Endgame "forgotten" spells

[TheGrandMom]

Re: Endgame "forgotten" spells

You know how you just stated that Sacrarium is not an everyday place? (Well, you can throw in KTR, Gustav-Deep and Gusgen as well) But sneak and invis is worthless in magic-aggro-ville as well. Sure, it's not everyday, but there are times when you're forced to not be able to use a spell or two...

Aeni is correct, there are more places that this will be very beneficial. At endgame with an endgame ls, you'll be helping people do missions you did and/or camping/hunting in areas that you'll utilize it in. I've used it more in endgame than I did my entire time lvling up 4 mage jobs. And as far as finding a safe place to sit in the Sac, where?? I've never seen so many fomors in my life! (But they are cool looking aren't they?)

[Tirrock]

Re: Endgame "forgotten" spells

A bit off topic, but this always confuses me... Why do people try to use avatars to block people from targeting monsters? It only effects /targetnpc. From my limited understanding on bots...they cycled through targets, so just adding one more target wouldn't do much. And avatars don't even get in the way of targeting if you cast from the menu.

[Aeni]

Re: Endgame "forgotten" spells

A bit off topic, but this always confuses me... Why do people try to use avatars to block people from targeting monsters? It only effects /targetnpc. From my limited understanding on bots...they cycled through targets, so just adding one more target wouldn't do much. And avatars don't even get in the way of targeting if you cast from the menu.

Heck, I think bots ignore PCs anyway, so having an avatar out (which is PC identified since some patch last year) is going to fool who? Maybe legit claimers, but as Tirrock said, there's ways of going around that as well ...

[Rones]

Re: Endgame "forgotten" spells

Deodorize doesn't prevent aggro. Deodorize loses aggro on mobs that track by scent. Crawlers are an example. You also have to be outside aggro range for it to work on those. Thus, a common use to it sleepga the train following you, walk away a distance, and cast deodorize on yourself. Keep in mind that only works on mobs that track by scent which are few and far between.

For example, most ofthese crawlers track by scent. Check the C in the column on the right.
Now for comparison look at these skeletons. They aggro by sound and do not track by scent. They don't even have noses if you want to get picky. I have heard the rumor of deoderize preventing low hp aggro, but it nevered work for me.

Dia and banish are both useful even with whm subbed. On brd, I actually land dia without resist usually and it will last 30-40 secs. Banish is nice when I want to wake up a mob from a distance without giving it a DoT that prevents me sleeping it again. Banish is the cheapest spell for the job and only thing available to mages.

Paralyze and slow are pretty worthless to anyone except blm, whm, rdm. Too little enfeebling magic.

[Aeni]

Re: Endgame "forgotten" spells

Paralyze and slow are pretty worthless to anyone except blm, whm, rdm. Too little enfeebling magic.

Even those are pretty useful as a DRK/WHM. For reference, refer to here:

http://www.ausystem.org/~aushacho/gbox/ff/skill-e.html

If it is useful to a WHM, it is useful to a DRK, considering skill level. I noticed that several DRK-onry gear has +MND. I've seen DRK/WHMs solo successfully while they LFP in their 30s and 40s. I think that even in upper levels, maybe while skilling something, a fully subbed WHM gives great benefits to a DRK.

That's just one shining example.

[Rones]

Re: Endgame "forgotten" spells

Slipped my mind that drk had enfeebling magic skill. Yes, a drk/whm can have a chance of sticking and using them...but I can't think of a situation they would be useful and you would have a drk subbing whm. Either you are fighting too weaks or the drk would be better off with nin or war sub.

[Jei]

Re: Endgame "forgotten" spells

deodorize can help you from monsters that detect your blood scent. Primarily, undead type monsters which can smell your blood when your HP is low. If you're going to convert in the middle of tough skeletons it's really good to have deodorize up.

[TheMidg]

Re: Endgame "forgotten" spells

I guess I never really thought about how when your hp is low enemies detect you by smell, and deodorize will prevent that. Been playing forever but there is always things like that that you miss and now i'll have to keep that in mind lol

[Deltran]

Re: Endgame "forgotten" spells

deodorize can help you from monsters that detect your blood scent. Primarily, undead type monsters which can smell your blood when your HP is low. If you're going to convert in the middle of tough skeletons it's really good to have deodorize up.

wait if skeletons have no nose how do the smell it?

[Jei]

Re: Endgame "forgotten" spells

don't use logic, use imagination

[Karinya]

Re: Endgame "forgotten" spells

I thought this claim (Deodorize preventing blood aggro) had been tested and disproven before? If it's not proven effective, we shouldn't propagate it - someone could get killed relying on false information. Fomor are not a good test case because their aggro behavior can be odd anyway. Anyone care to go to the deep part of KRT, cast sneak and deodorize on themselves, use up some MP and convert to see if they get aggro? And take a video of the whole thing as proof?

Except for spells that have a higher level replacement like Dia, Stone or Poison, there aren't very many spells I don't use at 75. Deodorize, Blaze Spikes and some of the bar spells that prevent a status that's very rare to begin with. Everything else I use in parties, solo, or both (and I'd probably use Barvirus, too, if I farmed buffalos). It says a lot about the design of this game that a level 6 spell (Paralyze) is not only used, but used frequently, at 75, and that it's just as effective at 75 as it was at level 6, if not more so.

BTW, the advantage of shock spikes is that you can cast paralyze, *and* occasionally stun things - it reduces the damage you take a little further than paralyze alone. In addition, if you are kiting, a stunned mob stops chasing you (and may not be able to catch back up afterwards), while a paralyzed one just doesn't swing. I don't use it much, but it does have its uses.

[Darkhound]

Re: Endgame "forgotten" spells

Thank you everyone for their responses. It is amaizng how everyone has a different good use for some spell that some of us dont use at tall. By reading some of your posts, i will defintley try some things here and there.

[Kitalrez]

Re: Endgame "forgotten" spells

wait if skeletons have no nose how do the smell it?

*thinks about this very hard*
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*thinks about this some more*
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-
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*sound of something breaking*

My dog has no nose.

How does it smell?

Awful!


I dunno, I tended to use Slow and Paralyze quite a bit when soloing on WHM. I didn't try taking on anything higher than Even Match, though, so I can't tell you how well they work on anything higher. I find as I go up in level ranges, almost everything resists my debuffs though. Not just these, but also other more useful debuffs like Silence. (Let's not even go into the last time I tried to use Lunar Roar on an exp mob and it kept the spikes debuff anyway). At the low to mid-range, these spells stick pretty well and are very useful when they do. As we get higher in levels, everything seems to have an unreasonably high resistance to spells in general, not just those of it's base element. For instance, I watched a 75 BLM with quite a bit of +skill gear get a whole slew of resists trying to sleep T mobs in Newton Movapolos last night. Given how much mobs use Slow and Paralyze at 70 with great effectiveness, I'm starting to wonder just how much better the base resistances on mobs are at these levels.

[TheGrandMom]

Re: Endgame "forgotten" spells

I think Slow and Paralyze are 2 of the most utilized spells in the game. When I'm on blm or whm and there isn't a rdm but a brd, I cast them and if the rdm in my pt is busy or forgets, I cast them. I still use them quite often and think they are some of the best spells in the game.

[Aeni]

Re: Endgame "forgotten" spells

Slipped my mind that drk had enfeebling magic skill. Yes, a drk/whm can have a chance of sticking and using them...but I can't think of a situation they would be useful and you would have a drk subbing whm. Either you are fighting too weaks or the drk would be better off with nin or war sub.

For soloing purposes, which I had mentioned in the previous post. I find subbing NIN lacking much with regards to what a RDM or WHM sub can bring to the table. WHM has all the healing and curing spells and some nice enfeebling as well while RDM grants you Stoneskin and Phalanx, some of the best defensive spells in the game.

Of course, it goes without saying that in either case, both can save your wallet many times over than subbing NIN...

deodorize can help you from monsters that detect your blood scent. Primarily, undead type monsters which can smell your blood when your HP is low. If you're going to convert in the middle of tough skeletons it's really good to have deodorize up.

I'm not sure how well this works.

First of all, Fomor aggros in strange ways. I do know that there's a fomor hate meter, but that could apply to only fomors in certain zones. I do know that I have yet to aggro fomors in Phomiuna Aqueducts ... I ran around them without sneak once, even when people tell me that I should have sneak on. >_> On the flipside, there are a group of fomors on a watch tower in Misereaux Coast that aggro you no matter what level you are and regardless of your hate level. Weird stuff...

As for blood loss aggro, it's actually dependant on level. I've never aggro'd undead in the red if they were too weak to begin with and sometimes EP. However, I've aggro'd decents from a mile a way while in yellow.

Need more science to unravel the half-truths behind this urban myth ...