Here me Out

[Kailea]

Re: Here me Out

Smasholays really stop -.- its silly to keep defending such a stupid idea, that SE will never do!....

and yes all children I dont care who you are will be that way, it is what a child does...

and you should keep your CDs and anything breakable by children oh a shelf easy for you to reach but hard for a child to reach....duh -.- all my CDs are on a shelf about 3 feet off the floor because my sister has a littleone now, and I dont want stuff broken and CDs like FFXI install disks I keep in a locked desk that I keep the key for all the time. now that is what you should do to keep proper care of your things.......

[Smasholays]

Re: Here me Out

I know I said my last post was the last, but I wanted to add something.

There is nothing stupid about downloadable software you buy first. PC Games, at least most of them, are the only software that can't be downloaded from the internet, of course I will assume that is because most games today total over 2 or 3 GB, but then again even with the worst DSL ever, a game can be downloaded in a day or two which is faster than it being shipped to you.

Look at Valve, you can download all their games from the steam client. You have to purchase one of their games first to be able to play any of them though, and you can do that through steam and download it immediately. Many game makers are looking at Valve's Steam as inspiration for future games. Whether you think it's a "stupid idea' or not, it's likely to become one of the main ways to get new games. If you don't believe me look at the following links:

http://www.connectedhomemag.com/Netw...rticleID=47556
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/4041289.stm
http://digg.com/gaming/EA_Relases_Steam-like_Updater

Do you still think it's a stupid idea? In reality POL itself could easily be setup to do the same things as steam. Saying SE won't ever do it, is premature. Everything about Valve is promising to a game developer. They can stop piracy much easily, they can ban people who hack, they can find out much more about people's system and update the games accordingly.

I don't have a desk with a locked drawer, and I doubt putting it ontop of a dresser is a guarantee a child won't get to it. Although it does help, there is no guarantee. But I digress, arguing over how or why a disk gets broken is pointless - which is probably my fault for spending so much time on it in the first post.

The point isn't how a disk gets broken or who's fault it is (of course it's never SEs fault if you break your disk), it's whether when will SE will start offering a steam like service for it's PC games. Whether you want to believe it or not, steam like client are the wave of the future, there are so many positives with very few negatives for game makers to ignore. And all those positives all equal more money for the game makers in the end. With piracy such a big issue with PC Games, it's more reason to use such a system. Even the people who can pirate steam, end up getting banned regardless, from all functions of steam games. Offline games, online games, it doesn't matter - can't play any of them. And the negatives of the system, are becoming smaller by the day.

I don't know why a few on here are opposed to such a system, there is nothing unethical about any of the above. In fact it would help everyone out so much. With such a system we could help to stop MrArgus, or bots that plague the game. With such a system they could have stopped the DOS attacks much more easily. There is no win-lose to the system, except for the people who bot or whatever. Granted I use the windower as do most PC users, but I would give it up just so I could camp Fafnir or KB once without someone teleporting to the mob and voking it. With MrArgus becoming more and more popular everyday the problem is just getting worse. With the way POL is setup, the ability to the add the things above would probably be next to minimal.

So instead of saying the idea is "stupid" tell me why it's stupid. Piracy and bots are all stopped by such a system. Which leads to happier players, happier players equals less people quitting which equals more money for SE. Everyone wins. The only reason I think maybe POL already doesn't have such a system is maybe the PS2 can't handle all of that. Looking at POL looks like what SE was trying to go for, but maybe couldn't accomplish because of PS2 limitations. But I'm not a SE programmer, so it's just speculation. Am I really the only person here who wants less bots affecting everyone's gameplay?

Edit: and apparently some gil sellers have a hack that lets them claim and kill a mob that is already claimed: http://www.livejournal.com/users/celeras/85727.html
For anyone who doesn't know Dsl and Elsianie are gil sellers on ragnarok.

Such a system could help stop gil sellers from cheating to claim so many mobs unfairly, and allow SE to ban more gil sellers that do hack.

[Kailea]

Re: Here me Out

I am sorry but that system will not stop botters or piracy, nothing will, and I find it "stupid" because if I pay for something I want the physical copy of it, paying for data downloads is stupid in my opinion.

[x1ang]

Re: Here me Out

i dont see how it can stop piracy/cheating unless SE does something like Blizzard's Warden. however, it wouldn't hurt to have the game available to download for a price managed by SE. even if a lot of you think that it is a dumb idea and that nobody will use it, some people will and it doesn't affect any one who chooses to buy the CDs rather than to download the game content. its just another option that people can choose to use in order to buy the game if they really wish to >.>

[Kailea]

Re: Here me Out

i dont see how it can stop piracy/cheating unless SE does something like Blizzard's Warden. however, it wouldn't hurt to have the game available to download for a price managed by SE. even if a lot of you think that it is a dumb idea and that nobody will use it, some people will and it doesn't affect any one who chooses to buy the CDs rather than to download the game content. its just another option that people can choose to use in order to buy the game if they really wish to >.>

heh Warden still does not stop botting 100% :p

[TheGrandMom]

Re: Here me Out

I really don't care how many children or grandchildren you have, not every child is going to be the same; I think you got lucky to have such well behaved children regardless, but I have to wonder if they even had CD games when your children were toddlers. I would have to lean towards no, since Playstation didn't come out until 1995. I have to really wonder where you expect people to keep their disks, taped to the ceiling? Besides a vault, I haven't seen a child that couldn't find his way into anything.

LOL I can tell you have no parenting experience at all. Luck has absolutely nothing to do with it. Genes and good parenting do. Gamers are all in a rage now about how parents that won't take responsibility for their kids are blaming video games for some of their woes. Those are bad parents. Those are the kids that have no respect for property. And no you don't have to tape them to the ceiling, its very easy to keep your stuff out of reach from little hands. People just need to use the brain God gave them! In 1995 my son was 10, so no he wasn't a toddler and he is the youngest of my children. There were still cartridge games that could be stomped on and he was always fascinated with the screws that were in the cartridges. >.< Yet I never had a problem with ruining any of my games. But I do have a toddler grandchild and another that is soon to be a toddler. CD's, DVD's, headsets, etc. are always about and never an issue. Nothing to do with luck at all, its called discipline.

[x1ang]

Re: Here me Out

heh Warden still does not stop botting 100% :p

whoops, i meant that there would be no real way to detect/curb/slightly-stop some cheats x]

sadly though, if a Warden-like prog came out through SE, proally the Windower will be the only thing truly owned ;[

[Mog]

Re: Here me Out

Step 1: Put CD into a case
Step 2: Put said CD case into a safe area (aka bedroom, high place, etc.)
Step 3: Tell child not to mess with your stuff
Step 4: Reprimand child when he messes with your stuff

I mean seriously, do you really think you're going to request there to be a close-to-free cite to download from because your CD broke? I might get grief from this, but I'm going to relate this to a different story on a much bigger scale. This reminds me of 11 year-old kid who killed 6 police officers (correct me if im wrong) after playing GTA3. Who's fault is it? The parents' Why? They let their child play a mature 17+ game (There are age ratings for a reason). These parents were dumb enough for letting the kid play in the first place, and instead of refelecting on how they could change, they instead sued the company. The moral? Take responsibility into your own hands. We live in the real world where nobody is going to give you a handout. Get over it, hide your stuff in a safe place, and like Grandmom said, discipline children to not mess with your stuff, so you wouldn't have this problem in the first place.

[Jarre]

Re: Here me Out

The Uk current version has the disks in plastic wallets. I keep mine in the original box with the rest of my Jewel cases in a high level cabineta way from any prying little finger. In the Uk a replacement set is now £9.99!! from amazon uk (plus p&p)

The problems is with having a downloadable version are as follows:-

1. Needs a dedicated server with a high volume traffic output, this osts lots of £££
2. On a server its suceptble to hacking and damage.
3. Major traffic may lead to unreliable servers or you have to wait a while to download.
4. You can only download once, so what if you loose the files i.e. comp crash/hack etc., you have to download it again and would have to pay, because how can you prove you lsot it?
5. Disk are much easier, if I want to do a format or upgrade my comp, put disks in, load up have my playonmline id already so just log in with that and do the updates, simple. Downloading, the size (6 disks) that would mean at least 4Gb + updates, that for a normal person on broadband would be at elast 6 hours downloading and think of the extra cost if you py per GB download, so basically your paying for the game and paying for it again to download.
6. People just have to be careful, if you have little fingers aroudn, then place it in a safe place.
7. treat your disks with care, don't just slam them in (PS2 users especially) be careful and treat i with respect, I have a scratch doctor and the amount of cd's and DVD's I end up repairing for friends due to them just chucking the disks in willy nilly is unbelievable.
8. Make sure your computer is protected from virus's, spyware/malware etc. and have a firewall, these are all free to obtain and remember to keep it updated.

I leave you with a quote from my Grandfather....
"Treat things with repect and they will bring you hapiness, abuse them, and they will bring you sadness"

[x1ang]

Re: Here me Out

they could provide you with a download code in order to d/l the game (you would still require the activation codes/contentID however to play). a download server may be tough to setup and have a lot of issues early on, but slow improvements can make it a stable way to get the game (e.g. Valve's Steam). if the download failed, then you could just put in the download code again and re-D/L the prog again... issues of people D/Ling for other people would be no different than using someone else's CDs to install... plus you would still require the activation code to purchase the content IDs. the download could also be a simple DL of the retail version (w/o any patches), so after install, they would still have to update the game and patch.

[DeathFromAbove]

Re: Here me Out

How does one "Here me out"?

Damn it, i was reading all of the posts to see if i would get to say this!!!!

[Ark]

Re: Here me Out

This'll be my first, and last post...

First off, I think this discussion is absolutely ridiculous -- mostly because you people are simply going around in circles and totally missing the points being made. I'm with Smasholays on the fact that accidents happen -- discs breaks, they suffer damage, they get scratched -- most of the time, it's from an accident. The fact that "TheGrandMom" [and others] fails to accept such a thing is absolutely ridiculous. I've broken or lost things on accident before -- it's not really that hard to do, and it's not something one intends to do, hence, an accident.

Also, "TheGrandMom" -- your siganture makes you look pretentious as hell, because you've displayed that you, yourself, aren't too good at grammar. Re-read your posts and maybe you'll see. I'm not trying to be hypocritical, as I'm sure I've made grammar errors, but the fact that you've got a goddamn SIGNATURE whining about them is stupid.

Nothing to do with luck at all, its called discipline.

That's ridiculous. My father was strict as hell -- I got hit for accidentally getting glue on the floor, hell, I even caught a lot of shit when I got my finger stuck in his tape player. Shit happens, discipline hasn't got a damn thing to do with it. Out of all the posts I've read here, yours are the most irrational and asinine. I really doubt you can accept a point, so, I won't bother anymore; but you've pretty much shown me this forum isn't worth wasting time on.

Adieu.

[Mog]

Re: Here me Out

This'll be my first, and last post...

First off, I think this discussion is absolutely ridiculous -- mostly because you people are simply going around in circles and totally missing the points being made. I'm with Smasholays on the fact that accidents happen -- discs breaks, they suffer damage, they get scratched -- most of the time, it's from an accident. The fact that "TheGrandMom" [and others] fails to accept such a thing is absolutely ridiculous. I've broken or lost things on accident before -- it's not really that hard to do, and it's not something one intends to do, hence, an accident.

Also, "TheGrandMom" -- your siganture makes you look pretentious as hell, because you've displayed that you, yourself, aren't too good at grammar. Re-read your posts and maybe you'll see. I'm not trying to be hypocritical, as I'm sure I've made grammar errors, but the fact that you've got a goddamn SIGNATURE whining about them is stupid.


That's ridiculous. My father was strict as hell -- I got hit for accidentally getting glue on the floor, hell, I even caught a lot of shit when I got my finger stuck in his tape player. Shit happens, discipline hasn't got a damn thing to do with it. Out of all the posts I've read here, yours are the most irrational and asinine. I really doubt you can accept a point, so, I won't bother anymore; but you've pretty much shown me this forum isn't worth wasting time on.

Adieu.

As for your first statement about accidents, I'll agree with you. Accidents do happen. However, just because people accidentally break CD's doesn't mean that SE must have a downloadable site from which to get the game from.

As for all of this discipline-talk, your reasoning is flawed, good sir. Disciplining your children dictates what kind of behavior they'll have. If I were to not discipline a child and let him break my stuff, he wouldn't learn any values and would continue to do whatever he feels like doing, thus creating more "accidents". However with the right amount of discipline, there's less of a chance that the said child won't mess with your stuff. Simple as that. As for your father being strict as hell, that's not a matter of discipline, just lack of communication. It sounds as though you tried to tell him it was an accident, but he didnt listen to you....so either you've done a lot in the past to make him think youre a troublemaker, or your father is a bad listener.

[TheGrandMom]

Re: Here me Out

This'll be my first, and last post...

First off, I think this discussion is absolutely ridiculous -- mostly because you people are simply going around in circles and totally missing the points being made. I'm with Smasholays on the fact that accidents happen -- discs breaks, they suffer damage, they get scratched -- most of the time, it's from an accident. The fact that "TheGrandMom" [and others] fails to accept such a thing is absolutely ridiculous. I've broken or lost things on accident before -- it's not really that hard to do, and it's not something one intends to do, hence, an accident.

Also, "TheGrandMom" -- your siganture makes you look pretentious as hell, because you've displayed that you, yourself, aren't too good at grammar. Re-read your posts and maybe you'll see. I'm not trying to be hypocritical, as I'm sure I've made grammar errors, but the fact that you've got a goddamn SIGNATURE whining about them is stupid.


That's ridiculous. My father was strict as hell -- I got hit for accidentally getting glue on the floor, hell, I even caught a lot of shit when I got my finger stuck in his tape player. Shit happens, discipline hasn't got a damn thing to do with it. Out of all the posts I've read here, yours are the most irrational and asinine. I really doubt you can accept a point, so, I won't bother anymore; but you've pretty much shown me this forum isn't worth wasting time on.

Adieu.

I'm sorry but well disciplined children with good parents do not crawl up on desks and seek out game discs and break them. Good parents are aware of what their toddlers are doing and also know where to place things they don't want them to have. If you had understood what you read you would see that points were made that no matter where you put your game discs some horrible catastrophe would befall them usually at the hands of a young child or animal. If you believe that then I fear for your children.

As for my signature, you know what it means and a occasional spelling mistake is not what it addresses. So your ostentatious display is a joke.

As for your father "hitting" you for spilling glue, that was overboard. If this was the way he usually reacted then he was not being a good parent. But even good parents have bad days so if it was a rare slip then he's only human. There are parents that don't guide their children, parents that do with moderation, and parents that go over the top. If you fall into the don't guide or over the top catagories then you didn't have good parenting. Children that don't have good parenting act out. They look for attention either through negative or positive means. A child that had good parents rarely needs to do this.

As for my posts on parenting being "irrational" and "asinine", I thank you for the good laugh. Talk to me again in 25+ years and you might be able to actually know what your talking about.

[Bahamut Kaiser]

Re: Here me Out

I don't even know how you could damage it, I only had to install the game twice, besides that they are inside a case, inside a box, inside another box, in storage. I have more chances of misplacing the box and never finding it then loosing it.

But if you have a CD key and you need to install the game, SE should fork over another disk, within reasonable limits. Honestly, we paid for the product, sending just the disk in a sleeve doesn't cost that much, and if they want you to continue playing the game and you can't get back on without a new disk then they might arn't to ensure you can play.

Other then that, you should be able to use anyones disk to install the game, if you havea friend or know someone nearby who has the game you can just install theirs and use your CD key. The CD key is what you need to keep close tabs on.