Making the game appetizing for new players

[MisterCookie]

Re: Making the game appetizing for new players

I'd prefer a change to the death penalty system. First, they should reduce the exp penalty(again). I just think its stupid that people lost hours worth of exp because of one mistake by another player.

Secondly, I think they should make it so that the penalty is reduced(or even removed) when opting to return to home point after a death. Its already bad enough that the player loses a crapload of exp, its made worse that they have to waste even more time getting back to where they were(especially in CoP dungeon crawls).

[Alshandra]

Re: Making the game appetizing for new players

Mmm... Auto-sort...
((Can I have it?))

[Legal Fish]

Re: Making the game appetizing for new players

I'd prefer a change to the death penalty system. First, they should reduce the exp penalty(again). I just think its stupid that people lost hours worth of exp because of one mistake by another player.

Secondly, I think they should make it so that the penalty is reduced(or even removed) when opting to return to home point after a death. Its already bad enough that the player loses a crapload of exp, its made worse that they have to waste even more time getting back to where they were(especially in CoP dungeon crawls).

Um... no. You've gone too far. This would change the entire game. You could of said lower the exp loss levels 1 to 20 or something. But this... no.

[MisterCookie]

Re: Making the game appetizing for new players

Um... no. You've gone too far. This would change the entire game. You could of said lower the exp loss levels 1 to 20 or something. But this... no.

And adding auto-sort doesn't?

[Legal Fish]

Re: Making the game appetizing for new players

Let me rephrase that if it isn't really that clear.

You've taken one of FFXI's prime principals and warped it... even get rid of it completely. I really hate to sound like some ignorant fanboy, but a nonpunishment game is simply another type of game, its more akin to World of Warcraft or Guild Wars. That exp loss is very important to FFXI.

"Auto Sort Setting" hardly changes the core of the game. It's borderline cosmetic and will become an afterthought if implemented. "Being awkward for new player" isn't a principal of FFXI, it is just a flaw that people accuse it of.

[MisterCookie]

Re: Making the game appetizing for new players

I mean a slight reduction, not elimation of all death penalties(I don't want this ending up like GW, where the "penalty" lasts 2 minutes)

[Legal Fish]

Re: Making the game appetizing for new players

1/10 of a level's cap, less at higher levels, is hardly a days work. With the correct furniture, it becomes 7 to 9/10 a level's cap. Mind you, its already capped for the higher levels and Raise shrinks it even more. Players dying causing a party to break up or traveling back from your HP seem much more of the problem than the actual exp lose.

[Kholdstare]

Re: Making the game appetizing for new players

Personally, the issue with death at low levels is that until 25, you don't have Raise (and even after that, if you don't have the good fortune of having a WHM) so you either stick around waiting for one, or those who die have to HP and trudge their way back. Even then, those people are still behind in exp compared to everyone else (unless everyone died.)

Actually, that makes for a really good idea. Why not introduce Phoenix Downs? Have NQs be sold from several NPCs, and +1 and +2 (which act like Raise II and III respectively) be solely crafting (high alchemy, most likely.)

That way, you don't have to worry about waiting for that Raise to come if you don't have one, as long as someone in the party has a Phoenix Down. and even later, if the WHM dies and didn't have Reraise, there's another use for them.

Sell them for an affordable, yet not too cheap price, and you solve a major issue with death.

[Vyuru]

Re: Making the game appetizing for new players

In case people have forgotten, you can get a lower exp loss when you get killed with the right mog house enhancement.

[Ziero]

Re: Making the game appetizing for new players

Change the whole Adventurer's Coupon deal. The NPC doesn't hand you the Coupon directly, but tells you it has been sent to you in your Mog House and he directs you there, but you still get the NPC marker and all. So you go to your mog, pick it up, and you trade it to the NPC for 600 gil. This is enough to actually buy level 1 gear from the vendors in-town. Also important to note it becomes rare/exclusive. So a player gets it, he trades it, and he is instructed to where he can buy the armor and weapon he'd like, and it isn't the auction house, but the NPC shop selling for 1/5 of the price usually.

This, minus the attempt to prevent 'abuse' of it, is a great idea. 50 gil is crap, 500 gil is useful at lvl 1. And player can already create a new character over and over again just to get a small amount of gil. Scrolls and onion weapons can sell 100-1k on an AH easy, i doubt the extra 500 would unbalance things too much. It certainly wouldn't be more abusive then doing bubbly bernie runs.

Resting Bonus. This will probably be the most controversial I'll mention, because it will have a big effect at the higher level, but... with Signet on players are granted a bonus to HP and MP recovered while healing(hHP and hMP often called) while in regions their nation controls. This bonus is equal 1 + 1/2 their level, rounding down. (+1 at level 1, +6 at level 10, +11 at level 20, +38 at level 75). A +5 bonus is granted while players are in the following areas(no matter of nationality, as long signet is on) : East/West Ronfaure, South/North Gustaberg, and East/West Sarutabaruta. At level 1 player in his nation's starting area would get a +6 and at level 8 +10... a blessing for those frustrated BLMs who have not prepared themselves well enough to make it well. Or that soloing WAR without a WHM sub to back him up or a friend to cure him.

Good GOD yes, give people a reason to use Signet again. And hHP and hMP are *always* welcomed without being overpowered, even if they were allowed in dynamis, limbus etc. Especially for melees, any time spent resting is bad and the less time needed to do so the better. It's not like they'll ever be able to sit for a minute and regain full HP, but any boost to hHP without the need for food and an entire set of gear would be great.

Outpost NPC Assistance. As a trade-off of not being able to do Outpost warps and the natural annoyance leveling 1 to 24 can be without a raiser(could end a party that someone took an hour to form), players will be able to buy a cheaper Reraise effect or Warp (not scrolls mind you). Let's say 200 for reraise(double, 400 if your nation is not in control of the outpost) and 300 for Warp(double, 600 ditto). A party of signet users will only see a wipe or tank death as a minor setback. Players who need to upgrade their armor after hitting level 16 or 17 can do so more freely without having to kill themselves. Lets not even get into how this could be helpful outside a party situation or for someone who is leveling their newest job.

Though I understand the why you thought of this concept, but would players actually use them? People can already buy both items in any town before they leave, but very few do. Why do they need to have these items brought to them everywhere they lvl while being newbies?It certainly wouldn't break anything if these were added to OP sellers, but I just don't see the need as you can get both items before leaving a city.

Rank 2 Reward. When a player hits Rank 2 in a nation for the first time(and only the first time) he will be rewarded a stack of 3 rare/ex versions of food listed below. It will also mention what type of food.

I say rank missions should reward EXP as well as gil, but not food. Make it a quest based on your job or something.

"Nutritionist" NPC. Another change that would benefit a lot of higher level players. Honestly I just made this one up with the suggestion of the guy above. In every tavern in each town, this includes: Lion Springs Tavern, Rusty Anchor Pub, Timbre Timbers Tavern, Steaming Sheep Restaurant, Merry Minstrel Meadhouse, Marlbe Bridge Eatery, Celodehki's Bed & Breakfest, Sailors' Stay, Sheperd's Muster, and Shararat Teahouse. Simply by trading the food to the NPC with a charge of 50 gil, the NPC will tell you the stats of the food.

People who would use this would be able to find out the food's stats regardless as these are people who would take the 5 seconds to at least ask a friend or try and look it up. Plus most people I see using the 'wrong' food do it on purpose due to personal misbeliefs that they will refuse to change. Such as sams eating rice balls without AF hands or people using sushi in the dunes. Though a series of NPCs that would be able to recommend 'proper' foods for your lvl and job class would be much more useful imo. Having an in game NPC narrow down your choices in food for you to suit your specific needs would help people confused about what they should use.

Auto-Sort Option. An option has been added called "Auto-Sort Setting". Much like Block Aid, to see you "Auto-Sort Setting", you simply type /Autosort. To turn it on: /Autosort On. To turn it off: /Autosort Off. With Autosort on, it instantly stacks all items that enters your inventory(may it be from trading or monster drop or quest) after it is turned on. When it is turned on, all items currently unstacked will be sorted into a stack(but if you turn it off, all your items remained stack). Players begin the game with their Auto-Sort Setting on.

This is more or less a 'no duh' idea and infact should have been in since the start and *always* have been on. When I, and many other people, started playing thing, I had no idea how to stack or even what a stack was. So all those drops would pile up in singles and fill my tiny inven real quick. There's no reason to not have an auto-sort.

even another suggestion is a flag whenever your inventory reaches full or not. Maybe a red message that pops up to let you know that you're going to lose out on the next drop if you don't sort out your inventory.

This would be extremely helpful for such a small change.

Some things I feel would help out lowbies, and all players in general:

Brining the small party event concept down to lower lvl people. Low lvls like doing more then lvling too, there should be *event* type quests that required no more then 3-6 people as opposed to echo wars and garrisons which usually need a near full ally to win. I know there are BCNM20s, but there's no reason there shouldn't be more.

Better rewards from some quests. Some of the harder non-repeatables should give EXP, and getting a new rank should as well. Maybe some new, useful, lower lvl gear. Maybe some rings that add +1 att or acc or something before lvl 14. Seriously there is nothing for melees to use 1-10.

[Legal Fish]

Re: Making the game appetizing for new players

This, minus the attempt to prevent 'abuse' of it, is a great idea. 50 gil is crap, 500 gil is useful at lvl 1. And player can already create a new character over and over again just to get a small amount of gil. Scrolls and onion weapons can sell 100-1k on an AH easy, i doubt the extra 500 would unbalance things too much. It certainly wouldn't be more abusive then doing bubbly bernie runs.

Oh I assure you, I originally thought that too but then something came into my mind. Think of the following phrases at the same time: Chinese sweatshops, 16 character accounts, and never logging off.

would players actually use them?

Its kind of simple really. Lets say you are in a Dunes with your experienced self, but your party? Not really. Naturally only a hopeless guy wouldn't have/know how to use signet and those kind of people you can't help even if you spammed them with "GET SIGNET, YO" system messages. Anyway, so these people have their CP... er Conquest Points. You can just tell them "Yo, guys, get Reraise" "Er how?" "Talk to the Outpost dude" "K". Bam! The party's minimal longevity extended and less exp damage will be done. Also, some people will think "Yo, I can do this w/o gettin' talking to that fine lady at the outpostz if I just by my scroll in the town, word is bond".

People who would use this would be able to find out the food's stats regardless as these are people who would take the 5 seconds to at least ask a friend or try and look it up. Plus most people I see using the 'wrong' food do it on purpose due to personal misbeliefs that they will refuse to change. Such as sams eating rice balls without AF hands or people using sushi in the dunes. Though a series of NPCs that would be able to recommend 'proper' foods for your lvl and job class would be much more useful imo. Having an in game NPC narrow down your choices in food for you to suit your specific needs would help people confused about what they should use.

Well, I don't really see it that way. In my opinion, the less the game's reliance on a database website the better. I mean, what you just said means either that everyone should use windower or have another PC with or has a friend with either. Even then, what about the friendless player who doesn't know any good database sites? (He is not friendless because he is grimy, he is because he is new)

I don't see how this effect can't help people who are misinformed. And I think suggesting what food is best at that level is not only high maintenance, I don't think those are kind of things SE should be saying. Really, some food is better for certain people and jobs. PS. Isn't Riceballs pure stat bonus oppose to %? That can be considered better at lower levels ;o.

[Aksannyi]

Re: Making the game appetizing for new players

Oh my god, getting xp for Rank increase would be killer. I mean don't get me wrong, I love the gil bonus (100k for Rank 10 was a nice one ^.^) but I'd love to get even 1k of xp for getting a new rank. Shit, we work hard as hell to get it anyway but you rarely, if ever, get any xp off of the mobs you fight in missions, especially with high level helpers who make the xp crap anyway.

[little ninja]

Re: Making the game appetizing for new players

If you're trying to make the game more palatable for veteran FFXI players that left and are thinking about returning, some of the orginal suggestions are spot on. However, for brand new players to FFXI, I don't believe any of those changes make game any better.
The signet bonus is a good mechanical change regardless -- although I prefer the signet change Karinya profiled in a different thread.
From ground zero to being ready to party the game is terribly monotonous. This is where I suspect the downfall of FFXI is in keeping players hooked. The casual game player, after several game sessions of play, has to be asking themself "how many more bunnies do I have to kill?"
The trick is how, after a few hours of play, do you keep the game more entertaining instead of the bore fest you brought up? Get rid of the monotony.
This where Kholdstare's idea of quests rewarding experience shines. If one could split the time spent getting to level 10'ish between the killing the bunnies, and doing [non-repeatable] solo'able quests that provide decent gear or gil, and experience, I think the average gamer would be wiling to stick it out. This change alone is all that I believe would be necessary to make the game appetizing for new players.
(really, this just emphasizes the point that Little Ninja brought up. The method of acquiring experience in FFXI is it's downfall).
Even fixing the beggining method of leveling wouldn't be enough to attract new blood. For the new player, FFXI has to overcome the gravitational pull of WoW, and also has to overcome it's perception fo being old.
Overcoming the later requires a refresh to the game. Radically changing the gameplay (ala SWG) is a gamble in which the likely outcome is alienating the core (loyal) playerbase. Probably the best way to attract new players is by updating the visuals. SE could do this is by forking the game engine, and having the new engine can take advantage of the native graphic capabilities present with the current generation of gaming platforms.
From level 10-15 on, the problem becomes different (and much harder to solve); how do you enable people to acquire experience? Not only does the cronic lack of healers still take place, often times there simply isn't enough players at the 10-20 range to make a party.
Continuing the quest-for-XP method starts breaking down at this point. Trying to solo is painful. Icemage's idea of deliberate level capping could help the situation by expanding the potential player base at any level. Maybe reducing barrier to getting the Adventuring Fellow NPC so that players could easily fill gaps in a party would work.

See here is another player who see's the core problem of the FFXI series. Hey great i get autosort ( talk about being lazy), an santion for the old areas. Yet how does this fill in the very big gaps of a thing called downtime. The reduction of exp would be nice. An is about the only thing i heard that would be useful is shot down. Funny thing is i heard it would mess with the core of the game. Yet what do you think the mpk patch did. Ohh yeah no more goblins wondering back in the jungles, or crawlers wandering back in C.N. Something i wonder if any of you ever sat thru.

Funny how we dont want to make it like WoW. but some of these suggestions seem to be WoWish...

[Theyaden]

Re: Making the game appetizing for new players

Only thing I wouldn't like as much, is when new zones are brought out, its a mini-adventure to figure out what the new drops are and such. Plus, for many zones thats a mighty long list you'd have to wade through to find the drops for the few mobs you'd be killing. Maybe make it so if you drop it or pass on it once, you have the option to tell it not to give it to you until you zone.

The XP bonus remains after switching jobs. I've also tested activating xp ring then logging in next day. Benifit being able to get the xp bonus and re-activate the ring again in the same party, but the downside is if pt invites are dry you may have it wear off while waiting.

Previously mentioned idea by another poster of reducing xp loss I can sympathise with but curently I think the mog bed enhancement coupled with xp saved by getting a raise rather than homepointing is sufficient. Potion (Reraiser) or scroll of Re-raise are viable substitutes if re-raise is needed but no whm available. Unfortunately the odds of other pt members having re-raise up are almost nill.

[Legal Fish]

Re: Making the game appetizing for new players

Little Ninja, please stop with the flame baiting.