a nuke, just to draw attention, but if he's good, he shouldnt need to.

[LadyPeorth]

Originally posted by UnnamedGalka
...you'll forgive me if I say that I'm having a hard time believing this statement. NIN/BLM might be able to do decent damage with nukes, but it's quite unrealistic to say that they can outnuke a BLM main of the same level...heck even a few levels lower.

As stated a post before, they spam Ni ninjitsu magic with elemental staves and in order. So by the time they're gone full cycle, each Ni spell casted is doing 160ish damage per cast. In the time it takes for a Magic Bursted Freeze to go off, he probably could have gotten off nearly almost the exact same damage. If he has haste, there is no stopping him. Mind you though...he's an incredibly rich player (all +1 staves and now he's saving for scorpion harness+1), but he certainly knows how to do his job well

[fuz]

Before lvl 60 on nin main, /rdm should be equivalent in damage as /blm sub won't have the second magic attack bonus, but gets fast cast as well. En-spells shouldn't do anything in terms of damage as they are dependent on enhancing magic skill. The damage they do can easily be resisted when subbed and hitting IT mobs (not that you will with an elemental staff--which has en-spells built in already, so what is the point?). The occasional cure could be nice.

Then again, warp is oh so convenient.

As for the nukes, there are 5 that can be cast. Some will be resisted, some not. About 500-800 damage per wheel, and can be cast rather quickly, maybe 2-4 times a battle depending on how strong the mob is. Unlike your average blm, a nin doesn't need to worry much about getting hate so they can cross the hate threshold as often as they want as long as they doesn't mess up a TA. A blm can chain-nuke for far more damage in a short time, but will obviously bring dire consequences on the PT and himself. A blm can not pass the hate threshold until the mob is near death--a highly limiting factor, and is why rgn/nin is more powerful than rng/war. Why blm doesnt sub nin, is for utility--MP can do a lot more things than damage alone.

[XnoXzempt]

Phalanx/Enspells/Stoneskin are all dependent on your Enhancing Magic Level.

TRUST ME. They'll be gimped as hell subbed.
Phalanx will only reduce damage by 4 points.
En-spells will only hit for 8-10 points of damage.
Stoneskin can only take 60-110 points of damage.

And this is all assuming you have your /RDM subbed at 74 with capped Enhancing Skill Magic.

[Dtec]

FYI here is a nin/rdm in action:

As you can see, Aiame (the nin/rdm) is clearly outdamaging me, Dtec (nin/war, although I had mostly evasion gear on). In that screenshot alone, she did well over 600+ dmg and I only did 300+ dmg.

[UnnamedGalka]

As you can see, Aiame (the nin/rdm) is clearly outdamaging me, Dtec (nin/war, although I had mostly evasion gear on). In that screenshot alone, she did well over 600+ dmg and I only did 300+ dmg.

So she was doing more damage with her Ninjitsu than you were doing in general...with her using elemental staves and having higher INT, it's not surprising in the least. I don't mean any offense, but this alone does not convince me that NIN/RDM is the most practical combination out there. From the look of it, she was not tanking...she was just serving as a DD...any decent BLM could've done the job she was doing, only better.

It's not to say that a NIN/RDM can't be effective in their own way (I actually think that a Ninjitsu nuker is rather interesting), it's just that it's not what the vast majority of pickup parties expects a NIN to do. Like I've stated before, pretty much everyone nowadays expects a NIN to blink tank, and any tank without Provoke is a total party wipeout just waiting to happen. I've had enough experience with Provoke to recognize its vital role in directing hate control...I simply don't buy any arguments to the contrary.

[Jei]

im interested to see nin/blm damage in action. could anyone post screenshots of their damage?

[fuz]

Nin enfeebles are stronger than their spell counterparts, so nin DD by spells and enfeebs is about equivalent to a mage.

At lvl 60+ when subbing blm, they get another 4% boost in spell damage, which is enough to get near 200 per ni spell.

The main power of this type of nin is the very low support they need. They can take hits by blink, and dish out constant damage without need to rest (like a ranger, but can't SC). The way that a nin nuker can't replace a blm is is MB and extra utility such as: backup healing, escape, warp, elemental enfeebs, and sleep.

However, I am sure a nin can output more damage than a blm in most exp PTs, since most melee do already, and a nuking nin pretty much matches if not exceeds a rng.

[sudo]

a blm nuking is also limited in any pt by how much agro the tank can manage to generate.

A smart blm doesn't want to tank. A sucidial blm can put up insane numbers for 1 cast then of course flop down dead eating dirt 10 seconds later even with all the buffs they can stack on.

No cover = dead blm if he over nukes.

Blms who pull too much hate eventually learn that they should nuke less because they die and generate more down time in that they need to be cured as well.

A nin/rdmblm nuker theoritically should have at least 11 hits in him before he takes any damage, even then he'll live through 5 hits or more. With no evasion gear, a mob would have far less misses if the nin/blm tanks. But then again, you should be able to absorb far more hits than a regular blm who has stoneskin + blink for maybe 4 hits absorbed and another 4 hits to die.

8 vs 16 hits = much more survivability

Not to mention that if you decide to go nin/blm or rdm you really HAVE to get all the elemental staffs. That means you have evasion +10 on wind and 20% damage reduction.

You also have the option of using eq swap macros on the nin/blm to make yourself a capable blink tank in a second.

Parry still does work on staff and last I checked, nin still had A rating in that too.

Nin/mage does work but takes incredibly high amounts of gil to even get started. The elemental staffs are REQUIRED to achieve 150+ damage consistantly as is a moldvite earring and loads of Int gear.

Int gear isn't cheap at all due to the demand by all the blm and rdm in the game.

Really, it's hard to believe it works but it does. I had to try it myself to see it too.

And why you want to have a nin/rdm or blm in an exp pt?

Last time we let our nin go that way because she was curious and frankly there was 5 pld lfg and no DD. We figured that might as well convert our nin to the DD role.

With just +22 int at lv 55, she was doing some 80ish per cast with some spells getting through at 140 damage rarely.

I am smn and have all the staffs and 1/2 of them HQ so it was not that hard to get up to 120-130 damage per cast after she got her macros sorted out and I just lent them to her for the fights. (set pt, I don't lend that much eq to strangers)

Need magic attack bonus II at lv 60 to see 150+ and probably a moldvite to get over the 160 hump.

Burn status on the mob also helps to ramp damage up to 170 ish. No brd can keep up with the nin as far as I've come across but it would be some truely amazing brd work if you can trenody every single spell cast with the nin.

Now that would be one hell of a time but would be absolutely amazing to see.

Anyone have a twin they play with and have one play brd, the other nin?