Status of the Balance of Defense-centered Jobs

[Maju]

Re: Status of the Balance of Defense-centered Jobs

Proof of the imbalance, or over-dependance, of Utsusemi can be seen by doing a /sea all 75 NIN, and comparing the number of players to other jobs. There's as many NINs on my server as there are BLMs and RDMs (not combined). Jobs like PLD, DRG, DRK, are like half that or less.

Right now on Midddy:

148 BLMs
138 RDMs
136 NINs
113 WHMs
63 MNKs
59 WARs
52 THFs
46 BRDs
39 PLDs
30 DRKs
19 RNGs
15 DRGs

[Murphie]

Re: Status of the Balance of Defense-centered Jobs

361 NIN, 163 PLD on Bahamut. Not quite as dramatic a difference.

[Mhurron]

Re: Status of the Balance of Defense-centered Jobs

Right now on Midddy:

148 BLMs
138 RDMs
136 NINs
113 WHMs
63 MNKs
59 WARs
52 THFs
46 BRDs
39 PLDs
30 DRKs
19 RNGs
15 DRGs

Which proves what? People that have 75 PLD weren't on right then? People that have 75 PLD were leveling other jobs?

Big deal, there were less 75 PLD on right then, a meaningless statistic.

[Murphie]

Re: Status of the Balance of Defense-centered Jobs

You'd have to do the same query over and over again over the course of a week or more to get any kind of reasonable statistic. And even then it's not a perfect system.

My numbers were /sea all, not /sea 75.

[Mhurron]

Re: Status of the Balance of Defense-centered Jobs

Or look at the latest census that has both NIN and PLD at 6%.

[Murphie]

Re: Status of the Balance of Defense-centered Jobs

Or that.

[Maju]

Re: Status of the Balance of Defense-centered Jobs

Which proves what? People that have 75 PLD weren't on right then? People that have 75 PLD were leveling other jobs?

Big deal, there were less 75 PLD on right then, a meaningless statistic.

It's not meaningless statistics. Sure, it is possible that because of some freak occurrance all the PLDs weren't playing and and all the NINs were playing, however, that possibility remains no matter how large my sample is.

I think it's safe to say that NIN is much more frequently played than PLD even if a simple search test can in no way be used as accurate data.

[Karinya]

Re: Status of the Balance of Defense-centered Jobs

And just why do you think it is that so many PLD75 were on their other jobs, hmm?

Of course, one data set is not conclusive, but I think that if you looked on other times and other servers you would most likely see this pattern borne out in general.

This kind of data collection would be better done by SE, though. Player searches are partly foiled by /anon.

[Vyuru]

Re: Status of the Balance of Defense-centered Jobs

Or, we've been thinking of how to change the jobs to fit the playing style, what if we changed the partying to fit the playing style?

What if we had 8 man parties instead of 6? What I would do as party leader, would be to invite another tank and healer to a standard 6 man party. The main idea here is that the two tanks and whm could alternate main tank and main healer duties, so that by the time you kill one mob, the other tank/healer team is ready to go, and the first tank/healer team rests up, and joins in the meleeing of the monster, but the important thing would be for them to be ready to take on the next mob as soon as the first mob is dead.

With an 8 man party, you would not be able to kill T/VT mobs that much faster, however you COULD kill IT mobs faster by eliminating downtime, and I think people in this thread are saying that parties that hunt IT mobs generally favor paladins. Now that paladins have auto refresh, I can see this working very well for them.

The only bad thing would be that you would be making parties with 2x healer/tanks, further reducing the amount of healers/tanks available for parties, but this might work out well anyway, because then the demand for jobs that can multitask as healers (drk/whm, drg/mage, smn, maybe even blm, what about pld/whm? With a DD setup, how effective would a pld/whm be as a combo fighter/healer?) would increase.

Think of it, what's the difference between smn and blm? Smn have auto refresh, 1mp/tick, and a very large manapool. Blm has MP conserve, which kicks in enough that I would say it's better than a refresh, a large manapool, and so many Clearmind traits that they only have to sit down for 5 seconds to get back to full mp, if people will have a smn main healer I see no reason not to have blm main healers.

Some party aspects would be changed, for instance how exp is distriputed in the party. As I understand it, right now exp is split amongst party members, but there is a exp cap, that is broken when you get EXP chains. The cap is what, 200 exp max for your first kill? So... 200 x 6 = 1200 exp, or that's what the mob would have given 1 player if they killed it by themselves and no exp cap, so 1200/8 = 150 exp. So monsters that would have given 200 exp/kill to a normal 6 man party would give 150 exp/kill to a 8 man party. I think that this would be more than fine since you could eliminate downtime with an 8 man party, making much higher than normal exp chains.

How alliances work might have to be changed around a little, but I would think that would be easy. Maybe you would have to do a quest in order to be able to make/join an 8 man party, you could tie it in with the Teamwork quests in SandO'ria. Maybe you would have to talk to a npc and trade him 10 beastman seals or something to start a 8 man party, if you wanted to restrict how many people could do this that is.


So maybe we should think of other ways to make paladins more appealing to exp parties at lvl 70+, that doesn't create some ninja "nerf" I agree that it would be a shame to see ninjas go through what dragoons and rangers went through. I just want a change to make everyone happy, and one that gets more paladins at lvl 70+ for me to party with!

Double Post Edited:

15 Dragoons

Wooo! The amount of dragoons is on the rise!

[csBahamut]

Re: Status of the Balance of Defense-centered Jobs

The point of doing a /sea all 75 was to only get endgame players, and remove those leveling the job for a sub, or level capped events. Plus, most people sit on either the job they like to play, or the job they play the most, when not doing anything in particular. Also, if you check more than just one, like at multiple times in the day, you'll still notice the same trend with the number of NINs vs. the number of PLDs. Why point does this serve? We all know that the general player base as a whole will gravitate towards the most currently known overpowered jobs. Remember how many people had RNG leveled back in the day? History repeats itself. Watch the trends.