Guide: Melee stats for dummies.

[Armando]

Re: Guide: Melee stats for dummies.

77 technically. The game almost never rounds up.

[Lmnop]

Re: Guide: Melee stats for dummies.

/enters the conversation without a clue.

In this case, wouldn't it be looking at the reduction that's getting rounded down? I.e. -12.whatever seconds gets rounded down to -12 seconds.

[Callisto]

Re: Guide: Melee stats for dummies.

No, it's the actual recast timer that is rounded down, the time remaining to cast again...which works in the player's favor, unlike most instances of flooring in game mechanics...essentially due to rounding you don't actually have to hit the 50% recast cap except on spells with extremely long recast timers, you need just enough to push it to where it's at ##.9 seconds, and it will floor down.

For example, on Ichi the minimum timer is 15s, but you just have to get it to 15.9s for that to round down, which is only a 47% reduction.

[Vyuru]

Re: Guide: Melee stats for dummies.

That is pretty damn cool :D

[Armando]

Re: Guide: Melee stats for dummies.

Bump. Completely rewrote the Haste and Dual Wield sections. Feedback please.

[Malacite]

Re: Guide: Melee stats for dummies.

However, we can also define a very useful quantity I like to call the Haste Factor, which tells you your percentage increase in attack rounds over any period of time.

* Haste Factor = 1/(1 - Haste%)

For example, a melee with 20% Haste has a Haste Factor of 1/0.80 = 1.25, which means they get 25% more attack rounds than they normally would.

Using the Haste Factor, you can also calculate by how much you'll increase your attack rounds when you add more Haste to a pre-existing amount. All you have to do is take the ratio of the new Haste Factor to the old one. For instance, let's say you have 20% Haste and want to know how much more often you would attack with 25% Haste. The Haste Factor with 25% Haste is 1/1.75 = 1.333, so the improvement is 1.333/1.25 = 1.0664 = 6.64%!

Doing two calculations and then taking the ratio looks tedious, but a bit of algebra will reveal a shortcut:

* New Haste Factor/Old Haste Factor = (1 - Old Haste%)/(1 - New Haste%)

The inverted order may be confusing but there's an easy way to remember which number goes where: if you're adding Haste, then your performance has to go up and the ratio has to be greater than 1. So the smaller of the two numbers will go in the denominator. Using this formula, we could've arrived at our answer earlier simply by dividing 0.80/0.75. Convenient!

And this is why I hate math. Ow > - <


Great guide, like the changes but I just can't wrap my head around the math.

[Yellow Mage]

Re: Guide: Melee stats for dummies.

I hate math.

This explains so many things about you.

[Armando]

Re: Guide: Melee stats for dummies.

I can't help if you don't tell me what about the math you can't wrap your brain around. All I did was simple division. Did I jump from one idea to the next in an abrupt way and you got lost somewhere? Did some number pop out of nowhere and you don't know what it means?

This is precisely what I talked about in my OP. This shit isn't hard, it's basic arithmetic. If you don't get it I'm not explaining clearly enough.

[Malacite]

Re: Guide: Melee stats for dummies.

Well, you defined the Floor for Attack but not the other categories for starters.

For example, a melee with 20% Haste has a Haste Factor of 1/0.80 = 1.25, which means they get 25% more attack rounds than they normally would.

This part is easy enough, I get that 0.80 would be 1 - 20% but... not entirely sure how you got that figure. I mean why 0.8? Is it because we're taking away from the natural delay? (Only logical thing I can think of)

(Oh and you're right, it's not so much that I can't follow math as I need a better explanation; it's like gr 11 programming all over again but at least you're 10x more competant that the moron teacher I had @_@)


The rest of it is where I get really confused... first off, I'm assuming you have to do it that way because haste isn't a linear progression (Not sure what the term is, but I'm fairly sure geometric isn't correct either as it's not going up in a pattern of higher powers e.g. 2x2=4x2=8 or 2x2=4x4=16x16=256 etc)


Actually I can follow it fairly easy now... it was like fairly late when i was reading it and I had my mind on other things. Just took me a moment to get it all sorry. Please ignore this humble idiot ^^


English was always my strongsuit, not math. In fact I used to bewilder my Gr 11 math teacher because on the tests by some stroke of twisted luck (what else could it have been?) I would get all the hardest questions right but screw up the easy ones. Used to have a knack for coming up with answers in a completely roundabout, nonsensical way that confused the hell out of best friend but was still somehow correct >.> she never did understand it (nor did I)

I chalk it up to being an inventive thinker (forget where I found that I.Q. test now but that's what I got)


Final EDIT: I thought it was well established long ago that magical haste capped @ 50%? Why the hell would the others all cap at nice, even numbers but not magical?

[Armando]

Re: Guide: Melee stats for dummies.

This part is easy enough, I get that 0.80 would be 1 - 20% but... not entirely sure how you got that figure. I mean why 0.8? Is it because we're taking away from the natural delay? (Only logical thing I can think of)

Sorry, when I first wrote that I forgot to write the justification, and I threw it in later. Here it is.

% increase in attack rounds =
New number of attack rounds/Old number of attack rounds =
(Elapsed Time/New Delay)/(Elapsed Time/Old Delay) =
Old Delay/New Delay =
Old Delay/[Old Delay * (1 - Haste%)] =
1/(1 - Haste%)

In case you didn't get it, in the last part the "Old Delay" on top and below cancel each other out.

Edit: I just moved the justification to the proper section and broke it down more clearly in the guide.

Edit2: Damn it, I hit the character limit. Is there any way for the mods to split up my OP into two posts so I end up with double the space or something like that?

[Lmnop]

Re: Guide: Melee stats for dummies.

Mal, I think the 50% was the old "accepted" value. Still, 43/44 is surprisingly low.

[Malacite]

Re: Guide: Melee stats for dummies.

especially considering that soul voice + double marches (with a +2 effect) totals 40%.

[LeonstrifeLEV]

Re: Guide: Melee stats for dummies.

min and max fstr still kinda confuses me a bit. is it like with a rank 10 weapon the bare minimum bonus to fstr i can possibly have is -10 and the highest i can get it is 18? and to hit that 18 i would need about a 72 difference in str with the mobs vitality?

[Armando]

Re: Guide: Melee stats for dummies.

Pardon the late-ish reply. You're correct, except you'd need 68 more STR than the enemy has VIT, not 72 since (68+4)/2 = 18. That +4 is just part of the formula, it's not part of the STR-VIT difference between you and the mob.

[LeonstrifeLEV]

Re: Guide: Melee stats for dummies.

nice. thank you.