The New Relics

[Aksannyi]

Re: The New Relics

Well I am happy that these are not buyable,which means that I'll eventually be able to get one. We weren't going to work on a disc for me in Nyzul, but I guess now we'll have to.

[Zempten]

Re: The New Relics

What the hell are Alexanderites?

[EDIT]
Nevermind, seems to be the "currency" for Salvage

[Prons]

Re: The New Relics

Time for part 4:

The Qiqirn quest is part of this series to obtain the relic. The requirements to complete it are...50k Alexanderites (uncommon drop it seems from Archaic machinery), Balrahn's Eyepatch (100k Ampholes from the Einherjar lady), W. Areuhat (its a book, ??? how to obtain) and recomplete all 50 assaults with the appropriate log/journal/ledger/diary/chronicle with you.

Fun times


EDIT this one

Duties, Tasks, and Deeds
Client: Paparoon (Nashmau)
Summary:
Honorary officer Paparoon has been brought on to see that you carrying out your imperial orders.
Alexandrite, Wyrmseeker Areuhat, assault memoires, holy relics... A multitude of paths lay open before you.


Someone checked the dats, yes all have to be completed.

That's a lot of effort, are these gonna be better than the other relic things that needed two years to get?

[Taskmage]

Re: The New Relics

The Qiqirn quest is part of this series to obtain the relic. The requirements to complete it are...50k Alexanderites (uncommon drop it seems from Archaic machinery), Balrahn's Eyepatch (100k Ampholes from the Einherjar lady), W. Areuhat (its a book, ??? how to obtain) and recomplete all 50 assaults with the appropriate log/journal/ledger/diary/chronicle with you.

lol holy hell. I have to get captain again? Gimmie a break.

[Jonastb]

Re: The New Relics

I am looking and there doesn't appear to be any part that you can do solo. The good part is that, with the exception of Nyzul, multiple people will get credit at the same time, as long as they are on the same part, ie recompleting assaults.

The bad news is, getting the actual weapon is the hardest part, it appears. And you are most likely going to have to static almost the entire thing. This is not necessarily an easy thing for some people. I know myself, I haven't been able to get into any kind of ToAU static at all. And I have tried many times.

[Sabaron]

Re: The New Relics

Anyone come up with a minimum time estimate yet?

As for the Nyzul Isle thing:

If you are taking 1 person through and have a 100% complete rate (read: Mad Skillz), you can complete 100 floors in 20 days.

A more interesting way:

Since lots of people want access to the weapons, you can do 6 discs at once using 6 tags per week. Then you'll end up with 6 96 discs.

Each person desiring a weapon must have a "mirror" person on the team. If you are looking for SAM weapon, another person on the team must also have SAM.

You get your weapon on your alternate's disc since it appears that the most probable drop is the one for the disc holder even on the first round through.

This way all 6 members get:

(a): Whatever armor they want.
(b): Whatever weapon they want.
(c): Runic Key

This takes ~20 weeks at "Mad Skillz" rate provided you skip the armor and don't repeat any floors and everyone in the static gets win.

Remember, that lots of things in this game already take that long. My new Nashira Serawheels took me 14 weeks to get. Everything has an associated time-cost. 20 weeks is pretty good for 6 Nyzul Weapons.

The biggest problem with the setup is the redundant jobs. Without redundant jobs, weapon drop rates will be sub-optimal.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: The New Relics

lol holy hell. I have to get captain again? Gimmie a break.

Yeah, that was actually my initial point of concern, it was either the Nyzul disc getting wiped or repeating Assaults to Captain that was the major concern. It takes a while to even orgainize and get that far in assault and to have to do it again is a bit extreme. I've seen one guy shouting for weeks just to get the one Assault he needs to get to captain - and this is on Odin.

Yeah, its free relic (or seems that way), but it seems SE wants you to invest as much time - if not more - into getting the new relics as they did the original ones.

You can only do so many Assaults per day, three to four tops, one badge recharging every 24 hours.

So, you'd need nine weeks (assuming you could even get an original win on each one every time, which is unlikely) to get to Captain with an experienced group (again, unlikely unless you have a static full of captains.).

But let's just assume that's the case, that's about four and a half months.

Given the rules apply the same way to Nyzul, you could possibly scale 30 floors a week, so let's assume you get really lucky and get to the top within four weeks, that's another month.

So we're almost at half a year so far. Hope you have a lot of Assault points stored up, because you'll have to do salvage, too. Four Chariots, no too much of a problem in the long run.

Beastmen Kings? Could be a problem, but at least now there's a lucrative reason givin to invade these fortresses.

Alexandrites... hnh... dunno how commonly those will drop, but that they drop from archaic mobs isn't fun. You'll need a lot. Doing Einherjar might actually be a lot more bearable, but how long to get 100k ampoules? That's a lot of Einherjar.

The Areuhat thing is a big, fat "huh?" We know of her in WotG as a freelance NPC, there's possibly a connection there, but that's just speculation since we know she's there, it could still be a ToA thing exclusively.

Could it be done in a year? Possibly. You'd have to have no life and devote a lot of your attention to ToA endgame, diverting it away from RoZ/CoP endgame. Two to three years seems a bit more reasonable. I guess the question really is - how much longer do you plan to play FFXI?

[Sabaron]

Re: The New Relics

To tack on what I said before about Nyzul:

With the setup I recommended above, it would be a trivial jump to get MORE than 6 Nyzul Weapons.

If members of the static wanted weapons for multiple jobs, depending on the amount of redundancy, the group can get extras.

The setup can produce weapons for other people as well, but it can't get them Runic Keys.

Most standard groups can't be a "Me, Me, Me" all the way to the top thing because the other 5 people will want to linger on each 20-floor to get their armor.

The 6-man Weapon Group is probably going to be excellent, because everything else runs in parallel after it.

[ItachiKujata]

Re: The New Relics

I don't get it, when these relics were first announced people were saying it should be some epic quest to do with no ties to money... and guess what, it is... it's definitely an epic quest. Not a solo quest by any means but a lot of it can be done with just a group of people and the rest like einherjar/salvage is not that bad.

You can't expect a relic to be handed to you so easily... at least this quest has some variety instead of grinding through Dyna zone for 3 years...

"You'd have to have no life and devote a lot of your attention to ToA endgame, diverting it away from RoZ/CoP endgame. Two to three years seems a bit more reasonable. I guess the question really is - how much longer do you plan to play FFXI?"

This is a little exaggerated don't you think... since you don't have to devote all your time to do the requirements... lets see... twice a week Nyzul to get your disc up, 3 or 4 runs per night. That's not even going to take up your whole night.

You'll be spending the first few months doing that to get your runic key and weapon. Once you get that, I'd work on captain rank/redoing all the assaults. That again can be done twice a week with a static. You don't have to quit everything else you're doing... unless of course you only play twice a week...

After that it's toau beastman, kings, einherjar, salvage. Beastman kings you can ask people to help you with. You will probably need to join a group that does Einherjar/Salvage though and that can kill Odin and salvage bosses. Should only be a matter of time gathering up alexandrites and ampoules. I would say a year is probably realistic to an average player.

All you really need to do this is a group of friends to help you through nyzul/assaults and a LS or group that does einherjar/salvage... I myself am thinking about this and I'm definitely not someone with "no life" and going to devote all my time to this...

[Aksannyi]

Re: The New Relics

I don't get it, when these relics were first announced people were saying it should be some epic quest to do with no ties to money... and guess what, it is... it's definitely an epic quest. Not a solo quest by any means but a lot of it can be done with just a group of people and the rest like einherjar/salvage is not that bad.

I'm not arguing, this is exactly what I wanted! Thank you SE!

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: The New Relics

This is a little exaggerated don't you think... since you don't have to devote all your time to do the requirements... lets see... twice a week Nyzul to get your disc up, 3 or 4 runs per night. That's not even going to take up your whole night.

You'll be spending the first few months doing that to get your runic key and weapon. Once you get that, I'd work on captain rank/redoing all the assaults. That again can be done twice a week with a static. You don't have to quit everything else you're doing... unless of course you only play twice a week...

After that it's toau beastman, kings, einherjar, salvage. Beastman kings you can ask people to help you with. You will probably need to join a group that does Einherjar/Salvage though and that can kill Odin and salvage bosses. Should only be a matter of time gathering up alexandrites and ampoules. I would say a year is probably realistic to an average player.

All you really need to do this is a group of friends to help you through nyzul/assaults and a LS or group that does einherjar/salvage... I myself am thinking about this and I'm definitely not someone with "no life" and going to devote all my time to this...

You just think you have a life and a concept of "average."

I'm glad this is mostly free of a currency grind, but anyone that thinks RMT won't find a way in to ruin this is a fool that forgets how resiliant they actually are.

You're also looking at the actual time it takes to do these things, not consider the time in between, actual drop rates or even the things that get in the way of the online time.

A Nyzul static isn't going to be about relic for everyone. Not even getting all the access to the floors would be about relic weapons for everyone. Its about the armor, too.

Think about it, there are 20 weapons, probably only one of which will drop from the 100th floor boss, if it drops at all. We're just assuming the full disc is done in the estimates, not accounting for the actual drop rates. So you could have a lot of runs where you never see a weapon drop and plenty where the weapon you want doesn't drop at all. This changes the Nyzul time estimate to a wild variable.

Any static you make - even the most organized one possible - is going to hit bumps in the road. Someone still in Dynamis, can't go tomorrow, late home from work, etc, etc. Or an asshole ditched you (common) and now you have to catch the replacement up or find someone with the same progress (good luck).

Also, Salvage is dependant on Assault points. If you do Nyzul first and get that out of the way, not too big of a problem. Depends on your status with points, though. Trying to build an Assault Static is like pulling teeth. Healthy teeth. Nyzul not so much.

I really take issue with the fact that only one person can be the discholder for Nyzul. This is just problematic in more ways than the relic aspect. That person quits, you start from square one. If you want something more reliable, you have more discholders, but that's going to add a lot of time to doing Nyzul. This means less time for assault and a possible roadblock to doing Salvage. So Nyzul would really have to be your starting point.

Einherjar is its own thing, no crossover, so no problem. Beastmen kings have no crossover, but we don't know how people will take to going after them yet or if there will be problems there. The rest of the quest remains a mystery, I don't expect the book on Areuhat to be easy.

It is an epic quest, but its still asking a lot more than what the realistic average player is capable of doing. Again, its Nyzul and Assault requirements that are the real sticking points. I think the way Nyzul discs are leader-only is just plain unfair to all involved in helping scale the floors, the Assault think isn't hard to get around, but that's taking away a hard-earned accomplishment and asking for them to earn it again. That's a slap to the face, really.

[Andrinor]

Re: The New Relics

Well, thinking about it you sort of ~have~ to make people repeat the assault requirements. Otherwise, you'd be sitting there with a whole series of quests done in advance for each relic you wanted to obtain. That's obviously not what they want either, so they made it so to get a weapon you have to do all these assaults again specifically targeted towards said relic.

They either had to do that, not include captain as a requirement at all, or make it so you could only obtain one weapon and nobody would want that either.

Only one discholder for Nyzul is a real problem however, especially since you may have to climb multiple times just to GET the weapon you want. I have a 6 person Nyzul group and all 6 of them want these relics. It's going to take months JUST to do that one portion....

[Taskmage]

Re: The New Relics

I figure for the Nyzul portion each person is going to have to take a disc to 100 three times. Once to get the key, another to get the guaranteed weapon drop, and another to get a new key.

Something I wonder though: For people who have not already achieved captain rank, would it be possible for them to obtain that record book and simply take it through all 50 assaults on their first time through for essentially double credit?

[Ziero]

Re: The New Relics

Still those with no life get the advantage, if you do have a life, its going to be a long, slow climb.

Why shouldn't people who play more be rewarded by getting the best weapons in game?

I wonder when they're gonna make relic actually attainable...

Never, see, that's the point of it being a Relic. They're near impossible to get.

Time for part 4:

The Qiqirn quest is part of this series to obtain the relic. The requirements to complete it are...50k Alexanderites (uncommon drop it seems from Archaic machinery), Balrahn's Eyepatch (100k Ampholes from the Einherjar lady), W. Areuhat (its a book, ??? how to obtain) and recomplete all 50 assaults with the appropriate log/journal/ledger/diary/chronicle with you.

Fun times

EDIT this one

Duties, Tasks, and Deeds
Client: Paparoon (Nashmau)
Summary:
Honorary officer Paparoon has been brought on to see that you carrying out your imperial orders.
Alexandrite, Wyrmseeker Areuhat, assault memoires, holy relics... A multitude of paths lay open before you.

Someone checked the dats, yes all have to be completed.

As far as I've known, there was no Areuhat in ToAU before....but maybe she'll be involved in the new NM pop system somehow?

Yeah, that was actually my initial point of concern, it was either the Nyzul disc getting wiped or repeating Assaults to Captain that was the major concern. It takes a while to even orgainize and get that far in assault and to have to do it again is a bit extreme. I've seen one guy shouting for weeks just to get the one Assault he needs to get to captain - and this is on Odin.

Yeah, its free relic (or seems that way), but it seems SE wants you to invest as much time - if not more - into getting the new relics as they did the original ones.

You can only do so many Assaults per day, three to four tops, one badge recharging every 24 hours.

So, you'd need nine weeks (assuming you could even get an original win on each one every time, which is unlikely) to get to Captain with an experienced group (again, unlikely unless you have a static full of captains.).

But let's just assume that's the case, that's about four and a half months.

Given the rules apply the same way to Nyzul, you could possibly scale 30 floors a week, so let's assume you get really lucky and get to the top within four weeks, that's another month.

So we're almost at half a year so far. Hope you have a lot of Assault points stored up, because you'll have to do salvage, too. Four Chariots, no too much of a problem in the long run.

Could it be done in a year? Possibly. You'd have to have no life and devote a lot of your attention to ToA endgame, diverting it away from RoZ/CoP endgame. Two to three years seems a bit more reasonable. I guess the question really is - how much longer do you plan to play FFXI?

If you can set up a Static, then assaults are not hard. At all. They're not even time consuming. So to your "one guy" shouting for weeks, I give you at least a dozen people who do Assaults semi regularly, for nothing more then the sake of doing them. Though you certainly won't get captain overnight, it's not some impossible task that you can never accomplish. And now you'll have a lot more people striving to finish off those last missions.

And just obtaining Captains rank will have you rolling in AP. Hell, you get enough points from winning one FL ranked assault to gain access to Salvage, leaving you with 2-4 more tags for the day. Hell, Assaults are currently my best source of income because after at most four repeat wins with a full pt from any Staging Point, I'll have enough AP to buy an item and throw it up for sale. That's a minimum of 3000 AP, you only need 1500 to get into Salvage and that's only two repeat, no band, full party wins.

So really, SE did what people wanted. They added Relics that anyone could slowly work towards through an extremely "epic" quest that rewards you along the way with many, many, many other things without having to resort to collecting saleable items as the main bulk of the quest....and you're still complaining?

[Andrinor]

Re: The New Relics

Something I wonder though: For people who have not already achieved captain rank, would it be possible for them to obtain that record book and simply take it through all 50 assaults on their first time through for essentially double credit?

My understanding is you have to be captain to even initiate the quest, so I don't think so.