Is it to late?

[Murphie]

Re: Is it to late?

Most things aren't done in a six man party now anyway. But there is some truth to what you say.

However, for a lot of people, FFXI and MMOs in general are nothing new. They don't need hours of practice to learn to do something in the game.

Also, and I may get flak for this, but if you gave me two options - one new player who took 3 months to reach cap, and one new player who flew to cap and spent the rest of that 3 months doing endgame? I'd want the latter in my group, not the former.

[Yygdrasil]

Re: Is it to late?

I have to agree (partly) with Murph and (partly) with Takelli on this one. Yes, the work and the grind exists (as it always has) to unlock further content. This is the premise behind the Limit break quests. You break the cap so..... you can do more things.... you level up so you can participate in CoP at higher levels... to unlock Sea.... you Level up and grind skills to participate in ZM so you can access Sky. Murph is 100% correct.

Tak... and the others who argue that Time Spent = Satisfaction over Pride in Accomplishments... are on the right track... I just think they're arguing their point a little... incorrectly.

The time you spend achieving a goal is not what ultimately measures your satisfaction upon completion. When I look back on the time spent camping Shikigami Weapon for my YinYang Robe, it's not the actual time that I reflect back on. I remember all the people and the funny/frustrating/angry times had with them while we camped for the NM. I remember the convorsations we had and the jokes we shared. Sure, I can measure the same event in time... but only to say "Dude... can you believe it took me 3 weeks to get that damn robe?".

Don't get me wrong, I don't want it HANDED to me. I enjoy the struggle and the grind and the thought that goes into leveling. If I didn't... I wouldn't play Final Fantasy games.

Some people might feel cheated because of the new "easy mode"... but the people who exploit the system can't be looked at as winning or losing. They're getting to the cap fast, sure... but they have no idea how to play the job as well as someone who spent the better part of 5... 6... 7... or 8 years mastering it. They also lose out on all those experiences that most of us enjoyed as we had to work for every point of xp we got.

Ultimately... like I said... you can't measure your experiences in the game in time... or else... those people who can claim 6+ years of time logged in have obviously enjoyed the game way more than someone like me... at a mere 300 days of logged in time.

If you want to measure it in time, fine. By that standard, my MULE has a right to be pissed off at AceHikura because it has been playing for longer.

[Murphie]

Re: Is it to late?

I'm not sure how much I agree with the "doesn't know how to play their job" part, but I'll agree that the loss of time spent with others is unfortunate.

And in many cases, of course, entirely fortunate. Because fuck a lot of the assholes who I've partied with over the years.

[Yygdrasil]

Re: Is it to late?

I'm not sure how much I agree with the "doesn't know how to play their job" part, but I'll agree that the loss of time spent with others is unfortunate..

How about if I rephrased it "Are statistically less likely to know how to play their job when compared to _________"?

---------- Post added at 02:48 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:45 PM ----------

fuck a lot of the assholes I've partied with over the years.

[Murphie]

Re: Is it to late?

sigh.

[Yygdrasil]

Re: Is it to late?

I barely got to play with you in game as it is, murph... but damn it's sad knowing you're not playing for a month.

[Takelli]

Re: Is it to late?

Wrong. It took time. And you only felt accomplishment for taking a long time to do it if you value your accomplishments by how long they take, and not the difficulty involved in them.

Yes, but you also had to learn how to play your class, and learn how to gear and such. The reason why I felt it was an accomplishment was because I had gotten half way to the cap. No other game was that fun to get to the point of where I was at, or anything. I had never reached half way to the level cap of any other MMO (F2P, or P2P), with out getting bored. Every other MMO out now does the same to me. I get bored half way to cap then quit.

If YOU felt a sense of accomplishment from taking a long time to achieve 37, then good for you. I understand that you feel leveling should take longer, and if that's the case, were you still playing, you could choose not to partake in super fast exp parties. In fact, anyone who feels so, is free to go and do things slowly. But it doesn't mean that you need or even should cast aspersions about the faster style, or those who choose to use it.

I know I could have taken the longer route to level up. I did with my other jobs, but I never really did have as much fun because no one wanted to party to do it the old way as soon as abby came out.

---------- Post added at 04:04 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:01 PM ----------

Tak... and the others who argue that Time Spent = Satisfaction over Pride in Accomplishments... are on the right track... I just think they're arguing their point a little... incorrectly.

The time you spend achieving a goal is not what ultimately measures your satisfaction upon completion. When I look back on the time spent camping Shikigami Weapon for my YinYang Robe, it's not the actual time that I reflect back on. I remember all the people and the funny/frustrating/angry times had with them while we camped for the NM. I remember the convorsations we had and the jokes we shared. Sure, I can measure the same event in time... but only to say "Dude... can you believe it took me 3 weeks to get that damn robe?".

That was part of the point I was trying to make. I ENJOYED the time I spent doing the things I did. Had fun, had lots of laughs, struggles, stress, and fun. I remember doing stuff with my linkshell and having a blast taking a long time to do it cause we always joked, even when we wiped, and loosing a few levels... haha

[Murphie]

Re: Is it to late?

What you're not understanding is that what is fun for you isn't fun for others and that's ok.

[Yygdrasil]

Re: Is it to late?

What Murph said. Also... calm down.

[Armando]

Re: Is it to late?

Also, and I may get flak for this, but if you gave me two options - one new player who took 3 months to reach cap, and one new player who flew to cap and spent the rest of that 3 months doing endgame? I'd want the latter in my group, not the former.

This is true, but kind of comparing apples to oranges. Seniority always wins when it comes to blindly picking people. But the question relevant to my point is, which would you say is better prepared for endgame?
1) A player that partied all the way to the cap pre-Abyssea.
2) A player that reached the cap in 1 month now by soloing to 30 and then leeching.

I think the leeching part is what really kills it. I don't have a problem with turbo EXP. I would argue that's what the game should be like in the first place - main reason it isn't is because the devs want to stretch our playtime to compensate for being unable to create new content fast enough. You're right, most people don't really need to party for 300 hours to learn their job. But they would still benefit from partying 1-2 hours after every major new spell or ability, to learn when and how to use it. If you leech all the way to the top I imagine you suddenly find yourself with a bunch of new abilities you haven't really experimented with. The same person would probably have no clue how to equip himself or interpret stats either.

Had fun, had lots of laughs, struggles, stress, and fun. I remember doing stuff with my linkshell and having a blast taking a long time to do it cause we always joked, even when we wiped, and loosing a few levels... haha

CoP is one the most memorable things I've ever done in FFXI, and I'll never forget all the hurdles me and my linkshell jumped through to make it to the end. But you know what? It was still badly designed and took too long to do. If they had the kept the zone caps but instead drastically reduced the timesinks involved, I'd still have fond memories but would waste much less time. Your point doesn't hold water because wasting more time on something doesn't always result in social behavior. I blew hours camping Leaping Lizzie alone and what did I get out of it? Even if I had gotten the boots, I didn't spend time with anyone or make fond memories. Instead I just hate Gustaberg, and I wouldn't feel very accomplished just for having masochistic levels of patience.

[AceHikura]

Re: Is it to late?

This is true, but kind of comparing apples to oranges. Seniority always wins when it comes to blindly picking people. But the question relevant to my point is, which would you say is better prepared for endgame?
1) A player that partied all the way to the cap pre-Abyssea.
2) A player that reached the cap in 1 month now by soloing to 30 and then leeching.

I think the leeching part is what really kills it. I don't have a problem with turbo EXP. I would argue that's what the game should be like in the first place - main reason it isn't is because the devs want to stretch our playtime to compensate for being unable to create new content fast enough. You're right, most people don't really need to party for 300 hours to learn their job. But they would still benefit from partying 1-2 hours after every major new spell or ability, to learn when and how to use it. If you leech all the way to the top I imagine you suddenly find yourself with a bunch of new abilities you haven't really experimented with. The same person would probably have no clue how to equip himself or interpret stats either.CoP is one the most memorable things I've ever done in FFXI, and I'll never forget all the hurdles me and my linkshell jumped through to make it to the end. But you know what? It was still badly designed and took too long to do. If they had the kept the zone caps but instead drastically reduced the timesinks involved, I'd still have fond memories but would waste much less time. Your point doesn't hold water because wasting more time on something doesn't always result in social behavior. I blew hours camping Leaping Lizzie alone and what did I get out of it? Even if I had gotten the boots, I didn't spend time with anyone or make fond memories. Instead I just hate Gustaberg, and I wouldn't feel very accomplished just for having masochistic levels of patience.

i dont want to leech if at all possible

[Yygdrasil]

Re: Is it to late?

i dont want to leech if at all possible

Can we keep this one? Can we? Can we? I promise I won't forget to feed it like the last one!

[AceHikura]

Re: Is it to late?

Can we keep this one? Can we? Can we? I promise I won't forget to feed it like the last one!

yes please dont forget to feed me i require 5 meals of day and an unlimited supply of ramen

[Yygdrasil]

Re: Is it to late?

i require 5 meals of day

I have no idea how to prepare one of those... much less 5.

an unlimited supply of ramen

I have about $3.87 in my pocket. So I think we're good for the next month at least.

[AceHikura]

Re: Is it to late?

I have no idea how to prepare one of those... much less 5.



I have about $3.87 in my pocket. So I think we're good for the next month at least.

haha yes!!! :D yummy ramens!!