Hey guys, it's easier to MPK now!

[Aeolus]

Re: Hey guys, it's easier to MPK now!

Ok, one more time

THIS COULD HAPPEN BEFORE THE UPDATE

What happens *now* (and the OP made no mention of who had claim after dia) is that the mob that was slept, went unclaimed and then dia'd will stay yellow. This means you have the ability to fight back, something you could NOT do pre update.

I have seen this situation before the update and I have seen it after the update. When you 'claim' with sleep, you lose claim shortly after you disengage from the mob. Pre update, post update, same thing. When it goes unclaimed anyone is free to do anything they want to it. But NOW when someone from a different party engages it, the mob will stay yellow until they draw more hate then you caused. Subsequently you can fight with them and try to build more hate to fully claim the mob on you or let them go at it to get hate and claim.

This part of the system works. This method of MPK is NOT NEW. It has been around forever. And the ONLY changes made to this situation is the fact that the mob will not go claimed when the second party casts dia on it.

Though I will agree with one thing you said, it can be hard getting a simple point across...

So how come people in sky are complaining more about the new system when they have had to deal with gilsellers trying to mpk them before and after.

[Ziero]

Re: Hey guys, it's easier to MPK now!

Because people will *always* complain about being MPK'd

But before it was much easier to MPK as all you had to do was drag a ton of highly aggressive mobs to a camp and die/warp/hide ect right on top of another party. It could be done by anyone, with anything aggresive or linking at any time. This method is one of the *last* ways to MPK and as such it's becoming more and more of a focus because other methods no longer exist.

It's a highly situational method at worst. They can't force you to get links anymore like they could back then, outside of that one NM that pops detecors or something. It's far more difficult to use outside of sky as well and for the most part can be dealth with by a decent, semi compitent exp pt if it does happen. Random people can't just force you to fight an unsleepable link now, but pre update that was *very* common.

MPK can *never* be fully eradicated from this game unless SE does a massive overhaul of the aggro system completely changing the game and mutating it into something they don't want it to be. But they can, and do, try to prevent it from happening without throwing the system off any more then they've done so already.

[Aeolus]

Re: Hey guys, it's easier to MPK now!

Because people will *always* complain about being MPK'd

But before it was much easier to MPK as all you had to do was drag a ton of highly aggressive mobs to a camp and die/warp/hide ect right on top of another party. It could be done by anyone, with anything aggresive or linking at any time. This method is one of the *last* ways to MPK and as such it's becoming more and more of a focus because other methods no longer exist.

You couldnt do this before. Mobs dissapeared when you died, used hide. Are you talking about like a year ago?

[Ziero]

Re: Hey guys, it's easier to MPK now!

You couldnt do this before. Mobs dissapeared when you died, used hide. Are you talking about like a year ago?

Before the big anti-mpk update mobs would stick around and aggro who ever was there. That's gone now.

But during that time, when you slept a mob and changed target it would go unclaimed. Then someone could run up, dia the mob, get claim and watch as it beat the hell out of the person who slept it because sleep causes more hate then dia. This was a very common accidental MPK method in high lvl, high traffic exp areas where people would fight for pulls and often sleep mobs near their camps for better chaining.

example: Some joe-schmo thf goes out and chucks a boomerang at an unclaimed dhamel sitting near a rival exp pt's camp hitting it for crap dmg and getting claim. But the Dhamel would then kill the Brd, who was pulling mobs then sleeping them near his camp so they could chain it easy. The thf couldn't do anything but sit and watch as the Dhamel he had claim on killed the Brd's pt because they couldn't engage the claimed mob.

*THIS* was changed with the new claim system.

Now if you sleep a mob and change target it still goes unclaimed. And if someone runs up and dia's it the mob *stays* unclaimed. Though it can not be reslept you can still fight back. You could *not* before the claim system was adjusted. If two people engage the same mob it will stay unclaimed until someone creates a larger pull of hate. I've done this myself many times, where I'd fight for a kill while farming because someone attacked something I just started fighting.

Sadly this method of 'mpk' has no simple fix. I'm sure SE realizes this or they would have done so already. I know I haven't heard of any great ideas to combat this situation, the best one so far was the dispel/erase on mobs debuffs idea and even that has it's flaws.

The best thing I can think of is to have someone in your pt use voke/debufs/non dmg attacks on the slept mob to prevent the initial loss of claim. Seeing as this MPK method can only occur if your Pt gets a link of it's own accord it's not something that will happen at every camp. And seeing how it's even rare to have someone actually try to MPK you like this, outside of sky at least, it again becomes a very rare occurance.

[Aeni]

Re: Hey guys, it's easier to MPK now!

Sadly this method of 'mpk' has no simple fix. I'm sure SE realizes this or they would have done so already. I know I haven't heard of any great ideas to combat this situation, the best one so far was the dispel/erase on mobs debuffs idea and even that has it's flaws.

The best thing I can think of is to have someone in your pt use voke/debufs/non dmg attacks on the slept mob to prevent the initial loss of claim. Seeing as this MPK method can only occur if your Pt gets a link of it's own accord it's not something that will happen at every camp. And seeing how it's even rare to have someone actually try to MPK you like this, outside of sky at least, it again becomes a very rare occurance.

No, here's a thought.

If you engage in BRD pulling and sleeping mobs to chain, that is your own risk. You...

1. Acknowledged this risk engaging in this behavior.
2. You take the risk in exchange for the potential rewards (which is a lot)
3. You hereby waive all right to complain about the system being broken when you yourself are engaging in a way that the developer did not intend for the game to function. Thus, you put your party in grave risk if your behavior do not bear fruition as planned.

Same goes with sleeping add/links/aggro at NM camps. If you're going to "claim" monsters, then you ought to make sure the monsters remained "claimed" which usually means that the party member making the initial claim should not engage another monster or disengage from the claimed monsters. This is the only known way the system works effectively in this manner.

[Ziero]

Re: Hey guys, it's easier to MPK now!

No, here's a thought.

If you engage in BRD pulling and sleeping mobs to chain, that is your own risk. You...

1. Acknowledged this risk engaging in this behavior.
2. You take the risk in exchange for the potential rewards (which is a lot)
3. You hereby waive all right to complain about the system being broken when you yourself are engaging in a way that the developer did not intend for the game to function. Thus, you put your party in grave risk if your behavior do not bear fruition as planned.

Same goes with sleeping add/links/aggro at NM camps. If you're going to "claim" monsters, then you ought to make sure the monsters remained "claimed" which usually means that the party member making the initial claim should not engage another monster or disengage from the claimed monsters. This is the only known way the system works effectively in this manner.

....ummm

I can't tell if you're agreeing with me or disagreeing with me in that post. I'm saying that this part of the anti-mpk thing works as it should. I also said the best way to hold claim is to have people from your pt actively use non dmg abilities on it. I never said it *needed* fixing nor that it should be fixed. I just said that there's no easy way to make one without screwin up the entire game.

I also said this method of MPK has been in existance for a long time only now you can actually fight back as opposed to pre update.

O.o

[Aeni]

Re: Hey guys, it's easier to MPK now!

I can't tell if you're agreeing with me or disagreeing with me in that post.

I'm sorry if I wasn't clear in that quote, but I wanted to illuminate what you typed so that everyone can see it. I'm in basic agreement but basically took it a step further and placing the blame on the initial claimer. In this case it's a BRD sleeping mobs to accrue exp. In another case, it's because level 75 players can't be "bothered" with active adds/links. In both cases, it's not SE's fault for what happened.