Best party setup for Nyzul, and why?

[Mezlo]

My static has just started doing Nyzul runs now that we are almost at Captain in Assault, and we've been kicking around what would be the optimal party setup for Nyzul runs. We've been on a few, but are currently at floor 5. We basically have most job combos you can come up with, MOST of them... The first runs we were going as:

SAM/NIN, SAM/NIN, WAR/NIN, TH4, WHM/BLM, RDM/BLM

This has worked well for us, but i was thinking about the setup:

WAR/NIN, BLM/WHM, BLM/WHM, BLM/WHM, TH4 (could also go BLM/WHM if we wanted to bypass TH4), RDM/BLM

I was thinking having 3 blm's and a rdm, we could sleep any mobs that get in our way, and if it by chance is an unsleepable mob, we could just nuke the ish out of it. On objectives of KILL ALL, we could have the war/nin run into a room, grab aggro, and then ES sleepga ii them in the middle, then a few waves of thundaga III and sleepga ii's to finish them off. Being new to Nyzul, i'm not sure if it could work, but...

So this post is 2 fold, LOL, could my 3 or 4 lbm pt work, and what would be your optimal Nyzul setup and explain.

[Armando]

Re: Best party setup for Nyzul, and why?

Best party in my opinion would go something along the lines of...

<tank> SAM THF BLU (2 of the following: RDM, SCH, WHM)

I don't know how NIN fares in Nyzul; probably fine though. I'm the tank for my group, PLD/NIN. The /NIN is definitely better than /WAR for Nyzul, and I prefer it to /RDM because a lot of NMs and especially the HNMs can really hit you or nuke you hard; Utsusemi has a really big edge over Phalanx in those cases. The tank has to be able to put out damage though, Nyzul isn't for turtles. Gotta mow down those DCs ASAP.

SAM has power, skillchain versatility and its 2-hour is pure gold for the 20th floor HNMs or any time a Revitalizer pops up.

THF is great for pulling, hate manipulation, Acid/Sleep bolts, kiting, holding a mob, fleeing to the rune, Hiding adds, etc. Just a good thing to have overall.

BLU has stun (important for things like Soulflayer/Flan/Poroggo NMs), light-based Dispel (only reliable way to remove Soulflayers' Ice Spikes - and believe me, that helps a LOT), Light-based sleep (for Soulflayers, Undead, etc), non-White Magic heals (for when you get White Magic restriction), and spike damage, and if really necessary, crowd control (3 separate sleep spells, as well as Bind and Gravity spells.) As far as I know BRD is the only other job that can provide a light-based Dispel.

The backline is pretty flexible, each has its pros and cons. RDM obviously has a lot of MP endurace at its disposal, and can nuke quite competently with /SCH without giving up status cures entirely. Phalanx II helps plenty in Nyzul if the RDM has it, but if not, tier II enfeebles are also very good to have against the tougher mobs. WHM/SCH does very well in the MP department as well, Benediction can be a real life saver and Stona can help a lot against certain mobs. Regen III, Cure V and Flash are also godsends, especially against the hard stuff. SCH is SCH, it can nuke or heal, toss out status cures, and give AoE Stoneskin/Phalanx or AoE crowd control spells.

Obviously a lot of other party configurations can work as well, but I think that one is most fit to deal with anything Nyzul can throw at you.

[Callisto]

Re: Best party setup for Nyzul, and why?

Nyzul is very flexible, though over time I've come to feel that the most important to have sufficient DD. Pretty much anything can tank Nyzul, including the bosses, the important part is getting them down quickly.

We used SAMx3 BLU/NIN RDM/DRK WHM/SCH for climbing floors, now that we're down to just farming bosses one of those SAMs goes THF. Having some alternate form of curing such as DNC JAs or Blue Magic goes a long way towards surviving the random "No White Magic" pathos which like to pop up on bosses now and again.

A proper 'tank' isn't really neccesary, usually on bosses hate can be held just fine using damage, staggering use of Fanatic's Drinks keeps the DDs from getting pounded, and there's nothing that a PLD could tank that a WAR/NIN can't in there.

I would recommend your SAMs go /WAR and not /NIN, the only thing you're going to come across where shadows would make any difference as a SAM is Tourbillion from Khimaira, and even then Fanatic's Drinks will negate the damage of the mob TP moves.

The BLM setup is a bad idea, especially once you hit 60-100, Elemental Magic is nearly useless on the bosses compared to strong SAM WS'. Nyzul is a very TP-burn friendly event.

[Clever Ninja]

Re: Best party setup for Nyzul, and why?

Although it can obviously done without it, BLU can be a large asset as mentioned. I've been Nyzul shouts whenever I have my tags and just the wide range of our abilities is enough to warrant a spot. Nothing like hitting an undead floor and pretty much 2 shotting everything with Hysteric Barrage -> Frenetic Rip, among all the other things already mentioned.

DRG imo should be subbing BLU on higher floors. If White Magic is locked, they can pretty much heal an entire party this way.

THF cause Nyzul drop rates can kiss my ass.

After that it's just 1-2 backline jobs and some DD. I actually did a Nyzul with PLD/NIN who did amazingly well. It might be because he wasn't like some stupid PLD's I've seen and fulltimed Koenig, and was in some respectable DD gear and could hold hate fairly well(DRK stole it during Fafnir, but meh). It was just a boot run though so no major risk of White Magic lock.

But yea, great thing about Nyzul is it could be done with various setups. I've had unorthodox setups do better than the preferred ones just because those players were good at their jobs, and didn't just level it cause it's the flavor of the year.

[Mog]

Re: Best party setup for Nyzul, and why?

4 sam/nins, whm/sch, rdm/whm. Works wonders.

and lolTH

[Omni]

Re: Best party setup for Nyzul, and why?

Sams and blus are great for nyzul. Especially if you happen to get Cerberus on the boss floors. Magma hoplon is a biatch and having sams and blus to eat through that stoneskin asap is important.

I personally like going with a balanced group just cuz it gives you something of everything.

rdm/whm, brd, sam, (sam or blm), mnk and blu would be setup if I could pick and choose.

However, on the non-boss floors, I supposed just about anything works as long as everyone knows what they're doing. Non-boss floors shouldnt be much issue with party setup as long as ppl:

1) know how monster aggro works and how certain monsters aggro.
2) have oils/powders or monomo/tonko
3) know how to communicate actions and follow instructions for lamps.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Best party setup for Nyzul, and why?

Never liked BRDs for this event, feels like they take up a valuable slot. BRDs are not known to be strong in timed events and a COR with Merits could easily replace them and give the PT three times the buff duration, letting CORs man the floor transitions which saves quite a bit of time.

2) have oils/powders or monomo/tonko

Actually, have all four. Never know what pathos you'll get hit with. I've gotten Ninjutsu pathos before.

[KoukiRyu]

Re: Best party setup for Nyzul, and why?

Usually do this with an Aegis/Excal PLD so I guess I think of him as irreplacable. But the main set-up is usually;

PLD/NIN RNG/NIN MNK/NIN BLM/RDM RDM/BLM (anything really, after that)

We've done it with 5 and cleared bosses before, so that spot is kinda just for who needs gear.

Nyzul is lots of fun, and not too rough, although we have gotten white magic pathos on bosses quite a few times, and that usually screws us, maybe a BLU or DNC would be a good fit for that spot permanently.

[Omni]

Re: Best party setup for Nyzul, and why?

Ive found when I go on as my cor, ppl are always all over the place that I cant ever seem to hit everyone with 2 rolls and keep a cycle going as I would normally.

That's why I prefer brds. Recasting songs isnt a big deal compared to missing a roll/re-rolling and having dual march makes me happy since I tend to tank a lot on my mnk.

[TheGrandMom]

Re: Best party setup for Nyzul, and why?

Unconventional setups can work, it just depends on the skill of the players. I've done Nyzul with the 3 sam, whm, blm, brd setup and we rocked it all the time. Some say brd is useless but not if you have a skilled player that knows what to do. I don't think tanks are useless because some can make decent dd's if equiped right, but a traditional tank is really not needed and you would be better off with a dd in it's place. Personally, I would try your unconventional setup just to see if it works or not. Maybe just for a farming run but it would add a bit of fun into it and isn't fun part of playing the game?

[Feenicks]

Re: Best party setup for Nyzul, and why?

Any standard XP party can do well in Nyzul, but forget about manaburning because it's just totally impractical in some cases. Sleep II is a good tool to have but you want to avoid unnecessary aggro, not just sleep it because on some floors, particularly lamp floors, too much aggro means valuable seconds are spent on sleeping things before you can continue with the task at hand. Also, as has been mentioned, the bosses on floor 60, 80 and 100 are laughably resistant to magic. I've been to a Nyzul Cerb a few times on BLM and ES+Flood II only did about 400-500 damage. Any nuke without ES will be resisted.

I would recommend WHM+RDM as a base for your support because you'll want the sleeping capabilities of WHM and RDM, and WHM will handle most of your curing and also scouting for targets/lamps/returning to the Rune of Transfer. After that, anything which can vaguely function as a tank is fine for that slot, so either PLD, NIN or WAR/NIN is good. After that, 3 DDs of your choice.

[Malacite]

Re: Best party setup for Nyzul, and why?

SAM/NIN make me cry...


Don't gimp yourself just because you can't manage hate.


Personally I like a set up of PLD SAM WAR COR BLM RDM (can switch RDM for WHM or SCH as well)

I find that Samurai and Fighter's rolls go above and beyond what a BRD can give with minuet/march, plus COR's a decent fighter too. BRD plays too heavily into a support role where it isn't really needed.

SCH can substitute for a BLM easily enough but there's just no replacing AM II when you run into pudding or slime mobs. Does THF affect drops in nyzul? THF is definitely a good job to have around but I find that COR WAR and SAM together will wipe the floor with most mobs.

[Firewind]

Re: Best party setup for Nyzul, and why?

The absolute strongest party would probably be:

BLU/NINx2, SAM/NINx2, SCH/BLM and then someone to go fetch mobs like a THF or additional BLU or SAM

BLU and SAM because they're pretty much ZOMG HAX as far as Nyzul goes. SCH for Accession -na spells because constant AoE status spams from many of the mobs in Nyzul (Soulflayers, Ghosts, Chariots, Gears and those gate things are the most painful) are a pain in the arse for WHM and RDM and they slow down runs considerably. Having a dedicated puller is a no brainer especially if you need only kill a single mob.

For subs I noted NIN because despite being a WHM who dies a little inside whenever they see a DD gimping themselves with /NIN when it's not needed, the fact that the only time you're standing still is when you're fighting makes up for it considerably. That and being on a floor with a White Magic pathos and no way to mitigate damage sucks. The sneak and invis ninjustsu are always useful when ther floor is full of magic aggro mobs too.

I noted BLM for SCH because changes are all your accession charges will be going to curing status effects and maybe throwing up the odd AoE Stoneskin so having access to Sleepga, Elemental Seal and Tractor for if it hits the fan is always very, very nice. You shouldn't need to tractor or raise in Nyzul since veryone should be bringing RR but I find that 90% of all DDs in the game never carry reraise items with them because they're too used to being coddled by WHMs and RDMs (and probably SCHs by now too) so I never expect a DD to even be bringing sneak and invis items now nevermind their own reraise.

But honestly I've heard of a lot of setups working just fine. Best way forwards is probably to just find a group that works really well together in Nyzul. You can have the perfect group for any event but it's going to be worth nothing if tey don't actually works together as a party.

[Mog]

Re: Best party setup for Nyzul, and why?

SAM/NIN make me cry...
Personally I like a set up of PLD SAM WAR COR BLM RDM (can switch RDM for WHM or SCH as well)

Paradins make me cry.

You really don't need paladins or ninjas for Nyzul Isle. IMO, they're only gimping the damage and aren't contributing as much as a decently geared DD would (unless you have one of Ryu's paladins...). With the right DD and subjobs, you can easily fight anything in Nyzul Isle. I sub ninja all the time and the only real difference is that I double attack less. It's really not hard tanking and doing a decent amount of damage at the same time.

Unless you're not used to TP burns and want an actual tank, then go for it.

--------

On a side note, another thing my group does is usually splits into two groups for specified enemies and all enemies. It works out really nice having a mage pair up with two samurais. Also for that reason, tank isn't needed (for the way we do it at least). Mobs die really really fast. x.x

[Mezlo]

Re: Best party setup for Nyzul, and why?

and lolTH

TH affects nyzul drops, right??? Or are you justing lol'ing because the drops still suck even with TH4?