Blind Invites: Why are they so bad?

[Gyfford]

Re: Blind Invites: Why are they so bad?

I'll admit tho. As much as I hate it sometimes... other times when my blm gets a blind invite, I'll sit there... then I accept it cause exp would be nice at that time.

Think of it as pop up windows on your computer. Just cause you don't want your penis enlarged... don't mean someone else don't *cough~wife~cough* ^.^

[Macht]

Re: Blind Invites: Why are they so bad?

It doesn't really work, because while having pt flag up, especially with a green xp comment (although not many people use those in the early lvls), it's equivalant to the bellhop wearing a sign around his neck saying, "Give me your bags, I will take them to your room."

You don't need flag up to get an invite for teles or other pts.

Nontheless, custom dictates that some sort of message be sent beforehand. It's not entirely rational, but not sending anything denotes inexperience.

In the end, though, it's nothing to get pissy about.

When you concider the fact that the experience is not face-to-face anything you see that would appear to be a sign or anouncement is only relative data. You have no clue what is happening on the other end with the guy, so expecting a blind invite to be alright even in that condition is gambling. Much safer to do introductions beforehand to help assess the other guys current state.

Who knows I could flag up for a party, set my EXP comment and right after that police barge in to my house and I'm on the floor being handcuffed. Looks like my character and I am there for a party when in truth we are not. Sending a tell and getting that void responce doesn't acknowledge my presence either so it isn't like an invite after that will always make as huge a difference.

[AngryUndead]

Re: Blind Invites: Why are they so bad?

I'll admit tho. As much as I hate it sometimes... other times when my blm gets a blind invite, I'll sit there... then I accept it cause exp would be nice at that time.

Think of it as pop up windows on your computer. Just cause you don't want your penis enlarged... don't mean someone else don't *cough~wife~cough* ^.^

Spam is a multibillion dollar/year industry. People send you crap on the off chance you take it...

People invite you on the off chance you accept. This is based on the principle that many people (like me with parties) will take somthing when offered it.

[Meth]

Re: Blind Invites: Why are they so bad?

Which ends up falling into the void responce. You ask the guy to take your luggage and he just walks past or stares at you, you'd already take that as a no. Hence why void responces are so horrible when players do that. They are excused more though because you are not in that face-to-face condition.

Now I see where we differ, I don't take that as a no, I take that to mean that the bell hop is ignoring me (or in-game, is afk). So it's at this point I will force the issue. Real world example of blind invite: I'm at a restaurant with some friends, and we are getting no service, so I start flagging down any server I see. That's blind invite action; the person I get may not even be a server, or isn't assigned to my section, who knows.

Back to the bell hop; I drive up and /tell him, {Luggage} {please assist}. He walks by like I'm the invisible man, so I /pcmd add bellhop. At this point the bell hop becomes agitated and complains, but now I know where I stand with him and he can either {help me out!} or I can move on to the next bell hop. I would rather this method the {call for help} from multiple bell hops and see which responds the fastest.

[Jugil]

Re: Blind Invites: Why are they so bad?

Personally, I’ll take a blind invite, but you better believe I’m gonna be wary at first. Ill /sea all Partyleader just to see what he is. When I get in the party I’m asking questions (as well as checkin the party member list). I guess it boils down to me feeling more comfortable if someone takes the time to let me know what’s goin on first.

Let’s take this hypothetical situation: suppose you get two invites at the same time:

Partyleader1 invites you to a party
Partyleader1>> pty

Partyleader2>> {Hello} {Experience Points} {Do you need it?} 59-61 PLD, WHM, BRD, BLM, DRK {Labyrinth of Onzozo}

Which would make you feel a little better?

I try to be Partyleader2 as much as possible. If they don't reply, well they missed out on a pty

Not sayin it’s right or wrong, it’s just what I would prefer.

[Hamlet]

Re: Blind Invites: Why are they so bad?

Blind invites are not rude, but they are considered rude. Sending "experience points party?" before an invite conveys no information, and yet is universally considered better. It's just a custom that's developed for the game, like if someone offers his hand to shake and you do nothing, it's rude.

But there's little reason behind it beyond "It's what you do."

Back to the bellhop analogy, seeing a bellhop in uniform is equivalant to seeing a whm unanon when you are looking for a healer- i.e. they are suited to help you and maybe be in a position to do so. A whm with flag up is equivalant to the bellhop with a sign saying, "Give me your bags now, I'm ready to work. NOW." Since there's no reason to put flag up unless your looking for xp (or looking for specific quest groups or something, although I kinda doubt that actually works), you shouldn't be upset by getting invites with flag up. Would you rather have your screen spammed with

Party. Experience Points. Do you need it?
Party?
Experience points party. Do you need it?
Party. Experience Points. Do you need it?
Party. Do you need it?
Party. Experience Points. Do you need it?

In addition to the invites?

[Macht]

Re: Blind Invites: Why are they so bad?

Now I see where we differ, I don't take that as a no, I take that to mean that the bell hop is ignoring me (or in-game, is afk). So it's at this point I will force the issue. Real world example of blind invite: I'm at a restaurant with some friends, and we are getting no service, so I start flagging down any server I see. That's blind invite action; the person I get may not even be a server, or isn't assigned to my section, who knows.

Back to the bell hop; I drive up and /tell him, {Luggage} {please assist}. He walks by like I'm the invisible man, so I /pcmd add bellhop. At this point the bell hop becomes agitated and complains, but now I know where I stand with him and he can either {help me out!} or I can move on to the next bell hop. I would rather this method the {call for help} from multiple bell hops and see which responds the fastest.

Can agree there, then it starts boiling down from that point what the community see's as acceptable and not. Like your situation with not being serviced, I like to make sure it's effects are more profoundly felt. So if I'm not serviced I don't flag down any for a blind invite, I attack the source that controls this behavior. At a resturant more commonly known as the manager, that'll light a fire under the behavior itself instead of solving a current situation.

So in situations were there isn't a specific controller such as a manager the only target you have is the populous. Usually start with my party "Hey someone else try sending a tell to <so and so> he doesn't seem to be able to hear my tells. Let me know if he wants in or not." I'll attack his void responce behavior with something as annoying as a blind invite but isn't as intrucive as it. Even get brownie points on it that way if a party member is a LS member of that guys.

[Suichi]

Re: Blind Invites: Why are they so bad?

I know it's not a real big deal but sending blind invites shows a lack of experience and ettiquete.

I mean to say, not all people with their flag up are looking for parties(Tele, ect.).

And I agree with Jugil in that I try to invite people and give them as much detail about the pt as possible, instead of just "pt???".

I'll may take a blind invite, if they tell me after the invite with something like "Whoops, clicked invite on mistake" or if they send me a tell and seem halfway intelligent.

[Meth]

Re: Blind Invites: Why are they so bad?

Alright guys, I'm off work so I'm leaving the fray. Good responses on both sides of the argument. Some associate blind invites with n00bs, others with rudeness, others just don't care. I'll leave with this:

A few weeks back I left a party in the crawler's nest because their chat was offensive to me. The leader sent me a number of tells and party invites that I rejected. Then he said the following bit of wisdom, "If you want xp you'll except my invite, your choice." I had made my choice but you can't fault his logic.

[Hamlet]

Re: Blind Invites: Why are they so bad?

A few weeks back I left a party in the crawler's nest because their chat was offensive to me. The leader sent me a number of tells and party invites that I rejected. Then he said the following bit of wisdom, "If you want xp you'll except my invite, your choice." I had made my choice but you can't fault his logic.

This is why I sometimes accept blind invites, especially at the low lvls (although blind invites don't really happen in the higher lvls), although I will enter the pt EXTREMELY WARY.

Most of the time, pts from blind invites have turned out bad, especially in the dunes.

I mean to say, not all people with their flag up are looking for parties(Tele, ect.).

There's no reason to put flag up for teles. The teleporter can invite you easily with /sea all playername, and I personally don't ever put up flag for teles. I do a shout asking for one and how much I'll pay and some whm BLIND INVITES ME! Most of the time, we don't even talk, I just pay the guy the gil, give him a refresh (which often results in him bowing) and off we go.

Custom is the only reason blind invites are worse than "XP PT?" then invite, and not following the custom denotes inexperience and bad things in your immediate future if you take the invite. Of course, "XP PT? RDM PLD WAR THF BLM. PT for at least 3 hours. Crawler's Nest" is really ideal, and I generally do that when inviting (although not the time thing, but that would be really nice to know, at least a guestimate), but you don't come accross this kind of efficiency often.

Logical responses to blind invites is turning them down because there's a good chance it's going to be a bad pt, or, if you're desperate, like the Galka Monk in this thread, taking the invite and being prepared for some noobiness (excitement). Getting pissed off and telling your ls so they send angry tells is irrational and denotes an emotional problem.

[Suichi]

Re: Blind Invites: Why are they so bad?

My point was that not everyone has their flags up when looking for a pt, it was just an example.

[Kutu]

Re: Blind Invites: Why are they so bad?

I hate blind invites, id rather be asked out of respect mroe than anything, no matter how good the party is ghoing to be. IF i have respect to ask you, please have the respect to ask me.

[Icemage]

Re: Blind Invites: Why are they so bad?

Blind invite = /decline for me, always. If I'm feeling charitable I'll do a /sea all <name> and see if the person who did the blind invite might have a clue what they're doing, but I've yet to be pleasantly surprised in this regard in 3 years of play.

Why do I consider a blind invite worse than
>> {Experience points} {party} {Do you need it?}?

(1) Until you accept or decline that invite, you cannot be invited by anyone else. If you're seeking and get another, more polite invitation, you're forced to go out of your way to either zone or decline the invitation before going about your business.

(2) I'll always respond to a /tell. Usually if no additional information is provided in the initial tell, then I'll follow up with a question asking about {Where?} and ask about party composition and level. Sensible players will provide this information when asked. Those who are /anon and unwilling to fill me in on what I'm signing up for are not worth my time - I might as well go do something else I enjoy instead.

(3) The possibility exists that the player does not have a keyboard or is a tremendously slow typer. If so... well... tough. If you can afford to pay for FFXI, you can afford a keyboard - and if you can't type to communicate, what the heck are you doing playing a multiplayer game where the main method of communication is by typing text?


Icemage

[ValisOfValefor]

Re: Blind Invites: Why are they so bad?

Eh, never been to fond of blind invites myself. But do i go off on the person, no. I either explain the situation im in, or politely say no thank you.

Now when im my pld i get on usually go and check my ah list, and right as i get to my mog house "(Party) ?" and i usally say yes if i dont have any plans. (apparently theres either a shortage of tanks on valefor in the 40s range right now, or i just get on at the right times).

Now back to the blind invites, usually unless im anon ill still get blind invites. But it really helps to explain to the person what your doing. Usually after i say, "And next time you want a person to join your party please dont send blind invites to people who aren't lfg. If I just get an invite with no /tell I usually join and see what the party looks like. Luckly as I've gotten higher in level people atleast always /tell before.

Now when im the party leader i usally send

<party> ? <do you need it> <experience points> <location>

Now the one thing that really annoys me when im party leader is those people who are lfg, but arent really lfg, or have a stupid preference for jobs. Once when i was in the crawlers nest looking for a despeller, i came across a bard lfg and said

<me> "<party> <do you need it>"
Bard take a moment to respond
<bard> "no thanks, i have something else to be doing"

I look ten minutes later and another bard pops.

<me> "<party> <do you need it>
Bard takes a moment to respond
<bard> "Pld meat sheild, no thanks."

I start getting desperate and there has been a rdm/nin up this entire time

<me> (since they have up E symbol) "hey do you want a party in the crawler nest"
(i figured they were just farming and was gonna change subs)
<rdm> "sure!"

Now wasnt the best person ever but the first really good thf i had ever played with made up for it.

Pretty much in conclusion, Send a /tell before, be polite about declines. And if your the party leader, just look for someone else.

[Gentoo]

Re: Blind Invites: Why are they so bad?

Frankly, I don't consider getting a invite without a /tell, when seeking a party, rude/discourteous/boorish. Once you have chosen to seek a party, you're broadcasting the message "I would like to join a party, please invite me!" Your search comment allows you to refine the conditions under which you can expect to get an invite.

To complain about getting an invite, when you're clearly soliciting them, is an excercise in pretentiousness. An invite without a /tell is just the absolute minimum response to a the request to be invited. (the clear implication here is that I do consider a invite without a prior /tell somewhat lazy)

( It also holds true that if you have a search comment with conditions, and you've been invited outside of those conditions, you've got your license to grouse )

All that said, I do not send invites without a prior /tell. I like getting a /tell in advance, so I make sure that I at least extend the same effort. I also make sure to tell the potential party member how many positions are filled, and what the jobs are. I'll wait for a response in /tell indicating their interest.