Buying gil 'correct' in FFXI player's mind? WTH?!

[kuu]

Re: Buying gil 'correct' in FFXI player's mind? WTH?!

Restriction is a viable option, but we have to remember the consquences of it. But that's going off track.

Though realistically it won't solve RMT, nor will it stop greed, nor the problems we want to solve. It'll just shift people to think of "other ways"

Instead of food, they'll focus on medicne, or even worse, more "super" items like cassie or some other form, like everyone crams into one type of job that they can "pimp out" like with rangers.

Trying to stop fundemental aspects of certain things can not be achieved by enforcement alone. Heck USSR tried dang hard on similar concepts...and failed.

Food if anything made it hard to item inflation.
Before DD= ACC gear + meat. Therefore all ACC gears were expensive.
Now = ACC gear + str gear + variable food = selective choice.
So it's much harder to to corner any market, because as soon as one goes up, people will start moving to another.

[Jei]

Re: Buying gil 'correct' in FFXI player's mind? WTH?!

well, the strive for the uber gears will always be there I'm afraid. Putting restrictions onto food will help players pay less for food at the very least, but won't fix nor worsen the gears problem imo.

[soneill1986]

Re: Buying gil 'correct' in FFXI player's mind? WTH?!

I never bought gil but I personally don't see a problem with buying gil. The person is going to get the gil anyway, whether through purchasing or farming. Instead of spending the time in game to get the gil they spend their time at work to get the money to get the gil. The time is still spent, the means it is spent is just different. I just don't buy gil because if I'm going to make money, I'm going to put it to real use.

[kuu]

Re: Buying gil 'correct' in FFXI player's mind? WTH?!

well, the strive for the uber gears will always be there I'm afraid. Putting restrictions onto food will help players pay less for food at the very least, but won't fix nor worsen the gears problem imo.

Actually it might...economy wise, we know things go full circle and in ways even experts can't fully predict.

If you restrict food, that'll shorten the amount of people (consumers) buying food, while lowering the price of food, will also lower the price of crafts and farming of byproducts of foods, etc, etc, etc.

It'll lead into a chain reaction, of who knows where it'll end... and depending on what food, who it'll hurt. People making a living off sole and squid, will leave to farm other places which will crowd other places still, etc, etc, etc.

Worse case senerio, is people who can't spend 40k a pop on their lvl 20 DDs, will instead spend it on eq, which will cause inflation in the eq area, which will hurt low level players in the end anyway.

[Omniblast]

Re: Buying gil 'correct' in FFXI player's mind? WTH?!

Here are some things that SE can do to alleviate the gil situation.

Guild Stores: They need lift the restriction on how many people can buy how many of those goods, for example: Bronze Ingot can be purchased from Guild Stores, however there is a limit of how many is on hand. If 1 person logs in and purchases all the Bronze Ingots, they can literally control the market. However if everyone can purchase Bronze Ingots, that would drive the market down when there are 200 stacks of Bronze Ingots in the Auction House.

1) Remove the limit of items purchasable from Guild Stores Drops prices in the Auction House.
2) Forces gil out of the economy and back into the system, thus lowering the price of goods being sold in the economy.

The Secondary Benefit of this is that the gil goes back into the system that was originally broken before by certain people who fishbot & synth padded caps. When people do not have enough gil to make sporatic purchases they will spend more carefully analyzing the equipment, and whether or not it is worth purchasing it.

Cost Benefit analysis should always be done when your playing any game and crafting any item and making any purchase. (same goes for real life projects, especially ones that cost several million)


This shows how bad it is for me to skill up .1 with the risk that I won't even get a skill up from it. Thick Sollerets sell in the Auction House for 60k if I'm lucky. One of these should be made for each item being synthed to compare losses

If you have found my Thick Sollerets in error please point it out, as I am at work writing this & I can correct it as best as I can.

[fallenintoshadows]

Re: Buying gil 'correct' in FFXI player's mind? WTH?!

the point of games is everyone plays them how they want and some people choose to cheat. I see gil buying as cheating but then its that player's own choice. I haven't ever bought gil because I like to say that I've made my character through my own work not someone elses.

[kuu]

Re: Buying gil 'correct' in FFXI player's mind? WTH?!

Onmiblast, your way sounds very much a deregulating solution, which might be feasible.

The problem is that SE uses such things as indirect means of controlling gil movement. Or what is consider intentional flooring of a product to keep the rich and poor closer together. Think mininum wage in US.

And there lies the problem. If you bottom it out so to say, and everything goes through the market, SE's only means of control in gil flow would be AH...and it's harder to move a ship with oars then a rudder, even if it's faster.

2nd problem is that you would at the same time raise previously under valued prices. Say a chainmail can't go over 18k very much because it's sold in bastok for 18k. But if you look at AH it's 20ish k sometimes(convience fee) but if there were not sold, and purely as a craft, it might go up to 30-40k the cost of the craft or more.

Purist economics will recomend this because it's better for market to be at most efficent, but, then economics will often proverbally, "Cut off the hand to save the body"i.e-> screw the poor.

If you want to keep inflation down on items, give cheaper/different alternatves might be a better option.

The CoP expansion set droped similar items a few notches here and there with their 20k seers, and stuff.

On gil buying...ban IP addresses blocks...well maybe not but until you solve the $10 = 70 yuan(or put other country in)...you're not solving gilselling or buying.

[fuz]

Re: Buying gil 'correct' in FFXI player's mind? WTH?!

RMT is about the easiest method to get what you want, and it goes beyond the virtual aspect of the game to RL. It's a natural process, just as water in a river seeks the easist way from moutaintop to sea.

No one wants to do something that they don't get much in return for, if there is a more attractive alternate. Those that don't buy gil because it's not 'correct' (even if is more efficient if they do), gain a value in that they spent that harder work in the payoff of better moral standing as an alternate. Both get what they want, and both will suffer and benefit from their respective actions.

Is RMT wrong? Many say, business considerations, it would be a smart move if you made more money in RL converted to gil than obtaining it in-game. Morals are another concern, which differ per individual. However FFXI is a game based largely on rules on what you can and can not do to govern a world that provides enteratinment to as many people as possible in an end product. RMT breaks the rules that support the game in it's role for equal enjoyment, which is why I don't like it.

RMT has a negative after-effect as it produces un-natural flux in the game economy, making it harder for the average player to purchase the high end items they want. Bypassing the usual restrictions in-game, allowing gil to easily fall into the hands of people suddenly puts additional demand on rarer, sought-after items. Expensive items keep getting more and more expensive as the market self-adjusts. However, there is no such growth in the low end economy to match, with capped prices and infinte supply from NPCs (armor/weapons mostly).

It would make sense for SE to stop controling this part of the market and let it free rise (or fall, which I doubt). It would be hurtful for a little while, but since it's so easy to sell/buy on the AH, it shouldn't last long. Additions in the form of some rare/ex items that are easier to get would relieve some of the requirement in buying your equipment, and relying on the market. Adventures we are, business academics we aren't (or at least shouldn't need to be in a significant way).

Getting gil in this game as driven me to do something as innane as fishing some 6 hours straight, every other day, months on end just to pay for equips. Pretty fucked up I'd say. I still don't even have all the good gear yet, with millions upon millions going through my hands.

[BillyMovement]

Re: Buying gil 'correct' in FFXI player's mind? WTH?!

I have personally been called a gilbuyer/gilseller a couple of times, while I was out farming the Oozes in Beaduex for Dodge Earrings. I think that the people who sit there and yell at a person for being a gilbuyer/gilseller should look at a couple of facts.....

1. People you are calling gilbuyers/gilsellers may just be trying to farm to get gil, like I was doing that day.

2. Most of the time if you find someone you believe to be a gilseller, they won't talk to you.

3. Ever notice that the people who are always camping NMs and out farming constantly have strange, random sounding names like ABCD and so on.....these are the people that never talk, and the people who always catch shit from me.

I don't blame people for spending their hard earned RL money on gil, but it would be nice to be able to afford all my elemental staffs for my blm, and for that matter i don't even have tornado yet. I feel that the economy is screwed because of the gilsellers/gilbuyers, but i don't think anything will be done about it. So I, like you all, may have to just live with it.......

[(Takemuke)]

Re: Buying gil 'correct' in FFXI player's mind? WTH?!

I never bought gil but I personally don't see a problem with buying gil. The person is going to get the gil anyway, whether through purchasing or farming. Instead of spending the time in game to get the gil they spend their time at work to get the money to get the gil. The time is still spent, the means it is spent is just different.

Lol. That's just stupid.

[x1ang]

Re: Buying gil 'correct' in FFXI player's mind? WTH?!

out of curiousity.. so how many of you have downloaded/burned music?

[aegina]

Re: Buying gil 'correct' in FFXI player's mind? WTH?!

out of curiousity.. so how many of you have downloaded/burned music?

myself: never.

[x1ang]

Re: Buying gil 'correct' in FFXI player's mind? WTH?!

lol ok ur excluded ;p (jk.. the argument wouldn't be able to be held valid against you thats all x] x])

[Aeni]

Re: Buying gil 'correct' in FFXI player's mind? WTH?!

x1ang,

But that was a wrong analogy to use, simply because people who can afford to buy gil online can afford to buy their music as well. So, just because they buy music legally does not make them any more or less better for buying gil online.

In either event, buying gil is against the policies of PlayOnline/FFXI. However, SE isn't able to police their policy as easily as they would like to. So, we'll always have this issue. The only morals I see is that when buying gil online, you're breaking a contractual agreement you made with SE the moment you agreed to the terms upon installing the software.

[x1ang]

Re: Buying gil 'correct' in FFXI player's mind? WTH?!

hm.. i meant it in a different way i guess >.>

people download/burn music (breaking copywrite laws)
prices of CDs goes up
those who buy music legitamently (follow the copywrite laws) suffer

people buy gil (break the ToS)
prices of items go up
those who farm and whatnot (follow the ToS) suffer

i'm not saying i support this reasoning or that it is even a good argument (cuz there's proally a whole bunch of holes in it anyways), but it is just interesting to think about x]