new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

[Caspian]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

Ok, seriously.
Is it necessary to continually put a post on every page of a thread reminding people to argue intelligently and not flame in a vain attempt to win an arguement? All insulting someone does is piss them off and cause them to insult you back. This is what we in the technical community call a 'vicious cycle'.
I think the majority of the members of this forum are considered adults by our governments, lets act like it. Debating is a healthy way of coming to new ideas and seeing other's points of view. Bickering and insulting one another only serves to decrease the collective intelligence of all those involved. Now, lets all start acting a little more mature and discuss this civilly.

[Legal Fish]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

My point is that if you don't know what you are talking about, then don't talk about it. Its very hard to say this without... saying it.

[Murphie]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

Honestly, if your only recourse is to call the other side "stupid" then you've kind of already lost the debate.

To add a bit more, because there's no sense in my just posting one liners either...

As much as you think that Dak and Task and all of the rest of us here at FFXIO are completely wrong because we don't think that what you think is important is really all that important, doesn't mean that we're wrong. We all pay to play the game. Same as you. Just because you think that your issues are more important doesn't necessarily make that so. We aren't idiots for disagreeing with you.

[Legal Fish]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

As much as you think that Dak and Task and all of the rest of us here at FFXIO are completely wrong because we don't think that what you think is important is really all that important, doesn't mean that we're wrong.

Nice, put words in my mouth. There are plenty of posters who here who understand exactly what I'm saying. And you haven't been reading at all if you think calling people stupid is my arguement. I've already said all that needed to be said, now there are people who disagree, but those who do, have no experience. There is nothing left to do now, but to show how easily they can be discredited.

PS. I'll promise to be more civil, no matter how foolish the opposite side gets.

[Murphie]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

You keep saying that what we think is important doesn't matter and that what you think is important does. I'm not sure what else I could possibly infer from that.

And I didn't say that you were calling people stupid.

[Taskmage]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

Alright, I'll bite. What is it specifically about my mentality that is going to cause the game to continue to drop in population? Perhaps more to the point, what specific points have you made that you think I fail to acknowledge or understand?

[Murphie]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

I know it doesn't matter, but I think your points have been well thought out and well intentioned, Task. But what do I know? I've only been playing this game for three years.

[Taskmage]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

I was addressing Legal Fish, but thank you.

[Legal Fish]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

Its sort of a cycle. People at 75 quit because there its too exclusive and/or not rewarding enough, making it appear there are more low-levels causing them to ignore the end-game further, then those players who once made the game look low-level focus hit the end-game they quit making the game look low-level focused, and so on. However this isnt' the case with FFXI (yet). You mentallity supports this.

Either way all that needed to be said, has been said.

Oh, complimenting people who agree with you doesn't make you look right.

Is there any points I've missed? Because you arguement is that there are too few 75s to matter, which I've already addressed. And the fact SE does focus on the end-game, look at this whole expansion and the end of CoP.

[Murphie]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

His point wasn't that there are too few 75s to matter, but rather that there are still more people in the levels prior to 75 than at 75, no matter what you may believe to the contrary. Even if people weren't quitting en masse as you claim, there still wouldn't be more 75s than every other level.

SE does focus on the endgame from time to time. ToAU is clear indication of that. But that doesn't mean that endgame players are the only ones who matter, or the only ones who have valid questions or concerns about the game.

[Legal Fish]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

Level 10 to 70 have enough content to surfice them. They could use more insentive to do EFs and Garrions, but they are otherwise just fine. This isn't the case for 75s, despite SE focuses on it. You guys need to wrap your head around fact this isn't the amount of content, but what the content is.

[Murphie]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

Just as much as you need to wrap your head around the fact that the folks that are 10-70 are still allowed to want more content, because obtaining level 70+ doesn't mean that you automatically have more say.

I sympathise with the folks who are dissatisfied with endgame, but those people are never going to be happy anyway. Sure, you can pacify them for a bit, but they will just tear through any new endgame content that is added and then go back to complaining that there is nothing to do in very short order.

I also agree that the drop disparity in regard to gods and such is really something that SE needs to look at, but I don't think it's the most important or only item of importance that they should be worried about.

[Legal Fish]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

Have you've been reading? The problem is that people can't ripe through anything. Where did I say low/med-levels can't get new content? They don't need to nearly as much content as the end-game needs now. And yes, its probably the biggest or second biggest issue with the game atm, only behind RMT. You can count the games problems with one hand. Adding content for low levels usually gets ignored, fixing older content would be better... like Garrison and EFs.

What has any of this have to do with making Kings more welcoming to people just hitting 75 now and people who have been 75 for years.

[Murphie]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

Have you've been reading? The problem is that people can't ripe through anything.

I have no idea what that bolded sentence means. Please explain.

I read over at BG. I know what you people are angry about. I know what the problems, percieved or otherwise, are at endgame. I just happen to think that they aren't as big a deal as some folks do. That's the magic of individual points of view.

Where did I say low/med-levels can't get new content? They don't need to nearly as much content as the end-game needs now. And yes, its probably the biggest or second biggest issue with the game atm, only behind RMT. You can count the games problems with one hand. Adding content for low levels usually gets ignored, fixing older content would be better... like Garrison and EFs.

What has any of this have to do with making Kings more welcoming to people just hitting 75 now and people who have been 75 for years.

Who said that you said that low/medium levels can't get new content? The point is that those folks have as much importance to SE as you endgame folks do. So just because there are a lot of people who think that their issues and concerns don't matter doesn't make it so.

You might think that endgame kings are the second biggest issue in the game after RMT, but I doubt you'll find a lot of folks that agree with you outside of BG. I'm sure that wouldn't surprise you, but it's not for the reasons that you might think it is.

"Fixing" endgame content is obviously something that SE needs to worry about. But it's not the only thing, and it's not necessarily even the most important thing.

[Legal Fish]

Re: new SE interview by Bercus over on BG

Then what is? What is much more important than a non-exclusive end-game? What do low/med-levels need so bad that can take importance over kings? I hope you don't say job balance, because that effects the end-game more than anything else.