Greivances with "The List"

[Spinnthrift]

Re: Greivances with "The List"

Yes - on bats, we have our heyday... but... those parties are few and far between. Sure - I can pop out a 700 damage Viper Bite on Roc before level 50, but when parties level on crabs and even with top rate gear (enough that I've been accused of being a gil buyer - until others have said no.. we know him and a lot of his gear is pure R/E Thf gear) - I can still put out only single figures on them.. the invite rate plummets.

Most parties can function with 5. Hell - if you've actually researched your RMT parties - then you'd know most chain T/VT mobs - which you can do easily with three people.

And no - you haven't the faintest idea about me. Of my GM calls in the 50's, 2 have been from being stuck, 1 has been from MPK because a pair of BST's decided that they wanted the camp we'd been at for two hours - and decided dropping bombs on us was acceptable behavior, and the rest... RMT Bots.

Would I trust some random stranger who told me to get out of my party or he'd put me on his list of harassment? Hell no. Not a chance. Not reliable information. And no.. while I'm exp'ing I'm not going to look up some history on a list of people and prove that information to myself that could easily be flawed.

You may not like what I'm saying, but it's true - it's a list of harassment when you come to bystanders. Actual RMT - fine, no problems there. RMT associates who get them Sky/Sea/Kings/etc.. fine. There are people who I won't help because I know what they've done. Would I trust some random stranger threatening me in tells because I'm exp'ing? Sounds like a grudge to me. Sounds like harassment and behavior that is basically bullying.

You want to tell me I have a bad attitude, that's fine. My LS and friends know that I don't tolerate RMT or gilbuying, and won't aid them. You telling me out of the blue and threatening me - sounds more like harassment than someone saying to me:

Hey Sae, those guys you're with are RMT... letting you know for future reference. I can show you the screenies later if you want to see.

That I might pay attention to, but you telling me to get out there and then and threatening me with expulsion from your league of righteousness is pretty much bs. Think about it...

[Mog]

Re: Greivances with "The List"

It's amazing how this thread has lasted this long....amazing.

I hate gilsellers as much as the next guy. Unless you have concrete evidence that they're gilsellers, there's not much you can do or present to a GM if you ever make a call. They will always have third party programs and they will always exist. Accept it, people!

[Lyceius]

Re: Greivances with "The List"

It's amazing how this thread has lasted this long....amazing.

I hate gilsellers as much as the next guy. Unless you have concrete evidence that they're gilsellers, there's not much you can do or present to a GM if you ever make a call. They will always have third party programs and they will always exist. Accept it, people!

2 opposeing sides of one argument where both sides feel strongly in their side. I could go on forever

[DakAttack]

Re: Greivances with "The List"

A three strike rule sounds amenable, but would they be listed on their third strike, or on their first with only one strike listed next to them? I could see it going either way, though listing people on their third strike would probably be more respectful.

[Lyceius]

Re: Greivances with "The List"

A three strike rule sounds amenable, but would they be listed on their third strike, or on their first with only one strike listed next to them? I could see it going either way, though listing people on their third strike would probably be more respectful.

I can agree with the Listing on the Thrid strike as long as the evidence is there for all 3 strikes

[Kailea]

Re: Greivances with "The List"

I'm just glad you'll never procreate.

that was so not called for....you dont know me at all, an this is a very rude statment........

anyway...

I could go on forever too.... the list has is "good" intentions... but really, all the list has done is... well caouse this :p

anyone you list "helping" gil sellers, are inociet , so RD's claim is wrong, also if you want to get technical, everyone is helping gilsellers in one way or another...

you buy from AH
you PT with anybody
you sell stuff in AH
you sell stuff in Bazzar
you buy stuff in Bazzar

all this in one way or another helps gilsellers/buys

so really you need to place everyone on your server on this list... oh wait.... now your server is dead, wayto go there ^.^

[Mog]

Re: Greivances with "The List"

anyone you list "helping" gil sellers, are inociet , so RD's claim is wrong, also if you want to get technical, everyone is helping gilsellers in one way or another...

you buy from AH
you PT with anybody
you sell stuff in AH
you sell stuff in Bazzar
you buy stuff in Bazzar

all this in one way or another helps gilsellers/buys

I couldn't agree more. While unintentionally, everyone ends up helping gilsellers in one form or another.

What you're doing by listing these people is giving innocent people a bad name. Some of the people (probably most of them) could have partied with gilsellers intentionally, or nonintentionally, myself included! Who are we to judge to say that they're terrible people for partying with gilsellers, when they have not broken the contract?

...so in order to keep people's names from going bad, it would be in your best interest to delete the list of people who party with gilsellers.

[Lyceius]

Re: Greivances with "The List"

I can't agree more. While unintentionally, everyone ends up helping gilsellers in one form or another.

What you're doing by listing these people is giving innocent people a bad name. Some of the people (probably most of them) could have partied with gilsellers intentionally, or nonintentionally, myself included! Who are we to judge to say that they're terrible people for partying with gilsellers, when they have not broken the contract?

...so in order to keep people's names from going bad, it would be in your best interest to delete the list of people who party with gilsellers.

Thats my feelings in a nutshell as well. but I dont think we will get exactly what we want so im willing to make a comprimise to try to restore peace to this community

[Kailea]

Re: Greivances with "The List"

yeah the list of Gilseller... I guess can stay -.- but really, what will stop him from just takeing the "help gilseller" list and mergeing it with the "gilseller" list....and just lumping everyone togeather,.........

I was acused of beign a gilseller just because I was in upper DT as my DRG/THF, with a friend of mine who was WHM/THF...... I mean really, when will this all stop -.-

[Mog]

Re: Greivances with "The List"

I mean really, when will this all stop -.-

When FF11 shuts down, permanantly.

[Lyceius]

Re: Greivances with "The List"

unfortuneatly never. There will always be something like this when there are people who will take justice into thier own hands.

[DakAttack]

Re: Greivances with "The List"

I was acused of beign a gilseller just because I was in upper DT as my DRG/THF, with a friend of mine who was WHM/THF...... I mean really, when will this all stop -.-

On Seraph all the gil sellers were Elvaan, had the same face and hair, and all wore full Dragoon AF with almost completely matching equipment. They also all had names generated by the game from the create character screen.

[Lyceius]

Re: Greivances with "The List"

well i can say on leviathan the sellers are of all races. I have seen humes mithras galkas the only race I havent seen was taru........ Makes me feel a bit better really cause Im taru

[Icemage]

Re: Greivances with "The List"

Ok folks, this topic has run its course after 31 pages.

I've read the entirety of this thread, and I see no change in attitude and no switching of sides; at this point I consider further discussion pointless.

The existence of the List is, at this time, still officially sanctioned. Please do not bombard PiNG or AKosygin with any more messages. This issue is already under active discussion in the staff forums, and we are and have been taking action where it is warrented.

As such, I am closing this thread, and opening a related thread regarding the uses, abuses, and reasoning behind the use of blacklists here:

http://www.ffxionline.com/forums/gen...ist.drama.html

If you would still like to discuss this topic in general, please post your thoughts there.

Some advice for our forum members in general:

If you are not on the Seraph server, please curtail your criticism of The List. It does not affect you or your playing experience in any way, and unless you are on the server and able to judge the veracity of the claims made, then I ask that you refrain from making blanket assumptions in any case. I understand that many of you feel that you have valid points to make, but, given the reactions shown in this thread, there is no profit to be made in bringing those issues up. As can be seen from this thread, parties from both sides refuse to be swayed in either direction, so save your typing fingers and let's have a little peace, shall we?

If you are a player from Seraph and have issues with The List, please PM myself or another member of the staff here with your situation and we will bring any evidence into consideration during our staff discussions surrounding this thread.

If you have issues with my closure of this thread, please PM me.


Icemage

FFXI Forum Super Moderator