So I resubbed...

[Shiro_Hayate]

Re: So I resubbed...

While the population on many servers has decreased, I don't think that's the biggest factor here. It's more that the way in which people handle low-level xp has changed dramatically in the past couple years.

Firstly, there has been a huge pro-soloing push. More and more people have decided that almost all xp party options pre-50 suck so badly that you should be taking every possible opportunity to get xp in other ways. And there are a LOT more opportunities to get xp outside of parties than there used to be. Soloing has arguably gotten easier, and the potentials that were already there have become much better understood by the community. Campaign ops are a significant supplement to the non-combat xp options already afforded from things like the lost chocobo quest (can be done weekly, once you learn the routes you can reliably get a Dragon Chronicles (500-1000 xp, level 4+) in 20 minutes or a Miratete's Memoirs (500-1500 xp, level 20+) in 28 minutes). Chariot and Empress Band (but arguably not Emperor band, unless you're getting BST-pet-burn xp, due to the time it takes to use up the bonus) are of more arguable benefit in xp/hr terms to soloers or small parties, who are likely to enjoy the benefits of the xp bonus over the course of the entire xp session, than full parties, who are likely to exhaust the bonus early in the session.

Secondly, there's been a significant build-your-own-party ethic pushed over this time. This can be seen reflected in the fact that there are almost never the right balance of seekers to build a single party; any time there is, they tend to get scooped up immediately. It's also reflected by the significant upswing in unsolicited party invites across a much wider variety of jobs. And it's reflected by the number of parties that start forming, get all the non-vital roles filled, and then stagnate and break up over frustration with not being able to find a NIN, PLD, RDM, WHM, etc. to fill in the last 1-2 party slots.

Thirdly, there has been a massive distortion in the xp/hr expectations at high levels since the release of ToAU. ToAU camps have transformed the way in which parties function at high levels, and this has caused some amount of conceptual breakdown in the formation of parties at a low levels. This adds to the whole "all low-level xp sucks" mindset, and has helped to add to the extreme ubiquity of PLs, as well as fostering a desire to avoid mainstream xp parties, which helps to make such parties both more scarce and of less overall quality.

THANK YOU! This makes perfect sense. I'm not sure if I'll enjoy this (because partying was enjoyable....except for the few idiots I went with now and then). I understand why no one wants to party pre 50. I remember leveling my DRK, hearing of uber damage a few years back, and wondering why I was hitting for 20 damage until level 39+. Even then, I was only doing 50-100.

I suppose I need to do a lot of reading and get some money.

So I suppose the most needed jobs now are tanks and healers right? I'm not going back to my Red Mage, refreshing people is damn boring. The only thing good about RDM was soloing HNMs. Are they still the best soloers?

[EDIT] Oh, and for the record, I've played this game since JPN release, quit for a bit (because it was hard to understand things), came back during NA beta, stayed until high school ended (2 years?) Then had to start something called a life, which sucks because bills start ripping you a new hole, and now I'm back.

[Lunaryn]

Re: So I resubbed...

Most needed changes by the moment in the new situation. Even DDs have been the scarcity on occasion. In general, though, support tends to be the rarest, with healers and tank vying for second scarcest. Nukers are also pretty rare, but less so with SCH available. (BLMs are discouraged in particular from partying unless they're satisfied to fill a healer role as BLM/WHM)

[Shiro_Hayate]

Re: So I resubbed...

Most needed changes by the moment in the new situation. Even DDs have been the scarcity on occasion. In general, though, support tends to be the rarest, with healers and tank vying for second scarcest. Nukers are also pretty rare, but less so with SCH available. (BLMs are discouraged in particular from partying unless they're satisfied to fill a healer role as BLM/WHM)

What? I remember BLMs being all the rage before. I remember manaburning parties. Are BLMs just solo now?

EDIT: And I just heard from a friend about the DNC rage. Are they the new RNG/NINs or something?

[TheGrandMom]

Re: So I resubbed...

Well I have been trying to level another blm over the past couple of months. Party invites pre 50 weren't too bad but after that it started slowing down significantly. Mostly manaburns, the occasional party, and a lot of solo time since.

[Ellipses]

Re: So I resubbed...

What? I remember BLMs being all the rage before. I remember manaburning parties. Are BLMs just solo now?

EDIT: And I just heard from a friend about the DNC rage. Are they the new RNG/NINs or something?

You can find this in about a billion other threads, but:

At high levels, traditional parties are no longer the norm. People form meleeburn parties for the ToAU areas, because the mobs there are wussy enough to allow it to work. There are no skillchains and no real tanks, just a support job or two and a bunch of melees who let hate bounce and spam WSes whenever. BLMs just don't work out well with this kind of party.

And since that's how it happens at high levels, the attitude trickles down to lower levels, too. Traditional parties are still the norm up through the 50s, because they still work the best there. But there isn't the level of strategy there used to be. Skillchains are a rarity, which means no magic burst, so parties don't get as excited about BLMs.

DNC is popular, but it's not the new RNG/NIN. It's new, it's a healer that gets to hit stuff, and it's handy as hell as a melee solo subjob (healing comes from TP instead of MP). It's a shiny new toy that's easy to do a decent job with.

[fallenintoshadows]

Re: So I resubbed...

And since that's how it happens at high levels, the attitude trickles down to lower levels, too. Traditional parties are still the norm up through the 50s, because they still work the best there. But there isn't the level of strategy there used to be. Skillchains are a rarity, which means no magic burst, so parties don't get as excited about BLMs.

I completely agree, if you go into a lowbie party now and ask the leader what skill chain you're doing they either laugh/ tell you it's not necessary / occasionally ask what that is.

[Ziero]

Re: So I resubbed...

I completely agree, if you go into a lowbie party now and ask the leader what skill chain you're doing they either laugh/ tell you it's not necessary / occasionally ask what that is.

I've been playing this game for near five years now and have leveled multiple jobs through 30-50. That practice of not having a SC is NOT something new and was NOT caused by endgame players. People have always been downright moronic, especially at lower levels.

And again, I would also like to add that killing T-VT mobs in quick succession works just as well(not chain 200 well, but chain 4-5 with no downtime well) at lvl 16 as it does at level 75. And it always has.

[Shiro_Hayate]

Re: So I resubbed...

Ok wait....do Japanese parties still use skillchains? No offense to NA players, but I have a feeling that this only occurs in NA parties.

[Ellipses]

Re: So I resubbed...

The whole JP > NA thing is pretty passé by now.

Obviously, this is just anecdotal, but my personal experience since restarting last year is that it's hit or miss, and mostly miss, no matter who you party with. I've seen exactly two parties where there was a skillchain; one of them, I found and suggested the SC, the other, the melees did so themselves. I've had several more parties where I've found one, suggested it, and not had it happen (others not interested, not able to get it right, etc.).

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: So I resubbed...

Ok wait....do Japanese parties still use skillchains? No offense to NA players, but I have a feeling that this only occurs in NA parties.

It has nothing to do with being JP or NA -.-; But if you want to live by that primitive sort of thinking, go right ahead.

There aren't skillchains in high level PTs because many of the favored EXP targets at high level are very resistant to magic or mimic the spells you cast on them, therefore, there's little to no point in doing skillchains.

Doing a Detonation Skill chain and casting Aero on Puks actually heals Puks
Imps, Lamia and Colibri have constant partial magic resistance.
Colibri will actually mimic any White/Black Magic, Songs or Ninjutsu you cast on them.

[emeraldpearl]

Re: So I resubbed...

basically (only reading first page... if that) solo with flag up, until pt invite is recieved.... the community has remained the same also.

[Lunaryn]

Re: So I resubbed...

I've been in JP parties much more rarely these days, but the ones I've been in have also tended to ignore {In what order shall we do our weapon skills?} queries and made no attempt to form or cooperate with an SC.