PLs

[Mfume]

Re: PLs

And who the hell decides what FFXI jobs are 'meant' to be?

SE? Thats why they are jobs?? O_O

[Prons]

Re: PLs

I've had it done on Valkurm Dunes and Qufim Parties. In retrospect I don't know if it made that huge of a difference. I can easily see why people would want them (especially people who've gone through VD more than 3 times), but I don't know how much it helps new players learn about their jobs.

And who the hell decides what FFXI jobs are 'meant' to be?

That's what I say when I try to do WHM Tanking.

[Nymphadora]

Re: PLs

I don't think it has made that big a difference. I've made use of PL's when they were available, but I haven't gone out of my way to be PL'd. I pay attention to other players, take their suggestions into consideration, and try to play my job the way it was meant to be played, to the best of my ability. I don't depend on PLs. But I guess there are always going to be people in the game who use it as a crutch.

Edit: Aaaaaaaaaaaannnnndd... I know how to make a macro, lol. :D

[Nuriko]

Re: PLs

That's what I say when I try to do WHM Tanking.

Don't give up on it just yet ... I ended up tanking one of a pair of mission pops as WHM today! Of course, that was just so the DDs were free to kill the OTHER pop while the other WHM kept them up...

[Greyfist]

Re: PLs

Actual powerleveling is non-existent in FFXI thanks to the monster claim system. What people call powerleveling here is basically nothing more than having a high-level guardian angel hanging around to keep a party safe from wandering monsters that might link and slaughter the lowbies. The higher-level person casting heals on party members speeds things up a little over the party's own healers doing the healing, but not by much. Safety is what the PLer is actually providing, and I'm not at all too proud to take it.

I was in a trio party in Qufim the other week, hunting worms around the lake. Problem being, of course, all the stupid undead that would pop up there at night and slaughter us if we didn't leave by nightfall. A member of my LS was bored and dropped in, killing the undead as they spawned to keep the area clear for us to fight. I didn't ask him to do it, but I'm very glad he did.

At higher levels a party's more capable of dealing with links and unexpected surprises, and the benefit of having someone with a 75 job hanging around starts to diminish; it's no coincidence that you see fewer and fewer PLers as you push into the 30s. I don't see the practice as harmful to most jobs; the PLer can't kill the monster, so the damage-dealers still have to perform. The only person in a party who might level up without learning to do their job is the healer, but healing isn't rocket science; the healer would have to be supremely deficient to not be able to learn the ropes on their own.

[Mfume]

Re: PLs

I kind of have to disagree, if you have a WHM in your party, how are they going to get there "Healing" up? If the PLer, is doing all the work, why bother having a WHM or being one for that matter? (Same goes for rdm and sch) I mean, if I was a whm, I wouldnt want some PLer coming along and doing all of the work that I am doing. I would honestly feel like I am no good. Because, why would they need a PLer if I was doing my job right? There are alot of things that dont quite make sense to me, in that paragraph!

I also, know that your saying the PLer would help. But, one would think that is a whm anyway, why am I hear? if I attack I will die, if I use divine magic it wont do anything. If I heal it wont heal anybody, I know that you can still skill up your magic skills without doing anything at all. But, I honestly if I was a healer would want to help, and if I wasn't I wouldnt want to be in that party. Enough said!

Oh, I also forgot something, what you said in your last paragraph is alot dumb, Why you ask? Because, to me if being a noob and all to the game, (not a stupid one either) If every time I was going to a hard place to fight in a battle and there was always a PLer there. I would get used to that idea, so lets say I get used to that idea, and then I go there, and there is no PLer..oops! In other words, I feel like if u get so used to that, or anything just like in the real world, you will begin to think that it will always happen. In this case it always wont happen. So I think using a PLer to help, wouldnt really help because you aren't learning on your own. If you dont want your party to die, go someware ware you wont die, or get a better WHM not a PLer. Its not the answer to your problems people!!

(I know my spelling and writting sucks right now, I just woke up so give me a break.)

[Jarre]

Re: PLs

In my experience of being PL'd ina party the whm becomes lazy and preferes to toss out entheebles rather than concentrate on curing. the result? Pl had to go, we started fighting a IT mob, we wipped, Why? because the WHM still was entheebling and not watching everyones HP bars. problem is with people gettign lazy like that it follows them up, you say well don't invite them, well until their in teh aprty and fought a few mobs you don't know what a person is like.

on the other side there are BLM who nuke the shit out of things because they know if they get hate the PL will cure bomb them. PL goes, they still nuke the shit, the Tank can't pull hate off, blm dies, blames everyone, party leader (cocksucker) kicks you for not being a good tank. BLM had cast 8 tier 2 spells one after another, flash+provoke + 3 cure 3's + provoke + flash again could not pull the hate off him even with me wearing a breath mantle and useing it (+5 emnity).

Being Pl'd makes people careless, they get into a habit of game dynamics with a pl that when there isn't one they don't change and cause problems in parties.

Pl'ing just makes you lazy and retarded.

[Vejiita]

Re: PLs

I kind of have to disagree, if you have a WHM in your party, how are they going to get there "Healing" up? If the PLer, is doing all the work, why bother having a WHM or being one for that matter? (Same goes for rdm and sch) I mean, if I was a whm, I wouldnt want some PLer coming along and doing all of the work that I am doing. I would honestly feel like I am no good. Because, why would they need a PLer if I was doing my job right? ...

Hehe, you never had ME as a PLer my friend

I'm one of the kind you see. When I'm PLing I am *not* the main healer ! nope... and I refuse to be if there's a healer in the PT.

I want them to skill up and feel the stress and responsibility of main healing, so I'm there to backup in case of big AoE, to remove stupid effects (stona and such) and to haste the DD. I will also main heal when the healer has no more mp and rest, to keep the xp flowing, but that tank have to voke... he need to skill up too. Especially PLD and NIN !!! Shield, parry and evade doesn't skill-up doing nothing ! :D

See, you *want* me as a PLer

The only exception to my rules is if the PT afk for higer level protect and shell. It helps everybody. But I would prefer to have the whm of the party to do it and learn when to time the casting mid-fight versus his cures and such

PS: Duoing dnc with my gf, level 10 now and having a blast... had to say it... I post once or twice every years >.>

PPS: All the thread I post in dies after my posts... must be boring or somethin'

[Ellipses]

Re: PLs

On my previous character, I got PLed as WHM pretty much exclusively halfway through the jungles. I don't like it, but I don't like to bitch, either. I'm about the last person to leave a party, even if it's awful.

Capping Healing magic and still doing your job as a WHM is not that hard even with a PL. You can target your party faster than they can (F1-F6, target up/down, <p0-5> if you swing that way), and you can see everyone's HP at once, instead of just the one person you're targeting. Unless the PL has a whole macro set devoted entirely to PLing (and, y'know, if they do. . . weirdo), there is no reason you can't make them pretty redundant and obsolete.

The only real exception is you end up resting a bit longer on some fights that you'd normally make the puller wait on.

I'm not defending PLs for new players, which is just poison; and certainly there are lazy people who use the PL to not-learn. But a PL shouldn't be able to stop you from doing almost all of your job as a WHM if you don't want them to. Hell, firing off cures and status removals faster than the PL can is a good skill to develop.

[DakAttack]

Re: PLs

My g/f was coddled all her life and when we got an apartment together we had some real disasters.

You have a girlfriend??? My grand-dad has a girlfriend too. Old people... crazy.

At lvl 50 I had a pt with a blm that didn't know how to make a macro. How did we know this? Because we wanted him to burst with Freeze and say in his macro when to go. He expressed that he didn't have a macro and we said we'd wait till he made one. We even told him the /wait time to put in. Five minutes later we were wondering wth was going on and he finally admitted he had never made a macro before because he'd always had a p/l 'er. >< We talked him through the macro process and 15 minutes later we started fighting only to find that he couldn't burst either.........guess why? Yep...cause he never had to do it before because he'd always been p/l'd. ><

I think that's just an excuse. If you don't know the basics of the game it's not because somebody was helping you level up faster, it's because you didn't put the time into learning them. I knew what I was doing on every job I've ever played long before I played it, regardless if I had a PL help me through the dunes or the jungles. It's just a difference in purpose.

[Evion]

Re: PLs

I was in the dunes and got picked up as a DD for a PT once. We just sat there and sat there, so I was like "So, can we start yet?". They say, "just wait and the mobs will come to us". Apparently 3/6 of the people in our PT were master players and asked a couple of their master friends to "pull" for them. So their lv 75 puller friends would do this. Pop a dia on one goblin and then run around the entire dunes linking every goblin. They showed up at our camp with about 30+ goblins and all the hate, especially while they cure bombed us. We'd just pull goblins off them one at a time and never died. That was the only time I ever did that, and it was soo sweet. That was my only REAL PL experience, other than my PLing/backup for others.

[Callisto]

Re: PLs

I agree that excessive coddling by PLs can lead alot of people to get to 75 without knowing a damn thing about their jobs, but at the same time, I wouldn't turn a PL down from 10-40 in most cases, because after taking 13-14 jobs through Valkurm/Qufim/Jungles/Garlaige you just want to get the grind over with as soon as possible.

[Evion]

Re: PLs

I agree with that. I've only been PL'd in the dunes before, which IMHO is very appreciated. That seems to be the one place where levels, abilities, and xp mobs can cause a bad situation in need of PL. I believe that PLs are most useful when good players want xp fast with no down time.

I did have one guy tip me 80K for 2 hours of PLing him from 13-18 in the dunes, which was awesome!

[DakAttack]

Re: PLs

I was in the dunes and got picked up as a DD for a PT once. We just sat there and sat there, so I was like "So, can we start yet?". They say, "just wait and the mobs will come to us". Apparently 3/6 of the people in our PT were master players and asked a couple of their master friends to "pull" for them. So their lv 75 puller friends would do this. Pop a dia on one goblin and then run around the entire dunes linking every goblin. They showed up at our camp with about 30+ goblins and all the hate, especially while they cure bombed us. We'd just pull goblins off them one at a time and never died. That was the only time I ever did that, and it was soo sweet. That was my only REAL PL experience, other than my PLing/backup for others.

That is awesome.

[Feba]

Re: PLs

Pl'ing just makes you lazy and retarded.

No, being lazy and retarded makes you lazy and retarded. I've had plenty of PLs, both with and without parties, and never have trouble adjusting back to soloing or partying without one. PLing is just another type of party, saying that it makes you suck is like saying a THF that parties with PLDs sucks. It's just not true.