why so many WAR/PLD/DRK abjurations?

[Omni]

Re: why so many WAR/PLD/DRK abjurations?

I stand corrected... the legs are swell.
I'm no ranged combatant, but the hands have alternatives, right? Really, all five pieces are good, but - with the exception of +movement speed - the all have non-cursed alternatives that are at least as good. Probably a lot cheaper, and none compare with Adaman Hauberk.

Crimson gloves in my mind are probably one of the best gloves around for rng, if not the best.

rng atk and rng acc. nothing more i could ask for. some might say seiryu's kote is nice but +15 agi is no where as nice as +10 rng atk.

[Sevv]

Re: why so many WAR/PLD/DRK abjurations?

DRG are supposed to wear heavy armors. NIN don't. SE has to pull it's head out from it's own ass.

Oh come on, are you being serious?

IF DRAGOONS WERE SUPPOSE TO HAVE HEAVY ARMORS SQUARE-ENIX WOULD HAVE GIVEN THEM ACCESS TO HEAVY ARMOR. SERIOUSLY!!!!!!



Nin gets access to a few heavy armor yes, and thats a hug deal how its ground breaking, no it isn't.

S-E has better things to do then what you feel should be done to a job they created.

so seriously enough of this "suppose to have" bullshit

[Sevv]

Re: why so many WAR/PLD/DRK abjurations?

Crimson gloves in my mind are probably one of the best gloves around for rng, if not the best.
rng atk and rng acc. nothing more i could ask for. some might say seiryu's kote is nice but +15 agi is no where as nice as +10 rng atk.

He was talking more for blue then all the jobs i missed that at first as well.

[Karinya]

Re: why so many WAR/PLD/DRK abjurations?

A little thing called Aggressor

+25 acc half the time isn't that much better than +10 acc all the time. Arguably it's worse because you have to gear to perform reasonably well when Aggressor is down, which may lead to an overemphasis on accuracy when it's up (unless you swap gear when it goes on and off).

It's not a big deal when you compare it to the bonuses other jobs get. It would be an entirely different story if DRG gained tier 2 bonuses in those stats, but for me, it's more of an image thing and not just the stat ups.

The big bonuses DRG gets are the two free extra attacks that give you more damage and TP, hate reducing JAs (this is HUGE for a DD) and that little guy following you around. Attack Bonus and Acc Bonus are nice extras.

DRG are supposed to wear heavy armors.

In previous games, maybe. In FFXI they wear medium armor - heavy armors are for WAR, PLD, sometimes DRK or BST. But in previous games Jump wasn't always instant (I think it was in FFT, but not in 4 and 5), delayed your next normal attack (instead of being extra damage in addition to full normal attack speed) and DRG didn't have pets. They still use spears and jump, but many other things about the job are different from previous FFs. Heck, in some games spears were one-handed weapons unless you had the special ability to use them 2-handed, and dragoons could use shields.

You might as well complain that SAM can't throw gil anymore, or that FFXI PLDs don't get Esuna like Cecil, or any number of other changes between old FF jobs and the "same" job in FFXI.

[Lmnop]

Re: why so many WAR/PLD/DRK abjurations?

As a Warrior, I think I'd trade Aggressor for Accuracy Bonus trait any day of the week.

It is kinda irritating that DRG can't wear haub but nin can. I have an awkward position and a hard one to explain, but I'll try: there's "Heavy" Damage dealers. I don't mean "Big effing numbers" as much as how you'd imagine them fighting. Warrior and Dark Knight are the embodiment of this. But I think Sam, Drg, and Pld fall into this category as well. It's nice that at least one of them wears a different body armor.

[Grizzlebeard]

Re: why so many WAR/PLD/DRK abjurations?

I seriously wouldn't try to rationalize S-E's gear itemization. For instance, what would be the reasoning for not allowing Drg and Thf to wear a Kirin's Osode?

Oh, and Sev, this isn't KI so we really don't need images like those belittling other posters.

[seq]

Re: why so many WAR/PLD/DRK abjurations?

And please stop saying that 2.5% is "too low to activate". You didn't seem to think 3.5% (the estimated crit rate on Pahluwan Body) was too small to dismiss. So why is 2.5% so easy to dismiss? The only percentage rate that is truly too low to activate is 0%.

because Pahl.'s can be increased through merits, weapons and you'll already have a natural % on crits.
i'll try to explain it in another way, log in ffxi and do /random
how often you'll get numbers less than 25 (homam's TA rate), how often you'll get numbers less than 105 (3%+ 4% merit+3.5% pahl.body) ? throw in a Gondo-Shizunori and you'll have a critical hit rate of ~15% increasing not only DoT, but WS numbers aswell.
after all this is just my opinion on homam, and we can agree to disagree :)

[ItazuraNhomango]

Re: why so many WAR/PLD/DRK abjurations?

because Pahl.'s can be increased through merits, weapons and you'll already have a natural % on crits.
i'll try to explain it in another way, log in ffxi and do /random
how often you'll get numbers less than 25 (homam's TA rate), how often you'll get numbers less than 105 (3%+ 4% merit+3.5% pahl.body) ? throw in a Gondo-Shizunori and you'll have a critical hit rate of ~15% increasing not only DoT, but WS numbers aswell.
after all this is just my opinion on homam, and we can agree to disagree :)

It's not a matter of agreeing or not agreeing. It's simply mathematically wrong to say "Double Attack + 5%" is more damaging than "Triple Attack + 2.5%".

Whether Pahluwan Khazagand is better than Homam Corazza or not doesn't change the validity of the statement.

Oh, and Sev, this isn't KI so we really don't need images like those belittling other posters.

Well said. ^_^

[Feba]

Re: why so many WAR/PLD/DRK abjurations?

Oh, and Sev, this isn't KI so we really don't need

Sev

Agreed. Waste of bandwidth.

[Lmnop]

Re: why so many WAR/PLD/DRK abjurations?

Seq, I understand your position, but it doesn't take everything into account.

Let's say you have a base 5% crit rate (we pretty much all do). That's a roll of 50 on /random. But if you have TA 2.5%, that's a roll of 25 on a second /random.

Meaning, in order to stay accurate, you now need to type /random twice. And that triple attack roll can crit, so you should probably roll a 3rd and 4th time. With all these /randoms, you're bound to get one of the low numbers every once in a while.

so in 13.66 minutes you'll have a 2.5% Chance of triple attacking VS brutal's 5% chance it's true BS..

In those 13.66 minutes, the pahl. body will give you 1-5 more crits than homam. Possibly no extras, since those 7 extra swings (statistically 2.5 X 3) are 7 extra chances to crit. And Homam user still has ~9% crit rate (base 5 + merits 4).


--------------------

Seq, I don't think Homam body is the end-all-be-all for DRG. I think it's hard to compete, but I'm not going to call you gimp for not using it. The difference is probably less than the difference of using an Amemet mantle and an Ame +1. If you want to focus on a crit build, I'm glad it's working out for you. And I guarantee you're doing more damage than the people who just use the most expensive stuff possible w/out regards to gearing towards a goal.


My original point was that these days, people aren't treating Homam body with the respect it deserves.

Also, it doesn't help my argument at all but THF 3A is 5% base rate, not 2.5%.

[Sevv]

Re: why so many WAR/PLD/DRK abjurations?

meh ethier way ppl stopped saying omg i needz heavy armor for drg it just isnt right....

[nickofearth]

Re: why so many WAR/PLD/DRK abjurations?

Hmm. Didn't think DRG's would "whoosh" much, given native Accuracy Bonus +10 and "A+" skill rating in their primary weapon. (At least, not compared to WAR's, with no build in Accuracy Bonus and merely "A" skill in their weapon of choice.)
You must be special. =b

Whoosh not wiff :P
Real warriors use a Great Axe.

Yes you cant tp in heca, but we get homam, which is great to tp in, what's wrong with homam? I don't have sea, even tho cop battles are easier now I still don't have sea And to those with sea and people before you the game is about work you have to put some in before you can just get any piece.

Yes, because if you have Sea you automatically get homam. I've yet to get a single piece.

If you think heca is really shit then you shouldn't do sky/kings because there is nothing for you spend all your time farming get Conte Peices some Homam from sea, and get out damage by drgs who macro in heca.

I never personally said hecatomb sucks, I'm eagerly awaiting next kirin fight cause the harness is mine guarenteed when it drops.

[Malacite]

Re: why so many WAR/PLD/DRK abjurations?

It just doesn't make sense mechanically or flavorfully though. And MMO or not it's still an FF game and you don't screw the basic fundamentals of the jobs. I find FFXI's Samurai more closely resembles FFT's to be honest >.>

I really just don't like the way SE's handled one of my all time favorite job classes in any RPG series. When I first heard of DRG coming to the game some 5 years ago, I thought "Awesome! I'll be able to wear all the awesome armors and leap into the sky!"

Hello reality check ; ; Jump isn't nearly as good as it used to be, but then because of how the battle system works in FFXI (TP gain and all) they very well couldn't have DRG's leaping away to safety and coming back down for double damage every other attack round. That would be mad broken in XI (not that DRG's were ever invincible in previous games either for that matter)


It's just not the DRG I've grown to love from the series is all. It's a neat take on it and I like it, but I got my beefs with it too... and I'll leave it at that. I just figured that, you know, a "Dragon Knight", the most elite of the San d'Orian forces, would be able to wear at least a half-decent suit of plate.