What's your pet peeve in FFXI?

[KingOfZeal]

Re: What's your pet peeve in FFXI?

That's easy, Feba. I even have a picture which clearly illustrates the process...

[Kailea]

Re: What's your pet peeve in FFXI?

Ok, Ok, we all agree that Galka don't have penises.
As for a real question, how do tarus procreate?
I've personally never thought it was very different, but it seems people don't like the idea of tarus doing that...

its common knowledge.... they use magic ;p
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That's easy, Feba. I even have a picture which clearly illustrates the process...

.....hahahaha!

[Akashimo]

Re: What's your pet peeve in FFXI?

Lol, best pic involving tarus to date XD
<_<; As for mithra statement, look up any untranslated FFXI doujins out there involving mithras to answer the question

[Auron517]

Re: What's your pet peeve in FFXI?

I thought when I logged last night we had agreed to disagree, but I see arguing for the sake of argument is something that you guys don't mind doing.

{Found it!} => https://secure.playonline.com/polapp...6polg_loc%3Den
There you have it, from the developers.

I won't argue the penis issue anymore, we've already agreed that we, as players, will never know either way. However, the gender issue is different. It doesn't matter what POL says; Galka are NOT asexual.

I wouldn't be a Galka male in game if it only mattered towards the subject of marriage. Even so, clearly only accepting Galkas as the groom during a wedding is already creating a bias towards their gender. If Galka were really asexual, what would it matter if they were considered a "wife" seeing as they have no gender?

The only thing that's clear is that fact that SE wants to state "Galkas are asexual" but when it comes to actual play in game, they want to say "Well, Galkas are considered male".

How does that work if they don't have a gender in the first place?

Auron has either never really looked at his character or has never worn a subligar.
Ignoring that fact that SE states they are genderless, as a taru I can attest 100% that they either do not have penii or if they do it is infinitesimaly small. Take your pick. Personally if those were my choices I'd state that I do not have a penis. It's one thing to walk around and state that you're male despite not having having a penis, but it's quite another to walk around stating 'Look at how big my hands are' when you're packing something that small.

What do subligars prove? They are nothing more than a pair of iron briefs. You can't see any evidence of a penis when a Hume, Elvaan, or Tarutaru wears them...why is it different with Galka?

Also, I hope the irony of a Tarutaru accusing anyone of having a small penis is within your grasp.

Your arguments are far too convenient. If you use real life elements to support Auron's view point, it's reasoning and logic. If you use real life elements to argue the counter point, you're ignoring the fantasy aspect of the game.
Apparently, what's good for the goose is not good for the gander.
goose... gander... debate on genders... geddit!?!

I don't agree. When you started FFXI, I gather you assumed that the characters had five fingers on each hand, a heart, two lungs, a central nervous system, that they breathed oxygen...That was based on your real life expectances.

No one will argue that it's unrealistic for a bunny rabbit in Uleguerand Range to take down a full armoured Paladin, because it's a fantasy game. But when it comes to a mammal that just happends to reincarnate itself, you guys want to get technical. That is what I meant by my fantasy=/=real life statements.

Anywho, are we done with this senseless disagreement?

[Armando]

Re: What's your pet peeve in FFXI?

We've been over this. While they may not be male biologically, they're very clearly masculine. It's possible to be masculine without being male. And it's just convenient. No one wants to see a Galka in a dress, that's just creepy. No one wants to see a Galka and another guy kiss, that's even creepier. And given S-E's anti-gay-marriage policy, it'd be rather inconvenient to allow something as muscular, rugged, and hairy as a Galka to marry a guy. Sure, technically it's not gay, but it's close enough.

[Necropolis]

Re: What's your pet peeve in FFXI?

I thought when I logged last night we had agreed to disagree, but I see arguing for the sake of argument is something that you guys don't mind doing.



I won't argue the penis issue anymore, we've already agreed that we, as players, will never know either way. However, the gender issue is different. It doesn't matter what POL says; Galka are NOT asexual.

I wouldn't be a Galka male in game if it only mattered towards the subject of marriage. Even so, clearly only accepting Galkas as the groom during a wedding is already creating a bias towards their gender. If Galka were really asexual, what would it matter if they were considered a "wife" seeing as they have no gender?

The only thing that's clear is that fact that SE wants to state "Galkas are asexual" but when it comes to actual play in game, they want to say "Well, Galkas are considered male".

How does that work if they don't have a gender in the first place?

Well part of that I'm sure is just programing. Every race, face type and such has parameters in the game, one of them being gender. Gender in the game denotes thier RSE options and some armor pieces. So SE had the choice to create a whole new gender type for Galka or choose one of the existing choices (male or female). Personally I don't think I'd take the time to create a whole new system and some hybrid of the female/male symbols for 1 of the 8 race/sex options available.

SE states they do not have gender; but that does not imply that they do not have male characteristics. This would explain why they are considered to be male. Asexual animals in nature can exhibit male or female characteristics, why not in Vana'diel?

"Gender", in common usage, refers to the differences between men and women. Encyclopaedia Britannica notes that gender identity is "an individual's self-conception as being male or female, as distinguished from actual biological sex."[1] Although "gender" is commonly used interchangeably with "sex," within the academic fields of cultural studies, gender studies and the social sciences in general, the term "gender" often refers to purely social rather than biological differences. Some view gender as a social construction rather than a biological phenomenon

Gender does not always represent physical characteristics, but can imply how that species acts in a social construction. To really debate that you'd have to travel back in Vana'diel time to see if the Galka civilization before encounters humes and other creatures with with two distinct sexes. Then grab one of the Galkas and ask weather they are male or female. My bet would be that they wouldn't understand that concept since they had no encounter with other species at the time. They would merely state they are Galka, and Galka in and off itself would be their gender. Once they began encountering the other species of Vana'diel, they probably began to carry more masculine traits and identified with the male genders as themselves.

On a side note, did or do Galka have romantic relationships within their own species; or was the concept of love foreign to them before encountering humes? If the did indeed have romantic relationships I think that would support more the claim that they are non-sexual, otherwise they'd all be gay >.>; Perhaps I'll spend some time in Bastok and find me a Galka couple.

[Auron517]

Re: What's your pet peeve in FFXI?

We've been over this. While they may not be male biologically, they're very clearly masculine. It's possible to be masculine without being male. And it's just convenient. No one wants to see a Galka in a dress, that's just creepy. No one wants to see a Galka and another guy kiss, that's even creepier. And given S-E's anti-gay-marriage policy, it'd be rather inconvenient to allow something as muscular, rugged, and hairy as a Galka to marry a guy. Sure, technically it's not gay, but it's close enough.

There are very feminine males and masculine women; while we make the observation that "hey, that guy's acting like a girl" that doesn't change their gender.

Galkas are big and strong. That's a trait that some women have the capability of possesing. So if that doesn't make them any less female, why does it make Galka any less "asexual" as they're presumed to be?

Creepiness is also in the eye of the beholder. It may be creepy for you to see a Galka in a wedding dress, but for others it doesn't matter at all. Two guys kissing might make you crindge, but for other people it is just the opposite.

Sure, if SE wants to restrict Galkas to male in game for the purpose of comfort, that's fine, but don't try to say that Galka are asexual when the game is clearly otherwise.
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Well part of that I'm sure is just programing. Every race, face type and such has parameters in the game, one of them being gender. Gender in the game denotes thier RSE options and some armor pieces. So SE had the choice to create a whole new gender type for Galka or choose one of the existing choices (male or female). Personally I don't think I'd take the time to create a whole new system and some hybrid of the female/male symbols for 1 of the 8 race/sex options available.
SE states they do not have gender; but that does not imply that they do not have male characteristics. This would explain why they are considered to be male. Asexual animals in nature can exhibit male or female characteristics, why not in Vana'diel?
Gender does not always represent physical characteristics, but can imply how that species acts in a social construction. To really debate that you'd have to travel back in Vana'diel time to see if the Galka civilization before encounters humes and other creatures with with two distinct sexes. Then grab one of the Galkas and ask weather they are male or female. My bet would be that they wouldn't understand that concept since they had no encounter with other species at the time. They would merely state they are Galka, and Galka in and off itself would be their gender. Once they began encountering the other species of Vana'diel, they probably began to carry more masculine traits and identified with the male genders as themselves.
On a side note, did or do Galka have romantic relationships within their own species; or was the concept of love foreign to them before encountering humes? If the did indeed have romantic relationships I think that would support more the claim that they are non-sexual, otherwise they'd all be gay >.>; Perhaps I'll spend some time in Bastok and find me a Galka couple.

RSE armor is first restricted by race, then male/female. It wouldn't be hard for Galka RSE to just say "Galka" instead of having the male sign at the end. It wouldn't change a thing.

I never said Galka didn't have male characteristics. Lots of female bodybuilders and lesbians have masculine characteristics, that doesn't change that they are female.

An asexual animal that has female or male characteristics doens't make them any less asexual.

As for the whole Galka relationship thing before the fall of Zepwell, I have no idea. That's yet another unanswered question.

[Armando]

Re: What's your pet peeve in FFXI?

Galkas are big and strong. That's a trait that some women have the capability of possesing. So if that doesn't make them any less female, why does it make Galka any less "asexual" as they're presumed to be?

It doesn't make them any less female, but it does make them less feminine.

Creepiness is also in the eye of the beholder. It may be creepy for you to see a Galka in a wedding dress, but for others it doesn't matter at all. Two guys kissing might make you crindge, but for other people it is just the opposite.

Except you know very well most people wouldn't find a Galka in a dress aesthetically pleasing. I'd also wager that while the number of people that find man-on-man action is a lot higher than the number of people that dislike seeing men in frilly dresses, it's still smaller than the number of people that dislike man-on-man action.

Sure, if SE wants to restrict Galkas to male in game for the purpose of comfort, that's fine, but don't try to say that Galka are asexual when the game is clearly otherwise.

Except what SE says takes precedence over what the game says. If the game tells you that Defense also increases your max HP and SE tells you Defense has nothing to do with HP, who do you think is right?

The game also says Shell adds Magic Defense, which is wrong because it has nothing to do with Magic Defense Bonus, unless Magic Defense is what SE calls "Magic Damage Taken -X%."

[Auron517]

Re: What's your pet peeve in FFXI?

It doesn't make them any less female, but it does make them less feminine.

Of course, it makes them less feminine, but at the same time, not negating their natural femininity.

[Armando]

Re: What's your pet peeve in FFXI?

Exactly. So a Galka being masculine doesn't negate its lack of biological gender.

[Necropolis]

Re: What's your pet peeve in FFXI?

Since we have no creature on Earth that reproduces through reincarnation, we can't make parallel observations. However we know that Galka come from somewhere other than sex. That would imply that they reproduce through some means by themselves. Therefore we denote it as asexual.

You are applying the word gender as if it was sex. If I ask your sex you would state male; however that does not make your gender male.

We can see this very clearly in present day civilization, people feel that they are the opposite of thier biological factors. And some people go so far to have thier physical sex changed to match that of thier mental image.

Observing gay relationships you'll see that many 'couples' of that type have one that plays a feminine role while the other plays male. There sex is the same, but their gender by social interaction is different.

Considering FFXI is a foreign game, and translated from another language, the people translating it used the more formal definition of the words. No where in FFXI does is say Sex: Male; it states Gender: Male which doesn't always represent biological physique.

[Auron517]

Re: What's your pet peeve in FFXI?

Except you know very well most people wouldn't find a Galka in a dress aesthetically pleasing. I'd also wager that while the number of people that find man-on-man action is a lot higher than the number of people that dislike seeing men in frilly dresses, it's still smaller than the number of people that dislike man-on-man action.Except what SE says takes precedence over what the game says. If the game tells you that Defense also increases your max HP and SE tells you Defense has nothing to do with HP, who do you think is right?
The game also says Shell adds Magic Defense, which is wrong because it has nothing to do with Magic Defense Bonus, unless Magic Defense is what SE calls "Magic Damage Taken -X%."

I see what you're saying, but it doesn't make a difference. Just because a majority of people wouldn't rather see it, if Galkas are truly asexual, what's the big deal? You want to say that Galka are genderless, but you're using masculinity to say that them being in a dress is unpleasing.

If a masculine female puts on a dress, it's just a masculine female in a dress, although it might look kinda funny.

Towards the last part, SE says Galka have no gender, but they choose to limit them to males in the game. Which makes them male, ffs. If they weren't male, it wouldn't make a difference if they married a man.

If you find Galka sexually unpleasing, it shouldn't be anything other than a man wedding with some really ugly chick.

Exactly. So a Galka being masculine doesn't negate its lack of biological gender.

You missed where I already AGREED with this point. However, SE is determined to put them as males in game. If this weren't the case, I would agree what Galka are asexual <.<;

Since we have no creature on Earth that reproduces through reincarnation, we can't make parallel observations. However we know that Galka come from somewhere other than sex. That would imply that they reproduce through some means by themselves. Therefore we denote it as asexual.
You are applying the word gender as if it was sex. If I ask your sex you would state male; however that does not make your gender male.
We can see this very clearly in present day civilization, people feel that they are the opposite of thier biological factors. And some people go so far to have thier physical sex changed to match that of thier mental image.
Observing gay relationships you'll see that many 'couples' of that type have one that plays a feminine role while the other plays male. There sex is the same, but their gender by social interaction is different.
Considering FFXI is a foreign game, and translated from another language, the people translating it used the more formal definition of the words. No where in FFXI does is say Sex: Male; it states Gender: Male which doesn't always represent biological physique.

That's fine and well. But you're using some people to classify all people. Despite their mental image, they are clearly either male/female. It doesn't change until they get it physically changed.

I would agree with you guys that Galkas are asexual, but they are not treated as such in the story, therefore they are male until SE changes this.

Once more, CAN WE PLEASE STOP ARGUING THIS? We obviously aren't breaking ground on our respective opinions, and we keep saying the same thing over and over. Why don't we just agree to disagree on the subject and go on our way, which I tried to do Two Pages ago, seriously.

[Necropolis]

Re: What's your pet peeve in FFXI?

We're no longer arguing penii of Galka from 2 pages ago; we've all seen that they clearly do not have one.

However, you're confusing gender with sex. Sex is physical, while gender is solely mental. Common usage blends these two together, but gender has nothing to do with thier physical details. A person with a penis can have a gender of female while having a sex of male. That's all I'm stating.

[Taskmage]

Re: What's your pet peeve in FFXI?

Once more, CAN WE PLEASE STOP ARGUING THIS? We obviously aren't breaking ground on our respective opinions, and we keep saying the same thing over and over. Why don't we just agree to disagree on the subject and go on our way, which I tried to do Two Pages ago, seriously.

lol I agree. You should stop arguing this. The rest of us are all in agreement. XD

[Auron517]

Re: What's your pet peeve in FFXI?

We're no longer arguing penii of Galka from 2 pages ago; we've all seen that they clearly do not have one.
However, you're confusing gender with sex. Sex is physical, while gender is solely mental. Common usage blends these two together, but gender has nothing to do with thier physical details. A person with a penis can have a gender of female while having a sex of male. That's all I'm stating.

You decided that, not all of us agreed <.<; I don't agree with the sex and gender deal, but I honestly don't care.

You're obvious intent to keep pushing non-issues to have the last word in this stupid discussion, so go ahead and reply to this post, I really don't give a fuck.
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lol I agree. You should stop arguing this. The rest of us are all in agreement. XD

I don't care that you all are in agreement, being the majority that agrees with each other, doesn't make your assumptions correct, much less any greater than mine.