3 new expansions, Visions, Scars and Heroes of Abyssea

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: 3 new expansions, Visions, Scars and Heroes of Abyssea

In Abyssea, concerns such as the over-population of battle areas and the need for large time investments will be a thing of the past. The development team is hard at work creating a world where parties can engage in rewarding battles with powerful foes and collect prized equipment with the least of fuss.

I trust SE on the less people/time thing.

Powerful foes? We'll see.

Collect prized items with no fuss? Doubt it.

Collect Prized items with less drama? Its a very distinct possibility and potentially better just for that.

Having a good time takes precedence over getting stuff. So long as its fun to do with friends, I could care less about how often I'm rewarded. Its when I'm forced to grind like the game is a job on endgame that I start to care about that reward being so distant because its not about being there to make friends, but just serve the needs of a larger group.

And no, I don't care how awesome you think your endgame LS is. Some people find a group they connect with, some never do and some just get tired of having to start over and and over and over in another shell because so many others fell apart I'm that last one, btw.

Simply put, don't make me a number. That's all I want from the new endgame content, really, and it does sound like that's what I could be getting, at least with Abbysea.

[Solymir]

Re: 3 new expansions, Visions, Scars and Heroes of Abyssea

Having a good time takes precedence over getting stuff. So long as its fun to do with friends, I could care less about how often I'm rewarded. Its when I'm forced to grind like the game is a job on endgame that I start to care about that reward being so distant because its not about being there to make friends, but just serve the needs of a larger group.

And no, I don't care how awesome you think your endgame LS is. Some people find a group they connect with, some never do and some just get tired of having to start over and and over and over in another shell because so many others fell apart I'm that last one, btw.

Simply put, don't make me a number. That's all I want from the new endgame content, really, and it does sound like that's what I could be getting, at least with Abbysea.

I agree. As long as I can enjoy the mini-event with my friends and doesn't feel like a grind, that portion of the expansions will be a win. My only concern is what does SE think we know to be fun and enjoyable?

Personally I do not enjoy Nyzul. If it weren't for the requirement of completing floor 100 to make breaking nyzul ws's easier I probably never would have done it. The 30 minute time limit and completing 5 floors makes any pathos and floor requirement crucial to finishing.

If you knew as soon as you zoned in what the floor requirements were for all 5 floors there are some runs you would immediately know it was going to be impossible. Give me a party of 6 with the absolute best gear in the game, and awesome skill. I can give you multiple 5 floor scenarios they couldn't complete that I have personally seen.

Don't get me wrong, I don't want them to give us this stuff on a silver platter. I'm just saying some things are more fun than others. I have always enjoyed Sky, Limbus and Assault. Of course the latter assaults, a couple of the limbus zones and Ultima/Omega are tough. Some sort of progressive difficulty is to be expected.

Nyzul is just too random.

I'd cut and paste this into in-game pet peeves, but I think I posted it there before.

[Takelli]

Re: 3 new expansions, Visions, Scars and Heroes of Abyssea

Nyzul is just too random.

But, that is what makes it a challenge. How can some one make a guide for something that is completely random?

[Solymir]

Re: 3 new expansions, Visions, Scars and Heroes of Abyssea

But, that is what makes it a challenge. How can some one make a guide for something that is completely random?

I'm not asking for a guide.

Limbus, Sky, and Assaults found ways to be challenging without being random. Well, to be fair, a few Limbus zones are random with what chests dropped and when. Possibly kicking your party out before you can complete the run.

[Ziero]

Re: 3 new expansions, Visions, Scars and Heroes of Abyssea

How can some one make a guide for something that is completely random?

Easily Gaea's Nyzul Isle Guide - FFXIclopedia, the Final Fantasy XI wiki - Characters, items, jobs, and more

Nyzul isn't hard because it's random, it's hard because it can be an absolute bitch at times. Generally speaking, when you do Nyzul, you know what to expect and should be prepared for everything. It's just that sometimes everything is exactly what gets thrown at you.

[Malacite]

Re: 3 new expansions, Visions, Scars and Heroes of Abyssea

Random doesn't = challenge. I maintain that Nyzul is easy unless you have brain dead morons for a party.

It can get difficult at times, but really the only times I've lost were either to dumb asses, or just really, really bad luck with the floor objectives/spawns. This is just the way I look at it, but unless it's consistent with it's difficulty then I can't label something a true challenge because luck is a wild factor that can swing either way.

[Solymir]

Re: 3 new expansions, Visions, Scars and Heroes of Abyssea

Random doesn't = challenge. I maintain that Nyzul is easy unless you have brain dead morons for a party.

It can get difficult at times, but really the only times I've lost were either to dumb asses, or just really, really bad luck with the floor objectives/spawns. This is just the way I look at it, but unless it's consistent with it's difficulty then I can't label something a true challenge because luck is a wild factor that can swing either way.

When I use the word random in regards to Nyzul, this is what I mean. This you can't plan for.

[hexx]

Re: 3 new expansions, Visions, Scars and Heroes of Abyssea

When I use the word random in regards to Nyzul, this is what I mean. This you can't plan for.

Yes you can, going in with a balanced set of jobs, instead of SAMx4, RDM, BRD is key. So many runs that I have gone to ever since my static disbanded, I offer to go BLU for the sheer versatility (I can solo most mobs in Nyzul) and yet idiot hosts always want SAM. Nyzul isn't as bad as people make it seem, but team work, preparedness, and communication are CRUCIAL. If even ONE person goes unprepared, it can fuck up a run. I would make it a point to make everyone in my static bring all tools, powders, oils, RR, antidotes, echo drops, etc to compensate for any wierd pathos that might get tossed at us.

That said, i have a good feeling about these upcoming expansions :D

[Karinya]

Re: 3 new expansions, Visions, Scars and Heroes of Abyssea

No, but you can persist. You can have 4 tags at a time (5 with captain) counting one in your possession, it's ridiculously unlikely that you'll be hosed by luck 4-5 times in a row.

Anything that is the same every time, if you can win it once, you can win it every time. That's why people get bored of sky: every Kirin fight is pretty much the same as every other Kirin fight, it's only the drops that are random. It takes a lot longer to get bored (not just frustrated) of Nyzul.

And I dunno about you, but I find the times when we have somewhat-bad luck but manage to pull off the win anyway to be some of the most satisfying accomplishments. Much more so than using a well-understood strategy to take down a predictable target.

---------- Post added at 07:30 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:22 PM ----------

P.S. Hexx's post came in between my post and the one I was responding to. My Nyzul static doesn't have a BLU but sometimes I wish we did; a well-played BLU is very versatile, and would be especially valuable on the infamous no-white-magic floors. I also second what he said about preparation; it's why I almost never do Nyzul pickups. Someone, possibly several people, is usually going to suck, and there's a high chance that they will make the run fail. Even players that are good individually might not be able to coordinate effectively without experience working as a team.

I really hope Nyzul, and some other high-level areas, get a 75 cap. I would hate to see it become a joke that can be soloed or duoed by 99s. (As long as they don't get lamp floors with too many lamps :D) But I guess we'll have to see what the devs have in mind on that front, since they're sure not going to give the players any information in advance.

Anyway, the existence of Nyzul proves that a low headcount doesn't have to mean easy content that anyone can breeze through half-assed. I hope that proves true of Abyssea, too.

[Armando]

Re: 3 new expansions, Visions, Scars and Heroes of Abyssea

The fact that bad luck will inevitably bite you in the ass is part of Nyzul's balance and design. If you luck weren't a factor for Nyzul and a balanced team of sane people could reliably win every time, you can bet your ass that the grind would be longer and the rewards per win less generous. In the long run it's all the same.

The randomness also gives a purpose to the purchaseable items. If it concerns you so much, buy items that will let you muscle your way through obstacles. If you're not willing to shell out the tokens then embrace the fact that you will sometimes lose.

[Feba]

Re: 3 new expansions, Visions, Scars and Heroes of Abyssea

So long as the 99 cap keeps the 'somewhere there is a rabbit that can kick your ass' mantra alive, FFXI has retained its integrity.

[Malacite]

Re: 3 new expansions, Visions, Scars and Heroes of Abyssea

Anything that is the same every time, if you can win it once, you can win it every time. That's why people get bored of sky: every Kirin fight is pretty much the same as every other Kirin fight, it's only the drops that are random. It takes a lot longer to get bored (not just frustrated) of Nyzul.

I never said the randomness was bad; far from it, it's what makes Nyzul so interesting. I just said it doesn't make for much of a legitimate challenge when one floor can be as easy as a free clear or assrape you like the time my group had to take on 5 NM Chariots WTF 3 of which were all close together in 1 tiny room and there was no avoiding a link. Or getting a"kill all enemies" floor only to find out the last mob is a freaking Dahak.

That just generates needless frustration. I just happen to prefer either puzzles, or something that is just straight up bad ass and you just have to figure out how to deal with it (kinda like AV & PW, though not quite to that extreme >_>)


I'm kinda hoping Abyssia will take a page out of Nyzul's playbook, but tone back on some of the random factors. It's nice having varying objectives and enemies. It's not so nice getting utterly screwed outright just because the game decided to. Particularly if it's the last/only run of the night. No one wants to log out and go to bed after just getting served

[Yellow Mage]

Re: 3 new expansions, Visions, Scars and Heroes of Abyssea

So long as the 99 cap keeps the 'somewhere there is a rabbit that can kick your ass' mantra alive, FFXI has retained its integrity.

They did advertise new NMs and HNMs in the coming year, including a hilarious giant enemy crab. Maybe somewhere there will be a level-99-ass-kicker rabbit included among them. No, there will be, they have to. It's practically obligatory at this point.

The only point where chance comes in to play is whether or not they'll actually decide to call it The Omega Hare in homage.

[Malacite]

Re: 3 new expansions, Visions, Scars and Heroes of Abyssea

Best XI parody ever, though VG cats had some good ones too.

It's quite a rabbit in XI's traditional sense, but I demand SE find a way to add the Black Rabbite. That thing was 1 of the meanest freaking side bosses SE has ever conceived.

[Grizzlebeard]

Re: 3 new expansions, Visions, Scars and Heroes of Abyssea

Nyzul isn't hard because it's random, it's hard because it can be an absolute bitch at times.

This statement makes no sense.

There's no single monster in there that can't be beaten but the random combination of a few individually challenging mobs ends up making an unbeatable encounter.