Windows Version Update

[Feba]

Re: Windows Version Update

So just because most people here use the keyboard or a game pad they shouldn't have fixed this bug they came across?

nope.

this patch is more pointless than the mithra nerf.

[emeraldpearl]

Re: Windows Version Update

nope.

this patch is more pointless than the mithra nerf.

/agreed

this patch shows no purpose what so ever, a minor bug fix isn't all that important.

[Feba]

Re: Windows Version Update

of all the programming SE has to do, surely they could've just told the GMs to teach these people how to use their keyboards and bug off.

[emeraldpearl]

Re: Windows Version Update

keyboard IMO is the easiest thing to use. you have your number pad to move, and your keys to your left to control actions. done and dusted in 2 seconds.

[LyonheartLakshmi]

Re: Windows Version Update

In FFXI, the Mouse is evil! I can't think of any other application where moving the pointer across a selection automatically moves focus to said selection. The accepted behavior is for focus to not move until you actually click on it. But not so when it comes to the AH menu.

I have made a couple of AH misbids in the recent months due to mouse quirkiness. Be careful that you don't accidentally bump your mouse while working a bid at the AH! You could end up paying 1 M on a Robe +1 or something silly like that.

[Murphie]

Re: Windows Version Update

So just because most people here use the keyboard or a game pad they shouldn't have fixed this bug they came across?

Of course not.

[emeraldpearl]

Re: Windows Version Update

lol seems as though were agreed on the fact this patch is useless ^^

[Mhurron]

Re: Windows Version Update

In FFXI, the Mouse is evil! I can't think of any other application where moving the pointer across a selection automatically moves focus to said selection. The accepted behavior is for focus to not move until you actually click on it. But not so when it comes to the AH menu.

Actually this makes the mouse behave the same way as if you were navigating with the keyboard. You move the cursor with the keyboard and where ever it is is the current selection, you move the cursor with the mouse and where ever it is is the current selection.

Clicking to make something active then clicking again to select is only needed in an environment where you would be working with multiple apps which is not how FFXI's interface is made to function.

Also there are entire windowing systems that have Focus follows Mouse so no it is not unheard of, even though you personally may not have used one.

[Murphie]

Re: Windows Version Update

Wait, I actually meant that of course they should have fixed the bug. A bug is a bug.

[Feba]

Re: Windows Version Update

Also there are entire windowing systems that have Focus follows Mouse so no it is not unheard of,

yep, I tried using it in Compiz. It's alright, I personally didn't find I'd use it often enough to make up for the fact that it would undoubtedly get annoying at some point in time.

[LyonheartLakshmi]

Re: Windows Version Update

Clicking to make something active then clicking again to select is only needed in an environment where you would be working with multiple apps which is not how FFXI's interface is made to function.

"Not intended to be working with multiple apps" is something they'll have to address when they add an official windowed mode, though.

Also there are entire windowing systems that have Focus follows Mouse so no it is not unheard of, even though you personally may not have used one.

On those systems, does focus remain on the last icon the mouse scrolled over? Or does that focus "disappear" if the mouse hovers over nothing in particular at the time? Because that's my main beef with the way focus is handled on the AH menu. I could live with a "soft focus" and a "hard focus", where the hard focus is the last item I either selected via keyboard or clicked on with mouse. And if I move the mouse, a temporary soft focus follows it until I move completely off the AH menu, at which point focus returns to the hard focus.

[Mhurron]

Re: Windows Version Update

"Not intended to be working with multiple apps" is something they'll have to address when they add an official windowed mode, though.

No because focus follows the app. You would click on the FFXI window, at which point things would work the same way they do now. Click on another window (Word) and mousing over the area of the FFXI window would do nothing, the window would not be capturing anything.

On those systems, does focus remain on the last icon the mouse scrolled over? Or does that focus "disappear" if the mouse hovers over nothing in particular at the time?

The original implementation had very hard focus follows mouse. Where ever your mouse was, that had focus, a button or another window. You only clicked to do something.
I still don't really see the problem, the mouse acts exactly like the keybord does.

[LyonheartLakshmi]

Re: Windows Version Update

I still don't really see the problem, the mouse acts exactly like the keybord does.

That in itself is the problem. A mouse isn't a keyboard, and a keyboard isn't a mouse. UI shouldn't be designed so that they both act exactly the same.

A mouse can do things that the keyboard can't. For instance, I can move the mouse pointer to a totally different part of the screen, to a point away from the AH menu entirely, without first closing the AH menu. With a keyboard, arrow movements stay within the menu, and can go no where else until the menu is closed. When designing the behavior of the mouse, the developers should take into account the additional freedom the mouse grants to the user, and not limit its behavior by trying to make it mimic the keyboard's behavior.

[Feba]

Re: Windows Version Update

You forget, FFXI was designed ground up for the gamepad- then it was ported to the keyboard, then finally the mouse was added on. If you actually try to not use the mouse, you'll realize how crappy the mouse controls are. FFXI should be played with either a gamepad or a keyboard. We don't need no damn pointing devices.

[WishMaster3K]

Re: Windows Version Update

The problem is that the mouse interface is on a 2-D plane (screne) while the world is 3-D.

If in fact the mouse worked different (for instance, moving it on the desk would be similar to moving it around. you could go closer or further away from something based on how you moved it) in menu and out of menu, that might be more intuitive. But FFXI wasn't designed to do that..