dear people who buy gil with real money

[Kailea]

You people REALLY need to do some reading before trying the same argument over and over that has already been proven wrong here: http://www.themis-group.com/whitepapers.phtml - "The Pitfalls of Virtual Property".

I dont read it because it is BS........

It is a game not a country, buy/selling gil will do nothing NOTHING at all the the "econmy" and like someone else said if SE has a problem with it....then lets us meet in court and we will see who will back down first (SE because they wont give a care)

Now I know that this sounds stupid, but I am serious......

now just close this pointless thread before more BS starts

[MonoxideChild]

I'm growing tired of seeing these discussions.

People buy gil, so what? The game is not going to go bad, your life is not going to end and everything will still be the same. Just because you don't go out and sell drugs or gil, that doesn't mean everyone else can't do it. They're going to take the risks and get rewarded for it., simple as that. I'm sure you download MP3's. The RIAA tells you no, but you do it anyways.

"Well some rich kid can come in and buy lots of gil while I have to work for it!"

Too bad! Life isn't fair, get over it.

There's MMORPG currency sellers everywhere. I'm sure there were gil sellers for FFXI before the US even got the game, and the economy didn't cumble while everyone ran for their lives.

How are you sure these people camping the tower work for these gil-selling companies? They could just be selling gil to pay the bills, and do some actual playing when they have the time.

Seriously, 75% of the gil selling theories is just plan ridiculous.

FFXI will be fine, the GMs will still be useless and nothing will happen. Instead of getting worked up over something that is just a complete waste of time, just play the game.

No really, it is a game.

[halfway]

I'm sorry Braanu, I think its taking people a while to respond because they can't decide if you're just trolling or if you can possibly believe half the garbage you post.

Following your line of reasoning(?), there are most definitely people that play quite a bit more than you, or are better at getting items and gil. You obviously don't have the time to play the game the right way or you would have just as much time as them. You should stop playing.

If someone wants to play for 3hrs a week and get a level every month or two, thats their choice. If someone wants to play 80hrs a week, thats their choice. If someone wants to buy gil and risk losing their account, again: their choice.

[csBahamut]

If you read it, you'd know that it's not JUST a game. And by not reading it, it just shows you're too stubbord to look at the other side's argument. If you're so confident that it's all BS, you'd prove some of his statements wrong. Maybe you're just too afraid of being wrong?

If someone wants to play for 3hrs a week and get a level every month or two, thats their choice. If someone wants to play 80hrs a week, thats their choice. If someone wants to buy gil and risk losing their account, again: their choice.

True. They *can* do it, but them they MUST suffer the consequences of their actions.

And please, PLEASE, actually take time to read through everything people. It's really annoying to see people post the same argument over and over again, especially when it's been proven invalid.

[Jonnyram]

This thread is a good, intelligent debate and should be kept open, so stop the please for it to be closed.

Personally, I don't have a problem with gil-buyers, but I'm not going to go out of my way to befriend someone who has more money than sense. $3000 for crimson finger is insane. I am happy with the time I have put into the game, whether it be levelling, farming or proper fun. Everything I have on my character is proof of a challenge that has been overcome, and that means more to me than any RMT-bought equipment could.

You don't need to pay $3000 to survive in this game. People still get invites with gimp equipment, people still go on HNM hunts with gimp equipment. Some linkshells beat Dynamis with people who wear AF or JSE stuff, rather than god equipment.

It is possible that RMT may have a negative effect on the economy of the game - say someone buys a few million gil, then puts it all into guilding. They could destroy the prices of guild items on the way because of their will to level quickly... but in the end, the situation can only be dealt with by Square Enix and has little to do with us.

[Toshi83]

I read about the 1st 5 pages of it, and honestly, who the hell gives a shit about people who buy gil?

Some people have more money than time.
Some people have more time than money.

Player A spends 8 hrs working, buys gil and has good gear.
Player B spends 8 hrs farming, buys gear same as Player A.

It's the same god damn fucking thing.

While you choose to live your life in a virtual world 24/7 and farm farm farm and get good gear, the other person chooses to work for real money, trade some for in-game money and be just as good as you. He's trading his real-life talent, blood, and sweat to enjoy the game, while you just spend hours farming.

Which one has more value? I think the gil buyer has more value. While at work he's contributing something to his company -> society -> world. He's a helping hand in evolutioning this world. What have you done? Nothing.

"Oh no the in-game status is gonna crash and people won't have fun and it's not fair."

You know why it ain't? Because your eyes are just bleeeding from your jealousy. YOU are the one who chose to farm. YOU are the one who chose to spend your time in a virtuous world. YOU are therefore not entitled to criticize and lament about people who seek other means.

Life isn't fair kid, grow up and deal with it.

On the moral issue standpoint, frankly, I really don't give a damn. I'm not a fucking saint, I don't just lend out helping hands without something in return (to strangers at least). This is a dog-eat-dog world and the only person who's gonna watch your back and take a bullet for you is yourself. No fucking Hollywood bullshit romance/caring/drama junk. This is the real world. If buying gil makes you so furious, hell, cry me a river.

You guys (the ones who are all bitching about gil-buyers) remind me of those idiotic Christian preachers on my campus who stalk you at every corner/bus stop etc and tell you "JESUS LOVES YOU! SO love him too!" Man...lay the f-off, I live my life how I want, and as long as I'm happy, as long as I'm safe, and as long as I'm not breaking any laws, it's my fucking life and don't tell me what I should do.

You are in NO position to judge other's morality, or morality as a whole, because everyone's definition is different.

Now grow up, you conceited fool.


Btw, if the gil-buying market has supply and demand, and real currecy is exchanged, then it DOES have monetary value.

[csBahamut]

I'm curious as to the Japanese communities view on this.


I fit into a couple categories here,
1) "It's morally worng." - This is my personal view/opinion.
2) "It's illegal." - Players must abid by the rules set forth in the EULA or risk having their account banned. Right now, people can sell their 'time' played, but not the items. It works in the virtual world so far, but not in the real world. There's no way a drug dealer could claim he's selling his time, and not really the drugs.
3) I like the game as it is. There's a few things I don't like, but I've been living long enough to know how to make boring tasks fun. I'd rather not have my favorite game changed significantly because of greedy people(gil sellers) and people who don't care about the effects their actions have on others(gil buyers).
4) This is a never ending RPG. There's no use in rushing to an end that doesn't exist. People 'want want want' 'now now now'. That's what CRPG's are for. They're quick, and can be played however the player wants. I go slow and make superpowerful characters. other play for 2 days straight and beat it and get bored of it.

In one of the papers in StarvingArtist's link, the author stats that there are different types of players. Developers need to provide a way to satisfy them all (He actully came up with 4 categories. read it to find out more.). He also stated that developers need to start developing games that the people with lack of time can play, or at least provide ways in which they can still enjoy the game (SE provides Gardening as one way.).

[kevinsal]

Wow, you guys are whiners...

The person who buys gil does what? HE BUYS something. Therefore the gil is back into the economy.

Say you buy 100k gil from a IGE store, You then buy some bad ass armor. Now your gil goes to the Armor seller.

So the gil passed through you, but you paid $40 for it. Dont you see its the gil buyer who is wasting his own money, when he can go hunt for a couple hours and get it for free.

You are paying a bad ass lvl 75 or whatever to make this gil for you. He is killing the monster in game, and handing you the gil, that you buy something with...

You non-gil buyers should be lucky you arent dishing out $100s. But in no way shape or form does it hurt anyone else..

IT IS THE SAME AS A HIGH LEVEL FRIEND DONATING YOU 100k GIL.

Except you are paying for it...

EDIT: In my opinion it helps the economy of the game, because these IGE slaves are punchin out enemies for gil left and right and throwing gil back into the economy.

Tell me this , if one of these IGE employees went clean and gave his gil away for free would you take it? Hell yeah you would....

[Deodorant]

Obviously you haven't bothered reading the entire thread, so arguing with you would just be a waste of time to those of us who have.

Personal opinion #1: Buying gil in small-moderate amounts may perhaps be a logical choice for the gil-buyer.

Personal opinion #2: $3000 for crimson finger is illogical no matter what the circumstance. Hell, in my home country if you flipped burgers 40 hours a week, you'd have to work 1 year and 2 months to get $3000 ... And I'm fairly sure there are many countries with even weaker economies ...

[kevinsal]

What are you talking about $3000 for a Crimson what?! lol Anyone who spends that much on a virtual item should be

/emote slapped!

Yes I did read everyone's post and that was my opinion...

[LawDawg]

cursed item that costs millions of gil... I dont think its 3000 though... IGE sells 2 million for 500 ... that would mean its 12 million gil? (Maybe on your server... i think only aristocrats cloack is worth 12 million)

[Jonnyram]

He paid 10 million gil, so yes, that's about $3000.

[Cloud 03]

I didnt read this whole thread but i personally think that it is stupid to buy gil with real money but on the other hand i think it is a very smart and good decision to sell some of that hard earned gil for real money if you stop playing the game for some reason. People say. "well its pretend money so theres no point of spending real money on it" but there are people who do spend money on it so if you are quiting the game and have lets say a million gil what would be "stupid" about getting 1000$ to take out of the game. Now that is not pretend money and instead of throwing all that away why not take the thousand dollars. If you have the chance to do this and decide to waste the gil when you could easily get some real money out of the deal then you are probly really stupid or are just a great person who doesnt do anything wrong.


(im not saying that i have sold or baught gil just giving my 2 cents)

Also, if you are a really high end player have millions of gil and an extremely high crafting lvl making gill is not going to be hard for you at all say u can come u with 2 million a week easily (this is after years of hardcore playing) pretty soon you are going to have everything you wnat in game and you will still have a great ability to make larg amounts of gil fast. 2 million gil can be sold for about 2 thousand dollars if you can make that in a week easily then you have a 2 thousand dollar bonus paycheck per week for having fun in a "pretend" game world. I know a lot of us out there could use that money badlly and i think that if you have that ability to make that kind of money then i would say you are extremely stupid if you throw away that opertunity. You people say so much about how this is a pretend world with pretend things, if you are making more money per week off it than most proffesional full time workers make then y would you throw away an opertunity to make REAL money to protect a "fake econonmy made out of a bunch of 0's and 1's"

[kevinsal]

Originally posted by Jonnyram
He paid 10 million gil, so yes, that's about $3000.

Who in the world.... $3,000 could buy you a brand new 50" Samsung DLP Monitor....

That guy needs to get his head checked.

Will the value of the item go up at least?

[Trell]

Originally posted by kevinsal
Who in the world.... $3,000 could buy you a brand new 50" Samsung DLP Monitor....

That guy needs to get his head checked.

Will the value of the item go up at least?

That's pocket change for a lot of people.

Average Joe's idea of what 3000$ is worth != Joe Millionnaire's idea of what 3000$ is worth.

If someone is willing to spend 3000$ on Gil, I would think that that person probably already has something a lot better than a 50" Samsung DLP Monitor.