Job adjustments for expansion.

[Rain_Blade]

Re: Job adjustments for expansion.

Failed.

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Edit:
To counter all rdm related posts.
And based on DiV ls chat...
RDM isn't fixed until they can soro AV

Failed.

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Job adjustments for expansion.

Not only is it a matter of BLU being a capable frontline DD, but COR as well. Call me biased if you must, but I've yet to meet a RDM/anything that can keep pace on melee with COR/RNG and still maintain his duties like I can. I can get tied down for a good bit on some rolls, but regular 800-1.2k WS tends to speak for itself (lolCOR/WHMs).

And chances are, if another mage is on backline a BRD isn't going to want to waste a single target JA for ballads on a RDM when they could use it to buff the THF that missed around of AoE or the Monk that wanted March instead of Minuet.

That's the thing - party mechanics are too entrenched and so is RDM's design within its role as a caster. I couldn't seriously give up staves for sword if SC/MB makes a comeback, staves are just that good.

[Pteryx]

Re: Job adjustments for expansion.

The only way I can see RDM becoming able to melee in XP parties would be if they became able to melee in mid-spell. That way, you'd at least have a choice -- sit in back and use staves for stronger spells, or stand up front doing the same job, but sacrificing spell potency for Enspell-enhanced melee attacks. -- Pteryx

[Susurrus]

Re: Job adjustments for expansion.

The only way I can see RDM becoming able to melee in XP parties would be if they became able to melee in mid-spell. That way, you'd at least have a choice -- sit in back and use staves for stronger spells, or stand up front doing the same job, but sacrificing spell potency for Enspell-enhanced melee attacks. -- Pteryx

What's the difference between blu casting while on front line (yes they have cast times too) and rdm doing that?

[Pteryx]

Re: Job adjustments for expansion.

What's the difference between blu casting while on front line (yes they have cast times too) and rdm doing that?

Several differences, actually:

1) Lots and lots of BLU spells that affect enemies have the same range as melee weaponskills, forcing them to stand at the front line in the first place.

2) BLU has many spells that are helped by STR, Att, Acc, and their skill with the weapon they're wielding just like normal attacks are. Thus, they don't have to spread themselves thin to be effective in both ways.

3) The majority of blue spells that would be cast in mid-battle have very short casting times, to the point that they can be cast between swings. Even with Fast Cast, RDM just can't compare. Neither can DRK, for that matter -- though at least SE is trying, judging by their halving the casting time of the Absorb spells this year.

4) Starting at 40, BLU melee does more than just keep the BLU skilled up for casting purposes -- it also lets them build TP for their self-bursted self-skillchains. That means they have a reason to hang onto their TP well before the staves come into play.

Add this up, and you actually have a case for letting BLU get away with not standing back and clinging to a bundle of staves. (Though the smart ones swap the proper staff in between closing their self-chain and self-bursting it, and then swap their swords back in. It's not as if they have TP to lose at that point anyway...)

By contrast, on RDM after 41, if you're not in mid-cast you're probably doing something wrong (if you're not, then your puller is -- stupid MP-blind jerks) and elemental staves are not optional if you're going to land your debuffs thanks to the accuracy of most core elements of the game starting to fall apart post-50 or post-60. -- Pteryx

[Malacite]

Re: Job adjustments for expansion.

2) BLU has many spells that are helped by STR, Acc, and their skill with the weapon they're wielding just like normal attacks are. Thus, they don't have to spread themselves thin to be effective in both ways.

fixed

[Karinya]

Re: Job adjustments for expansion.

The one thing that I could see bringing back RDM melee: a sword that grants the casting bonuses of all eight staves. (RDM, BLU, maybe PLD...) Seems kinda sick at first glance, but when you think about it, you effectively have the bonuses of all eight staves at once anyway if you swap them every time you cast. So from a purely spellcasting perspective you're not gaining much (unless you have a shield with caster stats - better than your grip's). But the ability to have a weapon you have nonzero skill with, and not have to swap it out every 2 seconds, would be nice.

Staves are 51, I don't think it's unreasonable for a piece of gear 20 levels later to make them obsolete. Put in a level 71 Eightfold Staff too (WHM/BLM/SMN/SCH) so other mages can get their seven inventory slots back.

I don't want to think about how expensive the HQ of those would be, if there was one; but they'd be welcome additions to the game and not really screw with balance *that* much.

[NicasinXS]

Re: Job adjustments for expansion.

These rdm boosts for melee are great. Especially for me, most of my farming I do with 75 rdm/nin. It probably wont be too much, something like lvl 2 enspells would be enouph to stoke me out though.

I read that Scholar will be able to stack spells for casting. This makes me wonder if subbed with blm the am2s could be stacked then fired off one after the other. That seems too good, but if scholar doesnt have its own availability for stoneskin/gravity/bind or anything like that under 37 then rdm will still be the main blm solo subjob.

[Malacite]

Re: Job adjustments for expansion.

Prism Staff?

[Yellow Mage]

Re: Job adjustments for expansion.

Prism Sword?

FTFY

(Keep in mind that was from before I wised up about suggestions disguised as questions.)

[Mhurron]

Re: Job adjustments for expansion.

Besides, don't we have enough jobs whose primary focus is standing near an enemy and flailing away for damage?
Icemage

The idea seems to be to move things to where more 3-4 player groups do things like exp/merit instead of requiring 6 players. In which case, you would want an extra bit of damage.

[Malacite]

Re: Job adjustments for expansion.

Besides, it's more fun to get up in the mob's face :3

[DakAttack]

Re: Job adjustments for expansion.

Besides, it's more fun to get up in the mob's face :3

If you're going to melee, at least do something useful and stand behind the enemy for the thief.

[Karinya]

Re: Job adjustments for expansion.

The idea seems to be to move things to where more 3-4 player groups do things like exp/merit instead of requiring 6 players. In which case, you would want an extra bit of damage.

But if it's 3-4 player groups you'd probably be fighting toughs anyway, the same way DRG or BST trios already do. In which case you *don't* need staves to land spells, and B skill won't stop you from hitting in melee. Even with meat (again, don't need more casting stats to land spells on a tough) pahluwan body + o.hat + lifebelt + maybe a few more acc pieces should be plenty.

And then RDM doesn't really need an adjustment, except in player mindset.

I'd really rather see the devs focus their efforts on jobs that need adjustment: THF heads the list IMO, and if their answer is to give THF another way to move hate around, that shows they haven't understood the question. Either THF needs a way to contribute more to utsu-spamming tpburns (which don't care who has hate because they all spam utsusemi), or utsu-spamming tpburns need to be far less dominant in the overall set of exp options for high level characters. Or both.

[Akashimo]

Re: Job adjustments for expansion.

I hope accomplice is a 30~60 second ability >.>; Otherwise its like they gave us nothing.