Salvage: first impressions and info

[LilithAngel]

Re: Salvage: first impressions and info

Ah ok, I wasn't sure whether or not the other three pet jobs could get thier pets to attack like us Dragoons get ours to do. I was under the impression, somehow, that they could either use JAs *or* simply attack to get thier pets to do the same.

Then in that case, it's pretty much Monk and Dragoon that people would want the most to help kick start a Salvage run (ironiclly enough, given that those were some of the first jobs that people scorned in the early days). At least, that's what it's looking like to me.

EDIT: Also, the reason I didn't list Summoner and Beastmaster earlier is because of the temporary nature of thier pets; the Avatar will require MP to stay out, and w/o equipment and limited items, it won't stay out indefinately like a wyvern or automaton can, and jug pets will suffer the same fate (also, I'm unaware of whether or not BSTs can even zone with thier pets. Can someone fill me in on this?). Given those reasons, I didn't see how Summoner or Beastmaster could help out as much as Dragoon or Puppetmaster could with thier pets. Mebbie my line of reasoning was flawed, I dunno.

[Lmnop]

Re: Salvage: first impressions and info

so in the very beginning, Drg (with their wyvern recast ready for when they get the JA imbued item) would really be at least as good as MNKs, since you at least don't have to worry about Raising wyverns.

SMN could be problematic since your mp would continue to tick down while pet is out, and you couldn't Desummon since it's a job ability.

also, @POLUtils site:

# Potency - Critical hit rate is improved.
# Regain - TP are gradually restored.
# Pax - Enmity generation is reduced.
# Intension - Magic accuracy is enhanced.
# encumbrance - You are unable to equip certain weapons or armor.
# Obliviscence - You are unable to access your support job abilities.
# impairment - You are unable to access your job abilities.
# Omerta - You are unable to cast magic.
# debilitation - You are experiencing a penalty to one of your attributes.

some of these are Pathos... perhaps some of these are buffs that can be obtained by using Temp items out of the coffers. That drink that you didn't get to see what it did... could give the drinker Intension. Maybe I'm just missing something...


====

EDIT: ACK! just go check it out yourself. Listed is all temp items and their buffs. Patch info.

[Taskmage]

Re: Salvage: first impressions and info

since you at least don't have to worry about Raising wyverns.

No, but if the wyvern dies, it's down for the count until you unlock JAs again to resummon it.

[Lmnop]

Re: Salvage: first impressions and info

that's why you bring both :3

[Anaki]

Re: Salvage: first impressions and info

ok i think you did a different salvage then me since your drop pattern is much different. for me we did zhalom rementants first floor has 4 paths with a proggo at the end on each path is 1 kind of mob that basically drops only 1 imbued item.
we got weapon magic and abilities did not do fourth path. frog at the end dropped 2 of the imbued items :D

on floor 3 and up it turns into a split map where you are on one half and there are mobs they look like floating walls we think kill em for portal using and we also got a card on floor 4. on floor 2 was a slot north of us. mnk pup drg thf war are great jobs to start with since for the drg you can clal wyvern before you enter and wyverns are immune to pathos giving them a nice damage boost the rest of the jobs have H2H skill

[Vyuru]

Re: Salvage: first impressions and info

Just a few questions for you Karinya.

For melee, woulding eating something that gives +healing hp be better than eating +att/str food for the first little bit? My thought is that since you can't use spells for awhile it might be a good idea to bring along some garlic crackers or something to speed up down time.

If a dragoon were to come as drg/mage, and get both equipment, subjob, and spells unlocked, how far in would you guess this would be and how effective a backup healer at this point do you think a dragoon could be?

[Karinya]

Re: Salvage: first impressions and info

Just a few questions for you Karinya.
For melee, woulding eating something that gives +healing hp be better than eating +att/str food for the first little bit? My thought is that since you can't use spells for awhile it might be a good idea to bring along some garlic crackers or something to speed up down time.

Maybe, but I think a combination of hi-potions and temp items for healing would be more effective. You really don't want to have unnecessary downtime on the early floors IMO.

Crackers might be a good choice for people who aren't really doing that much damage anyway, but occasionally get caught in a self-destruct or something. Come to think of it, DRG might fall into that category since your food won't affect your wyvern's damage. Too bad there's no *wyvern* +hHP that isn't equipped and wyverns don't benefit from their master's food. So you'll have to judge how much to rest for wyvern HP and how much you can afford to DD without getting it killed.

Currently, hipotions and hipotion tanks are very cheap because they drop so much from Assault, but that may change if there is enough demand for them for Salvage. As long as they're cheap, though, I think they're a better alternative.

If a dragoon were to come as drg/mage, and get both equipment, subjob, and spells unlocked, how far in would you guess this would be and how effective a backup healer at this point do you think a dragoon could be?

Subjob, spells and JA (you're probably going to need spirit link or call wyvern at some point) you can get by the end of the first floor or early in the second (more likely the latter as the early spell unlockers will go to people with mage main jobs), but unlocking your head slot (I assume that's the one you're chiefly concerned about, for af/af2 helm) might be more difficult, depending on how important the alliance leader thinks your helmet is compared to everyone else wanting their head and neck items too. If there's a tank with Aegishjalmr or Koenig Schaller or something like that, they might be given priority over you on getting their head/neck items back first.

By that time you'll be fighting monsters that can do pretty significant damage - at least on the path we took. (I thought it was Zhayolm due to the presence of trolls, wamoura, eruca and other Halvung/Zhayolm monsters, but the above post claims to have been Zhayolm and had a very different monster list, so who knows.) But I haven't seen drg/mage in action at higher levels so I don't really know how effective it would be.

Regardless, though, other replies on this thread seem to indicate that you can presummon your wyvern and take it in to help with the early fights (at least until it dies, which you can't do much about without wyvern improving gear or Spirit Link) and thus DRG would be one of the most useful early jobs along with MNK, PUP and WAR (who have the best HTH skill).

Speaking of PUP - the puppet won't attack without being commanded to do so, but will it use healing attachments on its master and party without any JAs required? (Assuming it's a Stormwaker, I suppose.) I have to admit I know very little about the mechanics of PUP and what determines the puppet's actions.


Perhaps we're putting excessive weight on the first fights, though. While I feel that my first run wasted a lot of time on them, it may have been largely through indecisiveness and not keeping up pulling speed (I don't intend that as a condemnation of the other members, though, it was the first day Salvage was released and nobody really knew what to do).

[LilithAngel]

Re: Salvage: first impressions and info

Perhaps we're putting excessive weight on the first fights, though.

I would say no, at this point. We're just beginning to get into Salvage, so it makes sense to go slowly at first to understand the strategies for each part. Small steps, so to speak. As LSs get more accustomed to it, I can imagine runs going farther and farther until finally some group manages to finish a full run. At that point, people, knowing how to finish it, will work on ways to do it faster and more efficiently.

It's just that it won't happen overnight. Start small, work on one section at a time, and eventually, we'll get to the point where how much time to spend on one section or another won't matter as much as the overall product.

[Toksyuryel]

Re: Salvage: first impressions and info

I can confirm that you must be on or past ToAU mission 18 "Passing Glory" in order for the NPC that sells the Remnants Permits to give you the time of day. Our WHM was past The Black Coffin but hadn't gotten to Passing Glory yet and could not buy the permit. Once she got to Passing Glory, she was able to buy one.

[Anaki]

Re: Salvage: first impressions and info

ya its odd zhaloym remnants have MAMOOK monster. and bhaflu remnants have HALVUNG monsters. i think theres a coding glitch there also zhaloym does not seem to drop JACK >

[Legal Fish]

Re: Salvage: first impressions and info

You sure that WHM friend of yours didn't level to 65 in that time?

[Toksyuryel]

Re: Salvage: first impressions and info

The WHM is over level 70. I'm sure she didn't delevel to 64, check the NPC, then relevel to over 70, without anyone noticing, in the hour we waited for her.

[Neomage]

Re: Salvage: first impressions and info

The WHM is over level 70. I'm sure she didn't delevel to 64, check the NPC, then relevel to over 70, without anyone noticing, in the hour we waited for her.

Oh but she did! She used the posterns to quickly get out to Wajoam Woodhands and delevel to 64, came back, checked the NPC, then used item duping on Memoirs to get back up to 70!

[Vyuru]

Re: Salvage: first impressions and info

then relevel to over 70, without anyone noticing, in the hour we waited for her.

Behold the power of TP burns

[Karinya]

Re: Salvage: first impressions and info

According to some information I found on Mysterytour and FFXIclopedia, the distribution of imbued (i.e. Pathos-removing) items varies depending on which remnants area you are in. This means that some of the strategies may be different for different areas. Maybe rangers aren't always useless for a floor and a half, for example. (Actually, they're not really useless; because mobs are so weak, rangers can do pretty well even with melee weapons. But they're not as good as a lot of other jobs until they can get a ranged weapon unlocker.)

At least one item has already been reported to drop in multiple remnants, so you may be able to choose ones that are better suited to the group you have - except that it looks like Nyzul Isle may be a future salvage area that will require completing all of the first four. (Of course it's also unsure yet whether this means completing them once like Dynamis, or completing them once per Nyzul run like Limbus, or something else.)

P.S. It has been reported that the in-game descriptions of the Stratus Cell and Cirrocumulus Cell are incomplete; they say they allow the use of feet equipment and waist equipment respectively, but are reported to actually allow the use of leg and feet equipment and waist and back equipment. I don't know if anyone has reported this to SE yet to be fixed in the next update.