Plumage of a Gilbuyer?

[Jei]

Re: Plumage of a Gilbuyer?

I usually try to hit kuftal after 53. The crabs can be slow to kill when you're lower than that.
get to 55, move to colibri. weeee.

Actually, if you party pull a mob and you have not once cast anything on anyone since the pull, you can still convert and you won't build any hate.

[Sabaron]

Re: Plumage of a Gilbuyer?

I usually try to hit kuftal after 53. The crabs can be slow to kill when you're lower than that.
get to 55, move to colibri. weeee.

Actually, if you party pull a mob and you have not once cast anything on anyone since the pull, you can still convert and you won't build any hate.

That is a very useful tip. I'll have to use that in the future.

In this particular situation, however, while I was contemplating the Convert... I had to throw a cure on the NIN, took hate, and went orange, thus making Convert next to useless.

[Aeni]

Re: Plumage of a Gilbuyer?

Actually, if you party pull a mob and you have not once cast anything on anyone since the pull, you can still convert and you won't build any hate.

Yeah, I can vouch for this. But Sabaron, depending on where your camp is, you can still safely convert. I do that 80% of the time (Convert during battle) anytime, anywhere. Just have to know where you are at all times and from experience you will know where the aggro radius of a mob is (Therefore able to not be on the hatelist with converting)

I love being a RDM/WHM. I've had crappy parties where a NIN would only use shihei and ninjutsu is about 100 pts behind current level. Yet no one dies, even if the exp is really slow.

[Icemage]

Re: Plumage of a Gilbuyer?

Regarding Convert:

You really need to learn how to use this. Convert is your lifeline for efficiency. Hundreds of MP for free, with no waiting. In XP party settings, a RDM who knows how to convert without dying is going to greatly outperform a RDM who refuses.

You can certainly Convert before a battle starts... or even after it starts. As long as you aren't on the hate list, you can Convert to your heart's content (though you have to watch out for Crabs, since they do the AoE damage Bubble Shower which can occasionally tear through even Stoneskin if they're close to full HP).

If at any time you think you're in danger of taking AoE damage (or getting hit by a stray attack), cast Stoneskin first. This means you have to start thinking about Convert the moment you dip below 150MP.

"What? 150?? Stoneskin costs 29MP!" you say.

Here's the real reason why I use 150 as my "start thinking about Convert" limit.

Cure IV costs 88MP.
Refresh costs 40MP.
Regen costs 15MP.
Stoneskin costs 29MP.

Generally speaking, you might need to cast Refresh on yourself or someone else as you're preparing to use Convert. Regen on yourself is by far the most efficient healing spell you have available, and Stoneskin is good insurance, so you're already looking at 79MP that you're likely to want.

Now, it's also possible that you will need to cast an emergency cure due to a big WS or series of double/triple attacks or criticals, so the remaining portion of the 150 is reserved for that. It's ok if you don't end up needing it, but the last thing you want to have happen is to have your tank get pummelled while you're Converting and you being too busy to save him.

Bear in mind, you probably are recovering MP via Refresh while casting this, so there's a few extra points of MP to throw around in a pinch too, but it's not a good idea to rely on this.

Also, as /WHM, your Divine Seal timer is exactly the same as your Convert timer. Make use of this by using Divine Seal on yourself before Converting and you'll get maximum efficiency from it (but watch your enmity levels if doing so in battle!).

In extreme cases, such as when you've cast Sleep I/II on a link, it's also a good idea to cast Blink as well as Stoneskin if you plan on Converting in mid-battle to handle a crisis.

If you do things right, you don't ever really have to rest - just cut back on MP spending a bit if you run low. I don't think I ever really rested at all as RDM between level 55 to 75, even keeping up with 5 Refresh/Hastes and main healing plus Dispel duty (but I'm Tarutaru so your mileage may vary a bit as far as how far you can stretch your MP).


Icemage

[Eauijhkuu]

Re: Plumage of a Gilbuyer?

Where's your THF?

[Sabaron]

Re: Plumage of a Gilbuyer?

Where's your THF?

The Party was setup by someone else, but he was high rank (10) and I figured he knew what he was doing.

PUP/MNK, RNG/NIN, DRG/WAR, NIN/WAR, BLM/RDM, RDM/WHM (me)

...Also, as /WHM, your Divine Seal timer is exactly the same as your Convert timer. Make use of this by using Divine Seal on yourself before Converting and you'll get maximum efficiency from it (but watch your enmity levels if doing so in battle!)...

I actually Convert in battle every once in a while already... This is my macro

/ja Convert <me>
/wait 1
/ja "Divine Seal" <me>
/wait 1
/ma "Cure IV" <me>

That does it up in about 5 seconds. I usually try to lead with Stoneskin/Blink combo (b/c I've usually thrown at least 1 thing, e.g. Dia II) and if it's a high damage mob I've thrown Phalanx before.

In this situation, I was completely unprepared for the unannounced Robber Crab and, as I said, after throwing a Cure II and grabbing hate, I was skeptical of whether or not Converting would instantly kill me. It didn't take very long for the tank to die b/c he couldn't get his shadows back up.

I usually start thinking about convert at around 150 as well, but I try to wait until the mob is dead if possible to be safe and I usually throw buffs until I'm nearly empty to get the maximum possible effect since I'm not taru and don't have an extra 150MP to spare. ^^

I often end up with about 1:30 left on my timers when I would like to be converting, so I occasionally have to rest depending on what I'm doing. Usually, the WHM Hastes or I can get BLM or WHM to debuff or share (I hog debuffs for about 3-5 fights after levelling up to keep capped), but if I'm doing Haste/Refresh/Debuff it gets a bit expensive.

[Aeni]

Re: Plumage of a Gilbuyer?

Well, I still think my way is decent for about 70% of camps out there. You don't have to go that far out, since you're already (I HOPE) outside of monster aoe radius. A bit further outside of this is his aggro radius (What an EM undead would aggro you if you didn't have sneak up) and then outside of this is what I call the "ignore list." Basically, everything you do out here, the monster couldn't give a rats ass about. I've done those nice 800+ cures on myself after converting out here with a NIN that's gets really scared because he thinks he's going to lose hate and then when he does, it's not me that the monster is going for (usually those aggressive shorty BLMs)

Been doing this for a while now, and not just for exp. Done this through BCs and even G2. Again, it's tried and true, the only thing limiting is the camp and the spot you're in. Sometimes, you're really pressed for space, in which case I'd pay close attention to what Icemage stated above and use your head.

Not converting is a sin, really, because that's the only real job ability a RDM has outside of his/her Chainspell.

[Likibiki]

Re: Plumage of a Gilbuyer?

Goblins are easier than Crabs, for the most part. Plus it sounds like that you were a bit too low - 200 exp on crabs is more than likely going to be VERY bad exp over time... I forget where else to go - I seem to remember playing with raptors in U-Range but maybe that was later.

Garlaige is fine if the camp's free. Bats are ridiculously squishy and beetles aren't much harder if they don't spam defense boost.

Just... stick it out, I guess. Once you hit 55 you have the choice of AU areas *or* standard areas - plus people tend to get better at their jobs - better gear becomes available (Hauby, Scorpy etc), better WS, better SC and so on.

Most parties have a weak link though - they party so much that they rise in level, but they're not actually any good so all their parties give bad exp. It's just how it goes, and in this case it was the tank.

[Icemage]

Re: Plumage of a Gilbuyer?

This is my macro
/ja Convert <me>
/wait 1
/ja "Divine Seal" <me>
/wait 1
/ma "Cure IV" <me>

That does it up in about 5 seconds. I usually try to lead with Stoneskin/Blink combo (b/c I've usually thrown at least 1 thing, e.g. Dia II) and if it's a high damage mob I've thrown Phalanx before.

If you'll take some advice, I recommend you change your macro to this:

/ja "Divine Seal" <stpc>
/wait 1
/ja "Convert <me>
/wait 1
/ma "Cure IV" <me>
/p {Convert} HP > MP

This change has three effects. First, it lets you opt out if you accidentally hit the wrong macro (due to the <stpc>). Second, it reduces your window of vulnerability by activating Divine Seal before Convert (thus saving you 1 full second where you're in low HP). Remember, Divine Seal only goes away after you cast a spell, so you can activate Convert afterwards and still keep the effect for Cure IV. Lastly, it lets your party know that you're Converting intentionally so they don't accidentally think you just got swatted by a monster for megadamage.

In this situation, I was completely unprepared for the unannounced Robber Crab and, as I said, after throwing a Cure II and grabbing hate, I was skeptical of whether or not Converting would instantly kill me. It didn't take very long for the tank to die b/c he couldn't get his shadows back up.

In these panic-mode situations, this is what you do:

Chainspell
Stoneskin
Blink <- somewhere around here, the Crab should have stopped attacking you
Divine Seal
Convert
Cure IV <- somewhere here the Crab is back on you

At this point, cast Regen on yourself and don't heal yourself any more. You'll lose enmity every time you're attacked. Wait for that Provoke, and just keep up Blink and Stoneskin while casting any other buffs you need - you have 30 seconds of effective invulnerability while your MP holds out, which is basically two Provokes (plenty of time).

I usually start thinking about convert at around 150 as well, but I try to wait until the mob is dead if possible to be safe and I usually throw buffs until I'm nearly empty to get the maximum possible effect since I'm not taru and don't have an extra 150MP to spare. ^^

Late in a fight it's usually quite safe to do even an in-combat Convert. You don't have to wait until it's dead. Just spend yourself down right before you're ready and go to down.

I often end up with about 1:30 left on my timers when I would like to be converting, so I occasionally have to rest depending on what I'm doing. Usually, the WHM Hastes or I can get BLM or WHM to debuff or share (I hog debuffs for about 3-5 fights after levelling up to keep capped), but if I'm doing Haste/Refresh/Debuff it gets a bit expensive.

Remember that with a Ninja tank, they can normally provide their own Blind, Paralyze, and Slow (not in this case, of course, since you got one of those idiot NINs, but they're not that common). If you need to ease up on MP, stick to one attempt each at Slow and Paralyze, and save the rest of your MP for Dispel reserves. Avoid Hasting non-Ninjas unless fighting an enemy with a Slow attack.

Oh, and use Regen. A lot. It has an 8:1 HP to MP ratio, which blows all of your other healing spells out of the water without Divine Seal and a Light Staff as far as efficiency is concerned.


Icemage

[Sabaron]

Re: Plumage of a Gilbuyer?

I did forget to include a line from my Convert macro. ^^ It's:

/p {Convert} Don't freak out! <call14>

which is the first line of the macro (I'll move it down to just before the actual Convert for the <stpc> line).

but I will definitely change the order of the macro and put in the <stpc>.


That Chainspell thing would've worked, but I was literally stunned and unprepared to react. I'll remember in the future, however.

I throw Regen constantly if the WHM is not already doing so. I find most WHMs around my level are quite giddy about their new toy, Regen II.

[Macht]

Re: Plumage of a Gilbuyer?

Don't know if it's just my head playing tricks on me or what, but the stuff I've read here of 120-160 being a good exp camp range sounds wierd. I know those camps are usually easier to fight in, and if you can go fast enough they would be good exp.

Just I've always been use to the 200-210 exp from 50+ parties. In an exceptionally good one I usually level in like 30 min. don't know guess that's just me. Just some reason something under 200exp as being good sounds wierd. Especially when it seems the party can kill things at the 200exp and a little up at just as fast a rate as the 120exp...

Yeah, astral earrings I farm in a different technique. Still love that BCNM 50, if you got the know-how you can always beat that BCNM50 as a lv. 1 job. So doesn't matter if you pick the wrong chest you're just out 50 seals. Refarm them in the promyvions and go again. >.>

1 in 3 chance of winning and loosing is death of a lv. 1 job and lost 50 seals. Doesn't sound that bad of a deal to me.

[Sabaron]

Re: Plumage of a Gilbuyer?

I'm a fan of Treasures & Tribulations as well since a lot of BCNMs end up in failure anyway, it's nice that there's one that I can just go out and do. In fact, I just did one earlier this evening and quite happily came out of it with an Astral Ring and a Kampfer Ring. The worthless Kampfer went to my MNK LS Mate who wanted to try it out and the Astral went promptly on the AH. I forgot to metion earlier that when he was suggesting equipment he also mentioned...


Serket Ring...

5mil on Asura, as something "any" RDM51 should have (again the mention of these items "being cheap now" seems astonishing to me).

[Thott]

Re: Plumage of a Gilbuyer?

Kuftal crabs are easy as nin normally not just at 75... I was able to tank 2 at a time w/o dieing some times when leveling so the nin had to suck >.>;

[Omgwtfbbqkitten]

Re: Plumage of a Gilbuyer?

Its been my opinion that even pre-ToA that some of the 65+ plus players aren't all they think they're cracked up to be.

I go seeking last week on my COR, get invited to PT by a BLU/NIN. I get to "camp" - backing us up against the undersea ruins entrance in front of treants was the leader's idea of a "camp." My buffs end up hitting everyone and I make a bit of a fuss about moving somewhere less cramped.

So we move to camp and I'm able to access the PT setup (they were mostly /anon). BLU, SMN, RNG, COR THF and... MNK. Yeah, turns out that mithra in the gi wasn't a NIN like I thought at first, frickin' /anon.

The BLU pulls -.-; Yeah, not me, the THF or the RNG, the BLU goes out to pull. Without warning no less.

While the PT scrambles on to the colibri, I can see the SMN - apparently being the only one besides myself and the RNG that knows how COR works - scrambling to line up with BLU for Evoker's Roll. Galka SMN at that, so I kinda felt his pain already.

BLU just keeps dancing around the mob, making me drop Evoker's Roll and Healer's Roll on just about everyone when I just need the latter on the SMN. All the while our "tank" is getting the tar kicked out of her and hate starts bouncing.

This goes on for maybe three fights. I take the P Charm off, put the Chocobo Whistle on and call forth my noble steed and ride back to Whitegate.

Got some angry tells from the BLU and sympathetic ones from the RNG. The PT broke shortly after.

Dunno what it is about people when they see a job with Refresh... but I can practically sense their desparation these days. Inviting any "refresher" is pointless if you refuse to work with them.

Anyway just something to add to all the convert talk: Even if you are on the hate list of the mob, there's a way to Convert/DS/Cure IV with no hate - just sprint about twelve paces away from the "mage line" and the mob won't pick up on it. It was something I learned in my early BST days that paid off later for RDM (well, before I quit RDM anyway)

[Sabaron]

Re: Plumage of a Gilbuyer?

there's a way to Convert/DS/Cure IV with no hate - just sprint about twelve paces away from the "mage line" and the mob won't pick up on it. It was something I learned in my early BST days that paid off later for RDM (well, before I quit RDM anyway)

I just used this technique today while helping an LS mate with PLD AF in Davoi. I used it 3 times, even--didn't draw even a glance from the NMs.